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Why the Ford Pinto didn’t suck

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suckThe Ford Pinto was born a low-rent, stumpy thing in Dearborn 40 years ago and grew to become one of the most infamous cars in history. The thing is that it didn't actually suck. Really.

Even after four decades, what's the first thing that comes to mind when most people think of the Ford Pinto? Ka-BLAM! The truth is the Pinto was more than that — and this is the story of how the exploding Pinto became a pre-apocalyptic narrative, how the myth was exposed, and why you should race one.

The Pinto was CEO Lee Iacocca's baby, a homegrown answer to the threat of compact-sized economy cars from Japan and Germany, the sales of which had grown significantly throughout the 1960s. Iacocca demanded the Pinto cost under $2,000, and weigh under 2,000 pounds. It was an all-hands-on-deck project, and Ford got it done in 25 months from concept to production.

Building its own small car meant Ford's buyers wouldn't have to hew to the Japanese government's size-tamping regulations; Ford would have the freedom to choose its own exterior dimensions and engine sizes based on market needs (as did Chevy with the Vega and AMC with the Gremlin). And people cold dug it.

When it was unveiled in late 1970 (ominously on September 11), US buyers noted the Pinto's pleasant shape — bringing to mind a certain tailless amphibian — and interior layout hinting at a hipster's sunken living room. Some call it one of the ugliest cars ever made, but like fans of Mischa Barton, Pinto lovers care not what others think. With its strong Kent OHV four (a distant cousin of the Lotus TwinCam), the Pinto could at least keep up with its peers, despite its drum brakes and as long as one looked past its Russian-roulette build quality.

But what of the elephant in the Pinto's room? Yes, the whole blowing-up-on-rear-end-impact thing. It all started a little more than a year after the Pinto's arrival.

 

Grimshaw v. Ford Motor Company

On May 28, 1972, Mrs. Lilly Gray and 13-year-old passenger Richard Grimshaw, set out from Anaheim, California toward Barstow in Gray's six-month-old Ford Pinto. Gray had been having trouble with the car since new, returning it to the dealer several times for stalling. After stopping in San Bernardino for gasoline, Gray got back on I-15 and accelerated to around 65 mph. Approaching traffic congestion, she moved from the left lane to the middle lane, where the car suddenly stalled and came to a stop. A 1962 Ford Galaxie, the driver unable to stop or swerve in time, rear-ended the Pinto. The Pinto's gas tank was driven forward, and punctured on the bolts of the differential housing.

As the rear wheel well sections separated from the floor pan, a full tank of fuel sprayed straight into the passenger compartment, which was engulfed in flames. Gray later died from congestive heart failure, a direct result of being nearly incinerated, while Grimshaw was burned severely and left permanently disfigured. Grimshaw and the Gray family sued Ford Motor Company (among others), and after a six-month jury trial, verdicts were returned against Ford Motor Company. Ford did not contest amount of compensatory damages awarded to Grimshaw and the Gray family, and a jury awarded the plaintiffs $125 million, which the judge in the case subsequently reduced to the low seven figures. Other crashes and other lawsuits followed.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Mother Jones and Pinto Madness

In 1977, Mark Dowie, business manager of Mother Jones magazine published an article on the Pinto's "exploding gas tanks." It's the same article in which we first heard the chilling phrase, "How much does Ford think your life is worth?" Dowie had spent days sorting through filing cabinets at the Department of Transportation, examining paperwork Ford had produced as part of a lobbying effort to defeat a federal rear-end collision standard. That's where Dowie uncovered an innocuous-looking memo entitled "Fatalities Associated with Crash-Induced Fuel Leakage and Fires."

The Car Talk blog describes why the memo proved so damning.

In it, Ford's director of auto safety estimated that equipping the Pinto with [an] $11 part would prevent 180 burn deaths, 180 serious burn injuries and 2,100 burned cars, for a total cost of $137 million. Paying out $200,000 per death, $67,000 per injury and $700 per vehicle would cost only $49.15 million.

The government would, in 1978, demand Ford recall the million or so Pintos on the road to deal with the potential for gas-tank punctures. That "smoking gun" memo would become a symbol for corporate callousness and indifference to human life, haunting Ford (and other automakers) for decades. But despite the memo's cold calculations, was Ford characterized fairly as the Kevorkian of automakers?

