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Why the Ford Pinto didn’t suck

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suckThe Ford Pinto was born a low-rent, stumpy thing in Dearborn 40 years ago and grew to become one of the most infamous cars in history. The thing is that it didn't actually suck. Really.

Even after four decades, what's the first thing that comes to mind when most people think of the Ford Pinto? Ka-BLAM! The truth is the Pinto was more than that — and this is the story of how the exploding Pinto became a pre-apocalyptic narrative, how the myth was exposed, and why you should race one.

The Pinto was CEO Lee Iacocca's baby, a homegrown answer to the threat of compact-sized economy cars from Japan and Germany, the sales of which had grown significantly throughout the 1960s. Iacocca demanded the Pinto cost under $2,000, and weigh under 2,000 pounds. It was an all-hands-on-deck project, and Ford got it done in 25 months from concept to production.

Building its own small car meant Ford's buyers wouldn't have to hew to the Japanese government's size-tamping regulations; Ford would have the freedom to choose its own exterior dimensions and engine sizes based on market needs (as did Chevy with the Vega and AMC with the Gremlin). And people cold dug it.

When it was unveiled in late 1970 (ominously on September 11), US buyers noted the Pinto's pleasant shape — bringing to mind a certain tailless amphibian — and interior layout hinting at a hipster's sunken living room. Some call it one of the ugliest cars ever made, but like fans of Mischa Barton, Pinto lovers care not what others think. With its strong Kent OHV four (a distant cousin of the Lotus TwinCam), the Pinto could at least keep up with its peers, despite its drum brakes and as long as one looked past its Russian-roulette build quality.

But what of the elephant in the Pinto's room? Yes, the whole blowing-up-on-rear-end-impact thing. It all started a little more than a year after the Pinto's arrival.

 

Grimshaw v. Ford Motor Company

On May 28, 1972, Mrs. Lilly Gray and 13-year-old passenger Richard Grimshaw, set out from Anaheim, California toward Barstow in Gray's six-month-old Ford Pinto. Gray had been having trouble with the car since new, returning it to the dealer several times for stalling. After stopping in San Bernardino for gasoline, Gray got back on I-15 and accelerated to around 65 mph. Approaching traffic congestion, she moved from the left lane to the middle lane, where the car suddenly stalled and came to a stop. A 1962 Ford Galaxie, the driver unable to stop or swerve in time, rear-ended the Pinto. The Pinto's gas tank was driven forward, and punctured on the bolts of the differential housing.

As the rear wheel well sections separated from the floor pan, a full tank of fuel sprayed straight into the passenger compartment, which was engulfed in flames. Gray later died from congestive heart failure, a direct result of being nearly incinerated, while Grimshaw was burned severely and left permanently disfigured. Grimshaw and the Gray family sued Ford Motor Company (among others), and after a six-month jury trial, verdicts were returned against Ford Motor Company. Ford did not contest amount of compensatory damages awarded to Grimshaw and the Gray family, and a jury awarded the plaintiffs $125 million, which the judge in the case subsequently reduced to the low seven figures. Other crashes and other lawsuits followed.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Mother Jones and Pinto Madness

In 1977, Mark Dowie, business manager of Mother Jones magazine published an article on the Pinto's "exploding gas tanks." It's the same article in which we first heard the chilling phrase, "How much does Ford think your life is worth?" Dowie had spent days sorting through filing cabinets at the Department of Transportation, examining paperwork Ford had produced as part of a lobbying effort to defeat a federal rear-end collision standard. That's where Dowie uncovered an innocuous-looking memo entitled "Fatalities Associated with Crash-Induced Fuel Leakage and Fires."

The Car Talk blog describes why the memo proved so damning.

In it, Ford's director of auto safety estimated that equipping the Pinto with [an] $11 part would prevent 180 burn deaths, 180 serious burn injuries and 2,100 burned cars, for a total cost of $137 million. Paying out $200,000 per death, $67,000 per injury and $700 per vehicle would cost only $49.15 million.

