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Why the Ford Pinto didn’t suck

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suckThe Ford Pinto was born a low-rent, stumpy thing in Dearborn 40 years ago and grew to become one of the most infamous cars in history. The thing is that it didn't actually suck. Really.

Even after four decades, what's the first thing that comes to mind when most people think of the Ford Pinto? Ka-BLAM! The truth is the Pinto was more than that — and this is the story of how the exploding Pinto became a pre-apocalyptic narrative, how the myth was exposed, and why you should race one.

The Pinto was CEO Lee Iacocca's baby, a homegrown answer to the threat of compact-sized economy cars from Japan and Germany, the sales of which had grown significantly throughout the 1960s. Iacocca demanded the Pinto cost under $2,000, and weigh under 2,000 pounds. It was an all-hands-on-deck project, and Ford got it done in 25 months from concept to production.

Building its own small car meant Ford's buyers wouldn't have to hew to the Japanese government's size-tamping regulations; Ford would have the freedom to choose its own exterior dimensions and engine sizes based on market needs (as did Chevy with the Vega and AMC with the Gremlin). And people cold dug it.

When it was unveiled in late 1970 (ominously on September 11), US buyers noted the Pinto's pleasant shape — bringing to mind a certain tailless amphibian — and interior layout hinting at a hipster's sunken living room. Some call it one of the ugliest cars ever made, but like fans of Mischa Barton, Pinto lovers care not what others think. With its strong Kent OHV four (a distant cousin of the Lotus TwinCam), the Pinto could at least keep up with its peers, despite its drum brakes and as long as one looked past its Russian-roulette build quality.

But what of the elephant in the Pinto's room? Yes, the whole blowing-up-on-rear-end-impact thing. It all started a little more than a year after the Pinto's arrival.

 

Grimshaw v. Ford Motor Company

On May 28, 1972, Mrs. Lilly Gray and 13-year-old passenger Richard Grimshaw, set out from Anaheim, California toward Barstow in Gray's six-month-old Ford Pinto. Gray had been having trouble with the car since new, returning it to the dealer several times for stalling. After stopping in San Bernardino for gasoline, Gray got back on I-15 and accelerated to around 65 mph. Approaching traffic congestion, she moved from the left lane to the middle lane, where the car suddenly stalled and came to a stop. A 1962 Ford Galaxie, the driver unable to stop or swerve in time, rear-ended the Pinto. The Pinto's gas tank was driven forward, and punctured on the bolts of the differential housing.

As the rear wheel well sections separated from the floor pan, a full tank of fuel sprayed straight into the passenger compartment, which was engulfed in flames. Gray later died from congestive heart failure, a direct result of being nearly incinerated, while Grimshaw was burned severely and left permanently disfigured. Grimshaw and the Gray family sued Ford Motor Company (among others), and after a six-month jury trial, verdicts were returned against Ford Motor Company. Ford did not contest amount of compensatory damages awarded to Grimshaw and the Gray family, and a jury awarded the plaintiffs $125 million, which the judge in the case subsequently reduced to the low seven figures. Other crashes and other lawsuits followed.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Mother Jones and Pinto Madness

In 1977, Mark Dowie, business manager of Mother Jones magazine published an article on the Pinto's "exploding gas tanks." It's the same article in which we first heard the chilling phrase, "How much does Ford think your life is worth?" Dowie had spent days sorting through filing cabinets at the Department of Transportation, examining paperwork Ford had produced as part of a lobbying effort to defeat a federal rear-end collision standard. That's where Dowie uncovered an innocuous-looking memo entitled "Fatalities Associated with Crash-Induced Fuel Leakage and Fires."

The Car Talk blog describes why the memo proved so damning.

In it, Ford's director of auto safety estimated that equipping the Pinto with [an] $11 part would prevent 180 burn deaths, 180 serious burn injuries and 2,100 burned cars, for a total cost of $137 million. Paying out $200,000 per death, $67,000 per injury and $700 per vehicle would cost only $49.15 million.