Perhaps not. In 1991, A Rutgers Law Journal report [PDF] showed the total number of Pinto fires, out of 2 million cars and 10 years of production, stalled at 27. It was no more than any other vehicle, averaged out, and certainly not the thousand or more suggested by Mother Jones.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

The big rebuttal, and vindication?

But what of the so-called "smoking gun" memo Dowie had unearthed? Surely Ford, and Lee Iacocca himself, were part of a ruthless establishment who didn't care if its customers lived or died, right? Well, not really. Remember that the memo was a lobbying document whose audience was intended to be the NHTSA. The memo didn't refer to Pintos, or even Ford products, specifically, but American cars in general. It also considered rollovers not rear-end collisions. And that chilling assignment of value to a human life? Indeed, it was federal regulators who often considered that startling concept in their own deliberations. The value figure used in Ford's memo was the same one regulators had themselves set forth.

In fact, measured by occupant fatalities per million cars in use during 1975 and 1976, the Pinto's safety record compared favorably to other subcompacts like the AMC Gremlin, Chevy Vega, Toyota Corolla and VW Beetle.

And what of Mother Jones' Dowie? As the Car Talk blog points out, Dowie now calls the Pinto, "a fabulous vehicle that got great gas mileage," if not for that one flaw: The legendary "$11 part."

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Pinto Racing Doesn't Suck

Back in 1974, Car and Driver magazine created a Pinto for racing, an exercise to prove brains and common sense were more important than an unlimited budget and superstar power. As Patrick Bedard wrote in the March, 1975 issue of Car and Driver, "It's a great car to drive, this Pinto," referring to the racer the magazine prepared for the Goodrich Radial Challenge, an IMSA-sanctioned road racing series for small sedans.

Why'd they pick a Pinto over, say, a BMW 2002 or AMC Gremlin? Current owner of the prepped Pinto, Fox Motorsports says it was a matter of comparing the car's frontal area, weight, piston displacement, handling, wheel width, and horsepower to other cars of the day that would meet the entry criteria. (Racers like Jerry Walsh had by then already been fielding Pintos in IMSA's "Baby Grand" class.)

Bedard, along with Ron Nash and company procured a 30,000-mile 1972 Pinto two-door to transform. In addition to safety, chassis and differential mods, the team traded a 200-pound IMSA weight penalty for the power gain of Ford's 2.3-liter engine, which Bedard said "tipped the scales" in the Pinto's favor. But according to Bedard, it sounds like the real advantage was in the turns, thanks to some add-ons from Mssrs. Koni and Bilstein.

"The Pinto's advantage was cornering ability," Bedard wrote. "I don't think there was another car in the B. F. Goodrich series that was quicker through the turns on a dry track. The steering is light and quick, and the suspension is direct and predictable in a way that street cars never can be. It never darts over bumps, the axle is perfectly controlled and the suspension doesn't bottom."

Need more proof of the Pinto's lack of suck? Check out the SCCA Washington, DC region's spec-Pinto series.

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My Somewhat Begrudging Apology To Ford Pinto

ford-pinto.jpg

I never thought I’d offer an apology to the Ford Pinto, but I guess I owe it one.

I had a Pinto in the 1970s. Actually, my wife bought it a few months before we got married. The car became sort of a wedding dowry. So did the remaining 80% of the outstanding auto loan.

During a relatively brief ownership, the Pinto’s repair costs exceeded the original price of the car. It wasn’t a question of if it would fail, but when. And where. Sometimes, it simply wouldn’t start in the driveway. Other times, it would conk out at a busy intersection.

It ranks as the worst car I ever had. That was back when some auto makers made quality something like Job 100, certainly not Job 1.

Despite my bad Pinto experience, I suppose an apology is in order because of a recent blog I wrote. It centered on Toyota’s sudden-acceleration problems. But in discussing those, I invoked the memory of exploding Pintos, perpetuating an inaccuracy.

The widespread allegation was that, due to a design flaw, Pinto fuel tanks could readily blow up in rear-end collisions, setting the car and its occupants afire.

People started calling the Pinto “the barbecue that seats four.” And the lawsuits spread like wild fire.

Responding to my blog, a Ford (“I would very much prefer to keep my name out of print”) manager contacted me to set the record straight.