The government would, in 1978, demand Ford recall the million or so Pintos on the road to deal with the potential for gas-tank punctures. That "smoking gun" memo would become a symbol for corporate callousness and indifference to human life, haunting Ford (and other automakers) for decades. But despite the memo's cold calculations, was Ford characterized fairly as the Kevorkian of automakers?

Perhaps not. In 1991, A Rutgers Law Journal report [PDF] showed the total number of Pinto fires, out of 2 million cars and 10 years of production, stalled at 27. It was no more than any other vehicle, averaged out, and certainly not the thousand or more suggested by Mother Jones.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

The big rebuttal, and vindication?

But what of the so-called "smoking gun" memo Dowie had unearthed? Surely Ford, and Lee Iacocca himself, were part of a ruthless establishment who didn't care if its customers lived or died, right? Well, not really. Remember that the memo was a lobbying document whose audience was intended to be the NHTSA. The memo didn't refer to Pintos, or even Ford products, specifically, but American cars in general. It also considered rollovers not rear-end collisions. And that chilling assignment of value to a human life? Indeed, it was federal regulators who often considered that startling concept in their own deliberations. The value figure used in Ford's memo was the same one regulators had themselves set forth.

In fact, measured by occupant fatalities per million cars in use during 1975 and 1976, the Pinto's safety record compared favorably to other subcompacts like the AMC Gremlin, Chevy Vega, Toyota Corolla and VW Beetle.

And what of Mother Jones' Dowie? As the Car Talk blog points out, Dowie now calls the Pinto, "a fabulous vehicle that got great gas mileage," if not for that one flaw: The legendary "$11 part."

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Pinto Racing Doesn't Suck

Back in 1974, Car and Driver magazine created a Pinto for racing, an exercise to prove brains and common sense were more important than an unlimited budget and superstar power. As Patrick Bedard wrote in the March, 1975 issue of Car and Driver, "It's a great car to drive, this Pinto," referring to the racer the magazine prepared for the Goodrich Radial Challenge, an IMSA-sanctioned road racing series for small sedans.

Why'd they pick a Pinto over, say, a BMW 2002 or AMC Gremlin? Current owner of the prepped Pinto, Fox Motorsports says it was a matter of comparing the car's frontal area, weight, piston displacement, handling, wheel width, and horsepower to other cars of the day that would meet the entry criteria. (Racers like Jerry Walsh had by then already been fielding Pintos in IMSA's "Baby Grand" class.)

Bedard, along with Ron Nash and company procured a 30,000-mile 1972 Pinto two-door to transform. In addition to safety, chassis and differential mods, the team traded a 200-pound IMSA weight penalty for the power gain of Ford's 2.3-liter engine, which Bedard said "tipped the scales" in the Pinto's favor. But according to Bedard, it sounds like the real advantage was in the turns, thanks to some add-ons from Mssrs. Koni and Bilstein.

"The Pinto's advantage was cornering ability," Bedard wrote. "I don't think there was another car in the B. F. Goodrich series that was quicker through the turns on a dry track. The steering is light and quick, and the suspension is direct and predictable in a way that street cars never can be. It never darts over bumps, the axle is perfectly controlled and the suspension doesn't bottom."

Need more proof of the Pinto's lack of suck? Check out the SCCA Washington, DC region's spec-Pinto series.

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My Somewhat Begrudging Apology To Ford Pinto

ford-pinto.jpg

I never thought I’d offer an apology to the Ford Pinto, but I guess I owe it one.

I had a Pinto in the 1970s. Actually, my wife bought it a few months before we got married. The car became sort of a wedding dowry. So did the remaining 80% of the outstanding auto loan.

During a relatively brief ownership, the Pinto’s repair costs exceeded the original price of the car. It wasn’t a question of if it would fail, but when. And where. Sometimes, it simply wouldn’t start in the driveway. Other times, it would conk out at a busy intersection.

It ranks as the worst car I ever had. That was back when some auto makers made quality something like Job 100, certainly not Job 1.

Despite my bad Pinto experience, I suppose an apology is in order because of a recent blog I wrote. It centered on Toyota’s sudden-acceleration problems. But in discussing those, I invoked the memory of exploding Pintos, perpetuating an inaccuracy.