The government would, in 1978, demand Ford recall the million or so Pintos on the road to deal with the potential for gas-tank punctures. That "smoking gun" memo would become a symbol for corporate callousness and indifference to human life, haunting Ford (and other automakers) for decades. But despite the memo's cold calculations, was Ford characterized fairly as the Kevorkian of automakers?

Perhaps not. In 1991, A Rutgers Law Journal report [PDF] showed the total number of Pinto fires, out of 2 million cars and 10 years of production, stalled at 27. It was no more than any other vehicle, averaged out, and certainly not the thousand or more suggested by Mother Jones.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

The big rebuttal, and vindication?

But what of the so-called "smoking gun" memo Dowie had unearthed? Surely Ford, and Lee Iacocca himself, were part of a ruthless establishment who didn't care if its customers lived or died, right? Well, not really. Remember that the memo was a lobbying document whose audience was intended to be the NHTSA. The memo didn't refer to Pintos, or even Ford products, specifically, but American cars in general. It also considered rollovers not rear-end collisions. And that chilling assignment of value to a human life? Indeed, it was federal regulators who often considered that startling concept in their own deliberations. The value figure used in Ford's memo was the same one regulators had themselves set forth.

In fact, measured by occupant fatalities per million cars in use during 1975 and 1976, the Pinto's safety record compared favorably to other subcompacts like the AMC Gremlin, Chevy Vega, Toyota Corolla and VW Beetle.

And what of Mother Jones' Dowie? As the Car Talk blog points out, Dowie now calls the Pinto, "a fabulous vehicle that got great gas mileage," if not for that one flaw: The legendary "$11 part."

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Pinto Racing Doesn't Suck

Back in 1974, Car and Driver magazine created a Pinto for racing, an exercise to prove brains and common sense were more important than an unlimited budget and superstar power. As Patrick Bedard wrote in the March, 1975 issue of Car and Driver, "It's a great car to drive, this Pinto," referring to the racer the magazine prepared for the Goodrich Radial Challenge, an IMSA-sanctioned road racing series for small sedans.

Why'd they pick a Pinto over, say, a BMW 2002 or AMC Gremlin? Current owner of the prepped Pinto, Fox Motorsports says it was a matter of comparing the car's frontal area, weight, piston displacement, handling, wheel width, and horsepower to other cars of the day that would meet the entry criteria. (Racers like Jerry Walsh had by then already been fielding Pintos in IMSA's "Baby Grand" class.)

Bedard, along with Ron Nash and company procured a 30,000-mile 1972 Pinto two-door to transform. In addition to safety, chassis and differential mods, the team traded a 200-pound IMSA weight penalty for the power gain of Ford's 2.3-liter engine, which Bedard said "tipped the scales" in the Pinto's favor. But according to Bedard, it sounds like the real advantage was in the turns, thanks to some add-ons from Mssrs. Koni and Bilstein.

"The Pinto's advantage was cornering ability," Bedard wrote. "I don't think there was another car in the B. F. Goodrich series that was quicker through the turns on a dry track. The steering is light and quick, and the suspension is direct and predictable in a way that street cars never can be. It never darts over bumps, the axle is perfectly controlled and the suspension doesn't bottom."

Need more proof of the Pinto's lack of suck? Check out the SCCA Washington, DC region's spec-Pinto series.

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My Somewhat Begrudging Apology To Ford Pinto

ford-pinto.jpg

I never thought I’d offer an apology to the Ford Pinto, but I guess I owe it one.

I had a Pinto in the 1970s. Actually, my wife bought it a few months before we got married. The car became sort of a wedding dowry. So did the remaining 80% of the outstanding auto loan.

During a relatively brief ownership, the Pinto’s repair costs exceeded the original price of the car. It wasn’t a question of if it would fail, but when. And where. Sometimes, it simply wouldn’t start in the driveway. Other times, it would conk out at a busy intersection.

It ranks as the worst car I ever had. That was back when some auto makers made quality something like Job 100, certainly not Job 1.