He says exploding Pintos were a myth that an investigation debunked nearly 20 years ago. He cites Gary Schwartz’ 1991 Rutgers Law Review paper that cut through the wild claims and examined what really happened.

Schwartz methodically determined the actual number of Pinto rear-end explosion deaths was not in the thousands, as commonly thought, but 27.

In 1975-76, the Pinto averaged 310 fatalities a year. But the similar-size Toyota Corolla averaged 313, the VW Beetle 374 and the Datsun 1200/210 came in at 405.

Yes, there were cases such as a Pinto exploding while parked on the shoulder of the road and hit from behind by a speeding pickup truck. But fiery rear-end collisions comprised only 0.6% of all fatalities back then, and the Pinto had a lower death rate in that category than the average compact or subcompact, Schwartz said after crunching the numbers. Nor was there anything about the Pinto’s rear-end design that made it particularly unsafe.

Not content to portray the Pinto as an incendiary device, ABC’s 20/20 decided to really heat things up in a 1978 broadcast containing “startling new developments.” ABC breathlessly reported that, not just Pintos, but fullsize Fords could blow up if hit from behind.

20/20 thereupon aired a video, shot by UCLA researchers, showing a Ford sedan getting rear-ended and bursting into flames. A couple of problems with that video:

One, it was shot 10 years earlier.

Two, the UCLA researchers had openly said in a published report that they intentionally rigged the vehicle with an explosive.

That’s because the test was to determine how a crash fire affected the car’s interior, not to show how easily Fords became fire balls. They said they had to use an accelerant because crash blazes on their own are so rare. They had tried to induce a vehicle fire in a crash without using an igniter, but failed.

ABC failed to mention any of that when correspondent Sylvia Chase reported on “Ford’s secret rear-end crash tests.”

We could forgive ABC for that botched reporting job. After all, it was 32 years ago. But a few weeks ago, ABC, in another one of its rigged auto exposes, showed video of a Toyota apparently accelerating on its own.

Turns out, the “runaway” vehicle had help from an associate professor. He built a gizmo with an on-off switch to provide acceleration on demand. Well, at least ABC didn’t show the Toyota slamming into a wall and bursting into flames.

In my blog, I also mentioned that Ford’s woes got worse in the 1970s with the supposed uncovering of an internal memo by a Ford attorney who allegedly calculated it would cost less to pay off wrongful-death suits than to redesign the Pinto.

It became known as the “Ford Pinto memo,” a smoking gun. But Schwartz looked into that, too. He reported the memo did not pertain to Pintos or any Ford products. Instead, it had to do with American vehicles in general.

It dealt with rollovers, not rear-end crashes. It did not address tort liability at all, let alone advocate it as a cheaper alternative to a redesign. It put a value to human life because federal regulators themselves did so.

The memo was meant for regulators’ eyes only. But it was off to the races after Mother Jones magazine got a hold of a copy and reported what wasn’t the case.

The exploding-Pinto myth lives on, largely because more Americans watch 20/20 than read the Rutgers Law Review. One wonders what people will recollect in 2040 about Toyota’s sudden accelerations, which more and more look like driver error and, in some cases, driver shams.

So I guess I owe the Pinto an apology. But it’s half-hearted, because my Pinto gave me much grief, even though, as the Ford manager notes, “it was a cheap car, built long ago and lots of things have changed, almost all for the better.”

Here goes: If I said anything that offended you, Pinto, I’m sorry. And thanks for not blowing up on me.

New project... 1980 Runabout

Started by r4pinto, June 18, 2012, 09:56:55 PM

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r4pinto

Ok gotcha. Hopefully after I replace those two gaskets (EGR and carb to intake) the car will run better.


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Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

Pintosopher

It might be an issue if the lack of its presence allows a air leak beneath the Choke plates... as an example:  a bypass when the chokes need to restrict the air to the venturis in the carb throats
Yes, it is possible to study and become a master of Pintosophy.. Not a religion , nothing less than a life quest for non conformity and rational thought. What Horse did you ride in on?

Check my Pinto Poems out...

r4pinto

That's it. Couldn't recall the name. Is it possible that not being there is causing an issue?