The widespread allegation was that, due to a design flaw, Pinto fuel tanks could readily blow up in rear-end collisions, setting the car and its occupants afire.

People started calling the Pinto “the barbecue that seats four.” And the lawsuits spread like wild fire.

Responding to my blog, a Ford (“I would very much prefer to keep my name out of print”) manager contacted me to set the record straight.

He says exploding Pintos were a myth that an investigation debunked nearly 20 years ago. He cites Gary Schwartz’ 1991 Rutgers Law Review paper that cut through the wild claims and examined what really happened.

Schwartz methodically determined the actual number of Pinto rear-end explosion deaths was not in the thousands, as commonly thought, but 27.

In 1975-76, the Pinto averaged 310 fatalities a year. But the similar-size Toyota Corolla averaged 313, the VW Beetle 374 and the Datsun 1200/210 came in at 405.

Yes, there were cases such as a Pinto exploding while parked on the shoulder of the road and hit from behind by a speeding pickup truck. But fiery rear-end collisions comprised only 0.6% of all fatalities back then, and the Pinto had a lower death rate in that category than the average compact or subcompact, Schwartz said after crunching the numbers. Nor was there anything about the Pinto’s rear-end design that made it particularly unsafe.

Not content to portray the Pinto as an incendiary device, ABC’s 20/20 decided to really heat things up in a 1978 broadcast containing “startling new developments.” ABC breathlessly reported that, not just Pintos, but fullsize Fords could blow up if hit from behind.

20/20 thereupon aired a video, shot by UCLA researchers, showing a Ford sedan getting rear-ended and bursting into flames. A couple of problems with that video:

One, it was shot 10 years earlier.

Two, the UCLA researchers had openly said in a published report that they intentionally rigged the vehicle with an explosive.

That’s because the test was to determine how a crash fire affected the car’s interior, not to show how easily Fords became fire balls. They said they had to use an accelerant because crash blazes on their own are so rare. They had tried to induce a vehicle fire in a crash without using an igniter, but failed.

ABC failed to mention any of that when correspondent Sylvia Chase reported on “Ford’s secret rear-end crash tests.”

We could forgive ABC for that botched reporting job. After all, it was 32 years ago. But a few weeks ago, ABC, in another one of its rigged auto exposes, showed video of a Toyota apparently accelerating on its own.

Turns out, the “runaway” vehicle had help from an associate professor. He built a gizmo with an on-off switch to provide acceleration on demand. Well, at least ABC didn’t show the Toyota slamming into a wall and bursting into flames.

In my blog, I also mentioned that Ford’s woes got worse in the 1970s with the supposed uncovering of an internal memo by a Ford attorney who allegedly calculated it would cost less to pay off wrongful-death suits than to redesign the Pinto.

It became known as the “Ford Pinto memo,” a smoking gun. But Schwartz looked into that, too. He reported the memo did not pertain to Pintos or any Ford products. Instead, it had to do with American vehicles in general.

It dealt with rollovers, not rear-end crashes. It did not address tort liability at all, let alone advocate it as a cheaper alternative to a redesign. It put a value to human life because federal regulators themselves did so.

The memo was meant for regulators’ eyes only. But it was off to the races after Mother Jones magazine got a hold of a copy and reported what wasn’t the case.

The exploding-Pinto myth lives on, largely because more Americans watch 20/20 than read the Rutgers Law Review. One wonders what people will recollect in 2040 about Toyota’s sudden accelerations, which more and more look like driver error and, in some cases, driver shams.

So I guess I owe the Pinto an apology. But it’s half-hearted, because my Pinto gave me much grief, even though, as the Ford manager notes, “it was a cheap car, built long ago and lots of things have changed, almost all for the better.”

Here goes: If I said anything that offended you, Pinto, I’m sorry. And thanks for not blowing up on me.

Well, just about to get started on my 79 hatchback-long

Started by russosborne, June 23, 2010, 04:44:42 PM

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dga57

I'll look forward to seeing you there, then!