Despite my bad Pinto experience, I suppose an apology is in order because of a recent blog I wrote. It centered on Toyota’s sudden-acceleration problems. But in discussing those, I invoked the memory of exploding Pintos, perpetuating an inaccuracy.

The widespread allegation was that, due to a design flaw, Pinto fuel tanks could readily blow up in rear-end collisions, setting the car and its occupants afire.

People started calling the Pinto “the barbecue that seats four.” And the lawsuits spread like wild fire.

Responding to my blog, a Ford (“I would very much prefer to keep my name out of print”) manager contacted me to set the record straight.

He says exploding Pintos were a myth that an investigation debunked nearly 20 years ago. He cites Gary Schwartz’ 1991 Rutgers Law Review paper that cut through the wild claims and examined what really happened.

Schwartz methodically determined the actual number of Pinto rear-end explosion deaths was not in the thousands, as commonly thought, but 27.

In 1975-76, the Pinto averaged 310 fatalities a year. But the similar-size Toyota Corolla averaged 313, the VW Beetle 374 and the Datsun 1200/210 came in at 405.

Yes, there were cases such as a Pinto exploding while parked on the shoulder of the road and hit from behind by a speeding pickup truck. But fiery rear-end collisions comprised only 0.6% of all fatalities back then, and the Pinto had a lower death rate in that category than the average compact or subcompact, Schwartz said after crunching the numbers. Nor was there anything about the Pinto’s rear-end design that made it particularly unsafe.

Not content to portray the Pinto as an incendiary device, ABC’s 20/20 decided to really heat things up in a 1978 broadcast containing “startling new developments.” ABC breathlessly reported that, not just Pintos, but fullsize Fords could blow up if hit from behind.

20/20 thereupon aired a video, shot by UCLA researchers, showing a Ford sedan getting rear-ended and bursting into flames. A couple of problems with that video:

One, it was shot 10 years earlier.

Two, the UCLA researchers had openly said in a published report that they intentionally rigged the vehicle with an explosive.

That’s because the test was to determine how a crash fire affected the car’s interior, not to show how easily Fords became fire balls. They said they had to use an accelerant because crash blazes on their own are so rare. They had tried to induce a vehicle fire in a crash without using an igniter, but failed.

ABC failed to mention any of that when correspondent Sylvia Chase reported on “Ford’s secret rear-end crash tests.”

We could forgive ABC for that botched reporting job. After all, it was 32 years ago. But a few weeks ago, ABC, in another one of its rigged auto exposes, showed video of a Toyota apparently accelerating on its own.

Turns out, the “runaway” vehicle had help from an associate professor. He built a gizmo with an on-off switch to provide acceleration on demand. Well, at least ABC didn’t show the Toyota slamming into a wall and bursting into flames.

In my blog, I also mentioned that Ford’s woes got worse in the 1970s with the supposed uncovering of an internal memo by a Ford attorney who allegedly calculated it would cost less to pay off wrongful-death suits than to redesign the Pinto.

It became known as the “Ford Pinto memo,” a smoking gun. But Schwartz looked into that, too. He reported the memo did not pertain to Pintos or any Ford products. Instead, it had to do with American vehicles in general.

It dealt with rollovers, not rear-end crashes. It did not address tort liability at all, let alone advocate it as a cheaper alternative to a redesign. It put a value to human life because federal regulators themselves did so.

The memo was meant for regulators’ eyes only. But it was off to the races after Mother Jones magazine got a hold of a copy and reported what wasn’t the case.

The exploding-Pinto myth lives on, largely because more Americans watch 20/20 than read the Rutgers Law Review. One wonders what people will recollect in 2040 about Toyota’s sudden accelerations, which more and more look like driver error and, in some cases, driver shams.

So I guess I owe the Pinto an apology. But it’s half-hearted, because my Pinto gave me much grief, even though, as the Ford manager notes, “it was a cheap car, built long ago and lots of things have changed, almost all for the better.”