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Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

Pintosopher

It appears to be the switching bowl vent. This vents the fuel bowl fumes to the Canister with the engine off, and when your start the car the fumes are routed to the Air cleaner. Another way to stop fuel vapor from evaporating to the outside air in emissions speak.
Yes, it is possible to study and become a master of Pintosophy.. Not a religion , nothing less than a life quest for non conformity and rational thought. What Horse did you ride in on?

Check my Pinto Poems out...

r4pinto

Well that solenoid did come on the car but not currently there. The one I am talking to is a solenoid on the top front of the carburetor held on with three screws in the area of the fuel filter. The 1980 carburetor had it, the frankencarb on the car did not. I say frankencarb because the top plate is from the 77 and the body from a 76. The 77 ran good with the carb. The top that was on the 76 carb had a leaky plug on the end so I swapped tops.


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Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

Pintosopher

Does the car have wiring for the Solenoid ? A single wire connector spade? You may have the dreaded Idle solenoid plunger application. It's supposed to open the Butterflies ever so slightly when the key is turned on to start the car and hold the curb idle while the plunger is extended. This whole deal was to allow the butterflies to close completely when the key was turned off, thereby stopping the potential for Run on (Dieseling) .
Yes, it is possible to study and become a master of Pintosophy.. Not a religion , nothing less than a life quest for non conformity and rational thought. What Horse did you ride in on?

Check my Pinto Poems out...

r4pinto

At least the overfill is sometimes I don't do. I learned that with my 2015 Sonic that I owned  lol. The original gas cap was on the car and was of a similar style to the new one I got. Before I put the new cap it would take much more to start the car so I know the cap had something to do with that. I am going to pull the carburetor off the car today and also try to connect some of the vacuum lines, including some that I think were the charcoal cannister using pics of one I saw at the Pinto vs Maverick car show. I needed a diagram and that car gave it to me. Now, there is a funky solenoid on top of the old carburetor that I cannot connect since it is not present on the current one. Could that have something to do with it?


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Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

Pintosopher

Both of my Late model references show the 1980 using a Pressure/Vacuum gas cap. Not a sealed non vented unit. It appears the tank will stabilize the container with the cap. The fresh air for the canister is drawn in through the canister top. The fuel separator and expansion valve is in the top of the tank. The one hard line (not fuel line) for the fuel vapor is the hose at the canister to the frame. The other "duct " goes to the air cleaner housing from the canister. BTW, if the canister is OLD, rebuilding it may be possible if you can separate the lid from the base. Using a new Activated charcoal granule pack for fish tank water filters is the right stuff. It comes in different size chunks, so match it up at the local Pet store.
And Never overfill ( Let the pump nozzle do its job ) the tank at fill up or you'll have to do this all over again ;D
Let us know what you find out..
  Pintosopher, riding a goat trail to the ranch, stepping aside the Road Apples :o
Yes, it is possible to study and become a master of Pintosophy.. Not a religion , nothing less than a life quest for non conformity and rational thought. What Horse did you ride in on?

Check my Pinto Poems out...

Pintosopher

I'll need to look into how the Pinto allows air into the tank to avoid collapsing the tank, but in the case of my CIS K jetronic GTI, the tank has to have a non vented cap in order to hold pressure to prime the electric fuel pump. Later , the Golf used a in tank pump and the External pump to send fuel to the  fuel injection distributor. This was to avoid vapor lock in the Lines and the Evap was changed to have electrically controlled  purge valves in the system to avoid the pre OBD 1 systems showing a pressure drop in the evap if the cap was left loose, or missing.
In summary, There must be a way for fresh air to enter, but not leave the tank ( Except as fumes) so the canister system can do it's job. If it isn't hooked up correctly, you have potential for an air leak while running if the Purge valve hangs up. The mixture settings of the Carb are recalibrated to allow for the intake of addition fuel vapor from the canister. To unhook or incorrectly connect the lines is the way to frustration or Operation that is Pre Smog  control in nature.
It's just me venting Again ;D
Pintosopher , a Burp and emitted gas fume from enlightenment
Yes, it is possible to study and become a master of Pintosophy.. Not a religion , nothing less than a life quest for non conformity and rational thought. What Horse did you ride in on?

Check my Pinto Poems out...

r4pinto

So the new cap now retains pressure on the system which is causing a possible evap system issue? Possibly because it is not hooked up like a 1980 but a 1977 that didn't have similar emissions?