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

russosborne

well, I will stick around until someone kicks me off for getting rid of the Pinto. :-)
I still really want to do a Pinchero. I have owned several Rancheros over the years, and the thought of having a Pinchero is really exciting. But who knows what will happen. I didn't expect for us to be able to buy a house anytime in my lifetime, and that is happening. So anything is possible.

Still looking forward to Carlisle this spring. I haven't gotten to any of the big shows since we have moved to Ohio, and I am tired of missing them. So I am going to this one no matter what.
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dga57

Russ,

It is kind of sad, but sometimes you just have to do what you have to do!  Hope you'll stick around here and keep us informed on the move, and settling into your new home!

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

russosborne

Well, got some big news.
No, not about the house. although we should be closing on the 28th.

I just got rid of the Pinto. I have been going back and forth on keeping it, and decided that I just didn't want to keep a car in the backyard at our new place. So I put an ad on Craig's List early this morning, and got almost one hundred replies. I just finished replying to all of them that it was gone.

I gave it away, put the ad in the FREE section. The guy may be showing up here since I gave him the info. Pretty sure he will be keeping it, not scrapping it. I didn't expect it to go this fast, or even at all. But he came with his brother and a car dolly and took it away. They still have to come back to get the rest of the bits and pieces and I have to get the title signed over.

Kind of sad, but honestly it is a big relief knowing that I don't have to deal with it in the middle of all this moving insanity.

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

75bobcatv6

For everything thing that is out of place where pieces have not fallen there is a place in time where those will align just right for you. Just have to be patient.

russosborne

I think I am going insaner than I already am. This house deal is going to kill me. Now the VA is involved in the appraisal issue, so hopefully they will get it straightened out. My guess is the appraiser who came in so low is going to get a good talking to if nothing worse. But we are still in limbo. Don't have a clue about when we will be closing.

My wife still hasn't gotten the paperwork she needs to sign for the settlement. It was supposed to be here Monday, found out today that it didn't get sent until yesterday, and they don't know how it got sent(postal, fedex, etc). grrrrrr.

Yes, I really do have a black cloud all my own. I know it could be much worse, but still I would like something to go the way it is supposed to once in a while.

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

russosborne

In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

phils toys

2006, 07,08 ,10 Carlisle 3rd stock pinto 4 years same place
2007 PCCA East Regional Best Wagon
2008 CAHS Prom Coolest Ride
2011,2014 pinto stampede

russosborne

As long as I don't have to spend a lot of money she is ok with it. I priced the galvanized roofing, and it should be well under $100.
Getting it ready to move is going to be fun. I haven't done anything with it thinking I wasn't going to be keeping it. I haven't done anything at all in the garage and I have a lot of stuff to sort and pack. And I still haven't gotten the Blazer ready to drive, and I really need it with all the snow.
I just don't have any energy, have been drained by the house deal.
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dga57

Sounds like a good time to run it past her! ;)

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

russosborne

I think Phil may have solved my problem. Now I need to talk the wife into letting me keep the Pinto and get the Lemans. This could be fun.
I did get her a Kindle for Christmas, and let her have it last night. Maybe she will be in a good mood. :-)
Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dga57

Things are sounding better and better!  Hang in there!!!

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

russosborne

Well, as far as the house goes, I am sure we are going to get it eventually. Hopefully before the end of the year, because I would hate to be homeless. We are challenging the appraisal. The seller isn't going to make any decisions until that is finished. I asked about hiring another appraiser, but found out that because it was done for the VA, this appraisal sticks with the house for 6 months, and the appraiser who did it is the only one who can change the amount.  We rescheduled our move date for the 23rd, hoping that will work. I already have that day off for the holidays, so that would be good.

Also, I came up with a possible way to keep the Pinto. I posted a question in the general Pinto section about it.

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dga57

Hang in there, Russ.  Buying a house is no walk in the park, even when everything goes right.  Banks are famous for always needing "one more" document or piece of information whenever there's a mortgage involved - it's just the way they do business.  Who hired this appraiser?  I've seen the photos of the house and I agree with the owner that he's giving it away at $45K.  $35K is an absolute insult, I don't care HOW depressed the housing market is there!  Might it be worthwhile to hire your own licensed appraiser?  In the meantime, I'll try sending good thoughts your way... not much help, I know... but it's the best I can do!