Here goes: If I said anything that offended you, Pinto, I’m sorry. And thanks for not blowing up on me.

Well, just about to get started on my 79 hatchback-long

Started by russosborne, June 23, 2010, 04:44:42 PM

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russosborne

In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

phils toys

umm    i mean the 23  and again on the 28
thanks
2006, 07,08 ,10 Carlisle 3rd stock pinto 4 years same place
2007 PCCA East Regional Best Wagon
2008 CAHS Prom Coolest Ride
2011,2014 pinto stampede

russosborne

Dwayne,
I was expecting a lowball, but my wife wasn't, and it really shocked her. Worse was she almost accepted it thinking we had to have some money to move. After talking to her, I got her to realise that we can do this without any money from that, it just won't be as much fun. :-)
They offered 6K to cover my wife's medical expenses for the next 25 years. I did some quick math and showed my wife that $50K was a little more realistic, and that isn't even really covering the surgery she will have to have at some point. But it would cover her office visits and a wheelchair and scooter. Which she really needs. She can't even walk in Walmart anymore, it is hard for her to go from the car to the entrance.

So far they haven't even acknowledged getting her counter offer. Surprise surprise.

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

russosborne

Quote from: phils toys on November 18, 2010, 10:27:03 PM
russ i will be in macedonia/ twinsburgh on nov 16 how close is that to you so i can pick up the rest of the parts?
phil

Phil, that is about 10ish miles or so. But are you certain about the date, that date has passed already.
Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dga57

Russ,

Insurance companies ALWAYS try to low-ball you to start with.  I there's any way possible you all can hold out, refuse the initial offer and consult an attorney.  Sometimes that will send them scurrying to sweeten the deal!  Good luck!

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

phils toys

russ i will be in macedonia/ twinsburgh on nov 16 how close is that to you so i can pick up the rest of the parts?
phil
2006, 07,08 ,10 Carlisle 3rd stock pinto 4 years same place
2007 PCCA East Regional Best Wagon
2008 CAHS Prom Coolest Ride
2011,2014 pinto stampede

russosborne

In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

russosborne

real quick update.
House is looking good, still not sure but things are finally moving along. Won't be sure until after closing. :-)

Bad news is that the Pinto may not make the trip. I was going to rent a Uhaul truck and car trailer, but unless the insurance company is willing to greatly increase their offer(which my wife just got today and it was stupid low) we won't have the extra money for that. I am getting a decent bonus in Dec at work, but that may have to go to pay the moving company, because we just can't do that ourselves anymore.

Stay tuned, same bat time, same bat channel. Just not sure what bat day. :-)

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dga57

Try to think positive, Russ.  This deal has "success" written all over it!

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

russosborne

Thanks, Phil.
We are having movers move us, I can't do it anymore. I can't believe how much my body has gone down hill the last 2 years. :-( And I am actually taking better care of myself now. Seeing doctors, taking meds, etc. Even walking everyday. 3 dogs, no choice. :-)
But I may take you up on that offer with the garage stuff, I am going to be doing that myself. Gas and food will be provided of course. :-)
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

phils toys

congrat russ just let me know when and i will try to be there with a van and a trailer to help move
phil
2006, 07,08 ,10 Carlisle 3rd stock pinto 4 years same place
2007 PCCA East Regional Best Wagon
2008 CAHS Prom Coolest Ride
2011,2014 pinto stampede

russosborne

Well, the seller accepted our counter counter offer. :-)
Now the real stress starts. All I can think about are ways for the deal to fall apart. Hopefully we can be settled in before Christmas time. Looking like 45 days til closing, but not sure. Sooner would be better.
I am anxious to get started on organizing MY garage. :-) :-) :-)
Thanks,
Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

Fair 73

 That house listing is at least 80000 where I live in Illinois. Looks like a deal to me at full price. It is a nice set up for sure best of luck,

dga57

Heck, it looks like a perfectly nice house and I'm still reeling in disbelief at the price.  I know some areas of the country have been harder hit than others, but it's still hard to believe that house for that amount of money!  I hope it all works out okay - I just know it would be a good thing for both of you! 