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Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

Pintosopher

Matt,
I'll throw another variable in the mix. If you received a benefit from the new cap, There's a evap issue in the mix. The retention of tank vapor to allow the Charcoal canister to work properly is dependent on many factors. Any ethanol mixed fuel compounds the canister purge function as the Phase separation will soak the matrix in the canister if the fuel is allowed to sit for any length of time beyond a week. If your canister has experienced "breakout" then the fumes will be obvious near the front of the vehicle. The Purge valve is a connection to the Intake from the canister and it can fail to function, creating many start and drivability issues. ( My 84 VW GTI  with non electronic CIS injection drives me nuts on this with Cal RFG fuels, and the canisters have to be rebuilt to keep the vapors to a minimum).
Also another influencing factor could be Leaks at the Crankcase venting to PCV or even the Oil filler cap. It all must be vapor tight to limit influence on the Mixture when hot or cold starts are an issue.
These are the ones that give you gray hair, or just hair loss like me :P

Pintosopher,  A horse with no Shame ;)
Yes, it is possible to study and become a master of Pintosophy.. Not a religion , nothing less than a life quest for non conformity and rational thought. What Horse did you ride in on?

Check my Pinto Poems out...

r4pinto

I put on a new gas cap and the car somewhat starts better. Not completely, but a little bit. I am going to pull the carburetor off the car to replace the EGR gasket, and carburetor to intake gasket to see if that helps. The choke works but fast idle does not. Since the car sat for so long, as did the carb I will tear the carb apart to see if there is any rust in the bowl since later in the week it had slight issues going, especially when the engine is not up to temp.
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

dga57

I know what you mean, Matt.  The lack of air conditioning is the main deterrent to me driving my Pinto during the summer months!


Dwayne :)
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

r4pinto

Thanks.


I got to mow the lawn, and then go to the store so I will be able to tell if the noise was a lifter that is leaking down when I start the car up. With me wanting to buy a new car in April I need to keep the miles off the Malibu to help its value some, so the Pinto is my daily driver. Good thing the temps aren't as humid, so no a/c doesn't seem as bad as it did in August.
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

dga57

Now THAT sounds like a day well spent!!!  Congratulations on smoothing her ou!


Dwayne :)
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

r4pinto

Just got done test driving the car. I tell you what... This engine has not run so smooth for a long, long time. At first the engine had more noise than before, but I bought the lifters and followers in June 2012 for the car's original engine. They had some slight corrosion, and the rollers weren't as smooth as I thought they should have been. After I drove the car for a while it smoothed right out. They were loud when I first started the car but quieted up after driving.


An additional benefit... No more misfire. Now the cam did have slight pitting on the lobes of the #1 cylinder but for now it'll be OK. I will worry about it eventually but not now.


Cost of repairs at this time is $0, so if I need to replace the cam at a later date then so be it.
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

r4pinto

Me too. Although right now I'm more concerned with the lifter noise. I'm missing a car show I desperately wanted to go to but wasn't sure with that top end rattle. Slight misfire and rattle tells me it was a lifter. Could hear the noise coming from the valve cover.


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Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

dga57

A gas cap can make a world of difference!  In 2004 we bought a brand new Jaguar which was to be my wife's car.  We'd had it about a month when she called me one day and said something was wrong with the car - it had gone into a "limp home" mode and was just barely driveable.  She got home with it and I placed a call to the service department of the dealership (about 100 miles from us).  The service manager suggested checking the gas cap to be sure it was not cross-threaded.  I had already checked that but checked it again anyway - all good there.  Ultimately, they had Jaguar Roadside Assistance come pick up the car on a roll-back and deliver it to the dealership for repair.  It turns out that the gas cap seal was actually defective so, although it was installed correctly, it still was not sealing well and triggered the problem.  A new gas cap fixed the issue and they delivered the car back home to me the next morning.  I hope a new gas cap works for your situation too.


Dwayne :)
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

r4pinto

Well I'd like to say no news is good news on the car, but not the case. I got the speedometer fixed, and picked up a spare cluster just in case. My Malibu has some gremlins so I am parking it to save miles, and drive the Pinto.