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

russosborne

Thanks.
Didn't hear back from the real estate agent if the appraisal killed the seller(he is in his 80's and told her he was giving the house away at the selling price we agreed to. 10K less is about a 22% reduction from that price).
I am getting really tired of the bank changing what they want from me all the time also. Always adding more conditions. Like they don't really want to give us the mortgage but aren't allowed to say no.
If it wasn't for my wife I would have just walked away already.But this is the house she really wants.
If we have to use a large part of her settlement money for the house, I don't know what I will be doing car wise. I wish I could keep the Pinto as well as get the Lemans, but having the Pinto sit outside on grass for who knows how many years would kill it. It would end up like the Mustang II I had, looks ok from above, but rusted away underneath. But I may end up with nothing. At least I have a bunch of video games I can always start playing again without spending any money.
Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dave1987

I'm really sorry this is turning into such a crazy deal for you Russ. :( I hope things start to look up and you get the deal you are looking for.
1978 Ford Pinto Sedan - Family owned since new

Remembering Jeff Fitcher with every drive in my 78 Sedan.

I am a Pinto Surgeon. Fixing problems and giving Pintos a chance to live again is more than a hobby, it's a passion!

russosborne

More good (NOT) news.
The deal just got blown up. The second appraisal came in at $35K, not the $45K sales price. The agent is going to talk to the seller, but in her words "he is going to pop a cork". We could come up with the extra money once my wife gets her insurance settlement, but we don't have any guarantee of when that will be. Plus that would kill all other spending, including the Pontiac.
What is worse is that we should have known all this 2 weeks ago if the bank hadn't screwed up.
Never ever use Huntington Bank for a mortgage loan.

I think I am going to be violently sick.

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dholvrsn

'80 MPG Pony, '80-'92
'79 porthole wagon, '06-on
'80 trunk model. '17-on
-----
'98 Dodge Ram 1500
'95 Buick Riviera
'63 Studebaker Champ
'57 Studebaker Silver Hawk
'51 Studebaker Commander Starlight
'47 Studebaker Champion
'41 Studebaker Commander Land Cruiser

russosborne

Thanks, Phil.
Getting to Carlisle won't be a problem.
If anyone wants the Pinto speak now or forever hold your peace. :-)
there is lots of rust, but nothing that couldn't be fixed. The front subframe of the car seems really solid as far as I can see. Just check out the pictures here for much more details.
If anyone wants the 4.6 mod motor and auto trans let me know. I would hate to scrap that, but no sense keeping it if I won't be using it.
Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

phils toys

if some one want s the car  please speek up, i do have some of the missing parts  you can have as well  other wise i will get what i can haul in my mini van and the res will go to scrap  :(   russ if you need a ride  to carlisle i have room  we will be taking the van and the bobcat  but we will be hangin out there for a few day after wards.  going to hershey, and gettysburgh.
phil.
2006, 07,08 ,10 Carlisle 3rd stock pinto 4 years same place
2007 PCCA East Regional Best Wagon
2008 CAHS Prom Coolest Ride
2011,2014 pinto stampede

75bobcatv6

The only one I knew of for sale down here on the board was my Fiancee's Bobcat. which we have decided to keep since I now have some time to put into fixing her up more.

russosborne

Thanks!
I don't know what I will end up with. All I know is that I don't want to settle anymore, I want something I want, not just something that is there.
If the Lemans is for sale when we have the money, I will see if I can talk him down some and my wife up some. :-) It really is worth what he is asking, if it isn't a total rust bucket underneath. And it is in driveable condition. But who knows? My main concern right now is still getting the house buying over with and get moved in. I have so much stress over that it isn't funny.

I could even end up with a Pinto down the road. I would say that after having this one, they are in my top 5 or 6 cars I want. Someone has one for sale in Phoenix on the board that I would love to have later on, but not at the moment. I need to get a big enough garage for the cars I have, much less the ones I want to have. :-)

And I am still hoping to make it to Carlisle in the spring.

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dga57

Opportunities are worthless if you don't seize them when they are available!  Go for it!  If that Pontiac is your heart's desire, then that's what you should have.  I do hope you'll hang around here, Pinto or no Pinto.  We consider you a friend!

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

russosborne

Thanks, Dwayne.

I have some more news. I am not going to be continuing with the Pinto. Decided I don't want to move it and have decided to get rid of it. I want to go a different route and my wife has ok'd it. I have asked Phil if he wants it, if not it will be up for grabs for about a week, then it will be scrapped. If Phil doesn't want it, the same deal will go to anyone else. Free, come and get it. It is rollable, but otherwise completely apart. Although there are some things already gone, including the wiring harness and dash. And some other stuff. Comes with the Mustang 4.6 Mod motor and all parts associated, if wanted. Whatever someone doesn't take will be scrapped. I am pretty sure that it won't be a Ford product. Really what it may be is to buy a 1970 Pontiac Lemans and make a GTO clone out of it. I used to have a real 70 GTO, and that is the car I most regret getting rid of. Even more than my 69 Mustang.

Yeah, I know. I just really have wanted something else all along, and I have a chance to do it now so I am going to take advantage of it while I can. Moving is giving me a great chance to start over. Maybe even get the garage ready BEFORE moving something else in.

Thanks,
Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dga57

Russ,
Glad to hear that the insurance company made a more acceptable offer!  That should help ease the strain a little.  Hope all goes well with your closing (they can be such a pain!).  Keep us informed! 
Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

russosborne

Well, another update. This one mostly great news.
The insurance company just made a compromise offer of 39K, that is close enough to us.
So I can definitely get the Pinto to the new home. And can relax a little about expenses. Maybe I can afford to get the brakes replaced on my Taurus now. And get the Blazer ready to use.

If there is a new home. Closing may get delayed thanks to the lousy service we have gotten from Huntington Bank's mortgage service in Youngstown Ohio. Yes, I am definitely NOT recommending them.

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

bobscat

Hope everything works out on the house, I learned just how irritating it can be trying to push all that stuff through, and timing is everything, when it comes to getting out of one place and getting into the next.  It can be a royal pain, but the end result is well worth it.  Tis far better to make a mortgage payment than renting and paying someone elses!! 


russosborne

Well, we just sent our landlord our 30 day notice, so the house had better work out. The bank screwed up again, they had it appraised by an FHA appraiser, but we are doing a VA loan, and this guy isn't on the VA list. So they are having another one done this coming Monday. GRRRRRR. We are due to close on the 10th, going to be cutting things close. Way too close for my nerves at this point.

Still hoping to be able to move the Pinto, but just don't know. If my Blazer had a tow hitch there wouldn't be an issue. I just am not sure if we will have the money. Without the insurance money as a back up we are really cutting things close as it is. Oh, well. que sera sera.

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

russosborne

Hey, was wondering if you were still around.
The Pinto was a daily driver (or at least had to be available as one) until this April or so. Got a 95 Blazer with 4wheel drive for winters, driving the Pinto in the snow was scary. So I decided to make it the project car instead of buying something else.
Going to be a long process, us moving has changed my priorities for now.

My wife had a broken ankle from a work related accident years ago, and it is getting really hard for her to get around anymore. Of course the insurance company from that is being a pain. Wouldn't even pay for the wheelchair the doctor prescribed, so we are doing without it for now. But things will work out. we are moving into a one story house, so that will be a big help for her.

Glad to hear from you, always wondered if you guys ever made it to Montana.  Do you still have the Bobcat, and have you done anything more with it?

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

bobscat

Hey Russ!  Greetings from Montana!  Glad to see that the old "Brown Bomber" is going to good use!  Pretty cool to see the car again after almost 3 years.  Glad to hear that you are getting a new house.  I just sort of skimmed over the thread, and didn't catch everything, but sounds like your wife is having sort of a tough time as of late.  Hang in there, everything will turn out as it should.