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

russosborne

Well, you guys aren't living in northeast Ohio. Where jobs are really scarce.
There are lots of areas here that the prices are closer to Phoenix AZ. Even Akron is pretty expensive if you want in a decent neighborhood. Hence the move to Warren. Mansfield, which is the town we really would like to be in, is about double the price of Warren. In fact, the house we offered on is very similar to my grandfather's house that we stayed in when we first moved back here. It would go for close to $90K in Mansfield. And Mansfield has been hit harder with shutdowns and job losses than Akron.

And of course we didn't hear back today, but there were some really bad storms across the entire area, so that is understandable. Although a call saying that would have been nice.

Here's a link to the listing for the house. It is not a mansion by any means. But it will be good.
http://www.burganrealestate.com/listings/detail.php?lid=58254257&

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dga57

Quote from: 71hotrodpinto on October 26, 2010, 12:40:45 AM
Dang, wish i could get those kind of numbers out here in "liberalville". Hell im looking at 150, 200 for a stinking condo as a good deal ! Single fam homes around here go for at least 350+ still!!!

I agree with you... those prices are phenomenal!  Here, a small single family house can still be had for $125000 or thereabouts, but $45000 would get you nothing!  I'm jealous!

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

dga57

Quote from: russosborne on October 25, 2010, 10:00:21 PM
Update of sorts. The agent called back, the seller wants to sit down with her tomorrow evening and go over the numbers, but she is pretty sure he is going to agree.
It will make my wife happy, which is the most important thing.
Russ

Sounds good... I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you!

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

71hotrodpinto

Dang, wish i could get those kind of numbers out here in "liberalville". Hell im looking at 150, 200 for a stinking condo as a good deal ! Single fam homes around here go for at least 350+ still!!!


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russosborne

Update of sorts. The agent called back, the seller wants to sit down with her tomorrow evening and go over the numbers, but she is pretty sure he is going to agree.
It will make my wife happy, which is the most important thing.
Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

russosborne

Thanks.
He countered with raising the selling price to 45.5K($2000 increase over our over, $500 over asking price) to cover him paying the closing costs.
I said nope. We offered original asking price with him paying 4% for closing(which is the max he can per the VA it turns out). Waiting to here back.
Checked the house out on Zillow.com, turns out it has been for sale for well over a year, and with 4 different agencies. So not looking good. Found out also he (seller) is 80. I am getting set to consider other houses.

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dga57

Quote from: russosborne on October 25, 2010, 02:19:56 AM
Thanks.
I think the seller doesn't understand that the market is so down. Especially around here. Hopefully he will see the light. I wouldn't mind a different house if it comes to that, but my wife loves this one. It was the one she walked in and the angels started singing etc. :-)

Russ

It is a foolish seller who would, in this economy, reject an offer within $1500 of his asking price.  You never know, though.  When we bought our house in 1997, we made an offer that was more than $5000 below the asking price.  We made the offer at approximately 2:00 p.m. and they accepted it by 6:00 p.m.!  They were, to say the least, motivated!  lol  They had run into problems with the neighbors because of having sixteen dogs and were basically being "run out of town on a rail", so to speak.  They had found a house outside of a subdivision and they were ready to move on it, but needed to sell this one first.  It made for a win-win situation.  Hope your home purchase works out just as well!

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

russosborne

Thanks.
I think the seller doesn't understand that the market is so down. Especially around here. Hopefully he will see the light. I wouldn't mind a different house if it comes to that, but my wife loves this one. It was the one she walked in and the angels started singing etc. :-)

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dga57

Sounds good.  If I had it all to do over again, I would have gone with a single story house.  Ever since Gloria had her stroke, the stairs have been more and more of an issue but we really don't want to sell now, the economy being what it is.  I hope it will all work out for you! 

Keeping my fingers crossed for you!
Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

russosborne

Well, another update.

No word yet from the insurance company other than "maybe by the end of this week".

The good news is we made an offer on a house in southeast Warren. It wasn't on my search list, but the agent showed it to us, and of course this was the one my wife wanted. It is a decent place. Brick, one story no attic. Fireplace, not sure if it is usable or not yet. Basement partially finished. Which will be my domain, my wife does NOT like basements. 2 bedroom one bath. We are going to have to downsize quite a bit.
2 car garage. Going to be tight in there. Currently in a 2.5 car garage. The new one might be deeper than the current, not sure. It didn't feel deeper, but I didn't have a tape measure.

Being on the s.e. side it will add a couple of miles to my commute, going to have to find a way to not go through lovely downtown Warren.

Haven't gotten an answer back yet on the offer. We offered 1500 less than the asking price, plus seller to pay closing. Been on the market a while and we are the first to make an offer, but it is an older person who has already dropped the price and isn't quite realising the new real estate reality. So who knows? We will go full asking price if we have to, only makes 8 dollars a month difference on the payment, but he will still have to do the closing costs. Hoped to hear back today, maybe tomorrow. My wife was wanting me to call the agent, she is a bit anxious. :-)

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

russosborne

Thanks, Phil.
Will have to see what is going on.
There still may be a whole (more or less) Pinto in your future.
Just what your wife would love, right? :-)
Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

russosborne

Thanks, Dwayne.
Things always look brightest before the storm. Or something like that. :-)
I just have to try not to get frustrated and junk the Pinto. I look at it and think there is no way I can get it running again. Having to convince myself it will be worth the cost to get it towed well over 50 miles. Maybe closer to 80 depending on where we end up at.

Maybe I should take it just a little more apart, so it would fit in my 95 Blazer suv. :-)

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dga57

Quote from: russosborne on October 18, 2010, 06:49:52 PM
We (I, technically, wife isn't on app) have been fully preapproved for a house loan. And my mother in law is going to give(sort of)(as far as the bank is concerned anyway) closing money if my wife's insurance settelment doesn't happen in time.  So now we can seriously start house hunting.

Russ,

Glad to hear things are looking up!  Keep us updated on the move!!!  We care!

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

phils toys

congrat on the "new  home" let me know when you have the peices gathered up so i can come and get them, maybe when it is time to  move i may be able to lend a hand as well i do have a traier not enclosed to haul larger items
phil
2006, 07,08 ,10 Carlisle 3rd stock pinto 4 years same place
2007 PCCA East Regional Best Wagon
2008 CAHS Prom Coolest Ride
2011,2014 pinto stampede

russosborne

Well, I was going to say nothing new, but actually there is. We (I, technically, wife isn't on app) have been fully preapproved for a house loan. And my mother in law is going to give(sort of)(as far as the bank is concerned anyway) closing money if my wife's insurance settelment doesn't happen in time.
So now we can seriously start house hunting. Have decided that since they approved us for more than I had anticipated, a 2 car garage is a minumum. So the Pinto should be staying with me. Poor Pinto.

Looking in the Youngstown/Warren area. we found a couple of really nice ones in northwest Warren, which would make my commute easy. But we have since found a house we both really like in youngstown, so am not sure yet. Going to try to get an agent to show us some houses this weekend. Although it seems that agents around here only work 9-5 and not weekends. At least the couple I have contacted seem to work that way. Maybe they don't need money and this is a hobby to them?

I tried to get the driver's door back on by myself. Note I said "tried". :-( The stupid things the door hinge bolts tighten into on the inside of the car are just sitting there, and they move and even fall out! Oh, well. Maybe I will just leave the car as is and take it to the new place in pieces.

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

Pinto5.0

They will try to settle for a couple thousand at best hoping you are desperate. I hate dealing with those issues, they always want to screw you.
'73 Sedan (I'll get to it)
'76 Wagon driver
'80 hatch(Restoring to be my son's 1st car)~Callisto
'71 half hatch (bucket list Pinto)~Ghost
'72 sedan 5.0/T5~Lemon Squeeze