Rained last week rather hard and the wipers worked, although a bit jerky. May replace the blades to see if that helps. The hatch also leaks when water sits on the car so I am keeping a towel in the car. At the moment it sits in the garage with the valve cover off. The car developed a top end tick that would come and go. The engine was rebuilt with new bearings in 2008, and no metal in the oil so I am pulling the lifters and followers to see if that will fix the problem. The cam is a Ranger roller and followers which I installed in the head in 2007 before I did a bottom end rebuild. The head is a lower mileage head off a Ford Courier, so unless the cam bearings decided to fail all is good there. It was immaculate in 2007 when I installed the head on the engine. Had to replace the head due to shot cam bearings on the original head on the motor when it had 123k miles.


I have cleaned up the followers, and lifters, and are currently pre-oiling them by soaking them in clean engine oil.


As for the coolant leak a new thermostat gasket fixed the problem. The car still leaks a little oil but that will be fixed in due time with a new oil pan gasket. It leaks about a quart every 1000 or so miles. The choke  or fast doesn't work and the carburetor has been adjusted according to the factory Ford books so it's a grin and bear it situation. A new gas cap will hopefully help it start better since the old one is no longer holding pressure on the fuel system. I noticed the car starts great when warm but takes more to start when cold. The engine and carburetor started much better when in the 77. The difference? Newer gas cap on the 77.
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

dga57

Glad to know you're still plugging away at it!


Dwayne :)
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

r4pinto

Going to get a T-stat gasket for the car. When I installed the motor I had to replace the T-stat and housing. I glued the gasket to the housing but did not use any RTV on the head. It leaks a little when off but fine when running.
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

r4pinto

Cheap gaskets. $2 for the carb gasket and $2 for the egr gasket. When I have it off I will also inspect the valve which was NOS when installed on the engine in 2006


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Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

r4pinto

I know the carburetor itself sat for about four years with no intention of using but the 1980 carburetor had other ideas when it wouldn't work at all


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Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

Pintosopher

Yes, it is possible to study and become a master of Pintosophy.. Not a religion , nothing less than a life quest for non conformity and rational thought. What Horse did you ride in on?

Check my Pinto Poems out...

r4pinto

Hmmm just a thought.... could a bad egr plate to intake gasket be the cause or bad egr to plate gasket?


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Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

Pintosopher

Quote from: r4pinto on August 26, 2017, 09:04:47 AM
Not at all. I might look underneath and see if the stabilizer bar is causing some of the noise since the links are broken, but I might not since I got to get replacement links. The car has a full tank of gas and runs like crap when cold. The fast idle is there but barely, and it idles like crap when cold. Can't seem to find any answer on here so I won't worry about it and eventually replace the carburetor.
Matt, Check the EGR system for leaks or being frozen open. Nothing you do to the carb will help below the Carb butterflies when it's cold if too much air is getting to the intake manifold. Just a thought, My old 74 2.3L had a cracked EGR housing and nothing would help after a thorough rebuild until that was fixed.

Pintosopher, memories retained, but venting intelligence in a tech laden world ;)
Yes, it is possible to study and become a master of Pintosophy.. Not a religion , nothing less than a life quest for non conformity and rational thought. What Horse did you ride in on?

Check my Pinto Poems out...

r4pinto

Not at all. I might look underneath and see if the stabilizer bar is causing some of the noise since the links are broken, but I might not since I got to get replacement links. The car has a full tank of gas and runs like crap when cold. The fast idle is there but barely, and it idles like crap when cold. Can't seem to find any answer on here so I won't worry about it and eventually replace the carburetor.
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

dga57

Are you planning to spend the weekend working on the car?


Dwayne :)
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

r4pinto

Haven't done much to the car since coming back from the four car shows. I did pull the speedometer and sprayed some silicone spray on the speedometer assembly. Seems to have helped. I'm not completely sure it's fixed so I located a spare cluster for the car. I also got a replacement bracket that goes from the top to the bottom of the radiator core support. It's been painted and will be installed later on. I found out there were multiple bolts that held it to the car, but when I stopped at the gym outside Cleveland I heard knocking from the front end when you hit the brakes. It was the bracket hitting the bumper. It hit the bumper because only one bolt was left. I don't know where the other went but the replacement bracket came with bolts.
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

r4pinto

It was a blast. And one more Maverick to the Pintos. Good show to take the car to although it needs work to be fully reliable. It starts like crap when cold and the choke is set right. I did find an 80 Bobcat that had the vacuum line set up I needed pics of so I can get them rerouted correctly.


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Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress