Mini Classifieds

Esslinger 2.0 intake
Date: 03/06/2017 11:58 am
instrument cluster,4sd trans crossmember,2.3 intake
Date: 08/26/2018 06:23 pm
t-5 2.3 trans and new flywheel cluch and pressure plate though out bearing for sale
Date: 09/09/2018 03:22 pm
2.0 performance parts, 2 intakes, header, ported head, more
Date: 10/25/2019 04:05 pm
Clutch Cable Needed
Date: 04/03/2017 10:54 pm
1980 Ford Pinto For Sale

Date: 07/01/2018 03:21 pm
1980 Pinto w/ Trunk
Date: 08/10/2022 04:09 pm
1976 Squire wagon

Date: 09/12/2018 10:30 pm
Oil pan front sump style
Date: 01/10/2017 09:19 am

Why the Ford Pinto didn’t suck

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suckThe Ford Pinto was born a low-rent, stumpy thing in Dearborn 40 years ago and grew to become one of the most infamous cars in history. The thing is that it didn't actually suck. Really.

Even after four decades, what's the first thing that comes to mind when most people think of the Ford Pinto? Ka-BLAM! The truth is the Pinto was more than that — and this is the story of how the exploding Pinto became a pre-apocalyptic narrative, how the myth was exposed, and why you should race one.

The Pinto was CEO Lee Iacocca's baby, a homegrown answer to the threat of compact-sized economy cars from Japan and Germany, the sales of which had grown significantly throughout the 1960s. Iacocca demanded the Pinto cost under $2,000, and weigh under 2,000 pounds. It was an all-hands-on-deck project, and Ford got it done in 25 months from concept to production.

Building its own small car meant Ford's buyers wouldn't have to hew to the Japanese government's size-tamping regulations; Ford would have the freedom to choose its own exterior dimensions and engine sizes based on market needs (as did Chevy with the Vega and AMC with the Gremlin). And people cold dug it.

When it was unveiled in late 1970 (ominously on September 11), US buyers noted the Pinto's pleasant shape — bringing to mind a certain tailless amphibian — and interior layout hinting at a hipster's sunken living room. Some call it one of the ugliest cars ever made, but like fans of Mischa Barton, Pinto lovers care not what others think. With its strong Kent OHV four (a distant cousin of the Lotus TwinCam), the Pinto could at least keep up with its peers, despite its drum brakes and as long as one looked past its Russian-roulette build quality.

But what of the elephant in the Pinto's room? Yes, the whole blowing-up-on-rear-end-impact thing. It all started a little more than a year after the Pinto's arrival.

 

Grimshaw v. Ford Motor Company

On May 28, 1972, Mrs. Lilly Gray and 13-year-old passenger Richard Grimshaw, set out from Anaheim, California toward Barstow in Gray's six-month-old Ford Pinto. Gray had been having trouble with the car since new, returning it to the dealer several times for stalling. After stopping in San Bernardino for gasoline, Gray got back on I-15 and accelerated to around 65 mph. Approaching traffic congestion, she moved from the left lane to the middle lane, where the car suddenly stalled and came to a stop. A 1962 Ford Galaxie, the driver unable to stop or swerve in time, rear-ended the Pinto. The Pinto's gas tank was driven forward, and punctured on the bolts of the differential housing.

As the rear wheel well sections separated from the floor pan, a full tank of fuel sprayed straight into the passenger compartment, which was engulfed in flames. Gray later died from congestive heart failure, a direct result of being nearly incinerated, while Grimshaw was burned severely and left permanently disfigured. Grimshaw and the Gray family sued Ford Motor Company (among others), and after a six-month jury trial, verdicts were returned against Ford Motor Company. Ford did not contest amount of compensatory damages awarded to Grimshaw and the Gray family, and a jury awarded the plaintiffs $125 million, which the judge in the case subsequently reduced to the low seven figures. Other crashes and other lawsuits followed.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Mother Jones and Pinto Madness

In 1977, Mark Dowie, business manager of Mother Jones magazine published an article on the Pinto's "exploding gas tanks." It's the same article in which we first heard the chilling phrase, "How much does Ford think your life is worth?" Dowie had spent days sorting through filing cabinets at the Department of Transportation, examining paperwork Ford had produced as part of a lobbying effort to defeat a federal rear-end collision standard. That's where Dowie uncovered an innocuous-looking memo entitled "Fatalities Associated with Crash-Induced Fuel Leakage and Fires."

The Car Talk blog describes why the memo proved so damning.

In it, Ford's director of auto safety estimated that equipping the Pinto with [an] $11 part would prevent 180 burn deaths, 180 serious burn injuries and 2,100 burned cars, for a total cost of $137 million. Paying out $200,000 per death, $67,000 per injury and $700 per vehicle would cost only $49.15 million.

The government would, in 1978, demand Ford recall the million or so Pintos on the road to deal with the potential for gas-tank punctures. That "smoking gun" memo would become a symbol for corporate callousness and indifference to human life, haunting Ford (and other automakers) for decades. But despite the memo's cold calculations, was Ford characterized fairly as the Kevorkian of automakers?

Perhaps not. In 1991, A Rutgers Law Journal report [PDF] showed the total number of Pinto fires, out of 2 million cars and 10 years of production, stalled at 27. It was no more than any other vehicle, averaged out, and certainly not the thousand or more suggested by Mother Jones.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

The big rebuttal, and vindication?

But what of the so-called "smoking gun" memo Dowie had unearthed? Surely Ford, and Lee Iacocca himself, were part of a ruthless establishment who didn't care if its customers lived or died, right? Well, not really. Remember that the memo was a lobbying document whose audience was intended to be the NHTSA. The memo didn't refer to Pintos, or even Ford products, specifically, but American cars in general. It also considered rollovers not rear-end collisions. And that chilling assignment of value to a human life? Indeed, it was federal regulators who often considered that startling concept in their own deliberations. The value figure used in Ford's memo was the same one regulators had themselves set forth.

In fact, measured by occupant fatalities per million cars in use during 1975 and 1976, the Pinto's safety record compared favorably to other subcompacts like the AMC Gremlin, Chevy Vega, Toyota Corolla and VW Beetle.

And what of Mother Jones' Dowie? As the Car Talk blog points out, Dowie now calls the Pinto, "a fabulous vehicle that got great gas mileage," if not for that one flaw: The legendary "$11 part."

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Pinto Racing Doesn't Suck

Back in 1974, Car and Driver magazine created a Pinto for racing, an exercise to prove brains and common sense were more important than an unlimited budget and superstar power. As Patrick Bedard wrote in the March, 1975 issue of Car and Driver, "It's a great car to drive, this Pinto," referring to the racer the magazine prepared for the Goodrich Radial Challenge, an IMSA-sanctioned road racing series for small sedans.

Why'd they pick a Pinto over, say, a BMW 2002 or AMC Gremlin? Current owner of the prepped Pinto, Fox Motorsports says it was a matter of comparing the car's frontal area, weight, piston displacement, handling, wheel width, and horsepower to other cars of the day that would meet the entry criteria. (Racers like Jerry Walsh had by then already been fielding Pintos in IMSA's "Baby Grand" class.)

Bedard, along with Ron Nash and company procured a 30,000-mile 1972 Pinto two-door to transform. In addition to safety, chassis and differential mods, the team traded a 200-pound IMSA weight penalty for the power gain of Ford's 2.3-liter engine, which Bedard said "tipped the scales" in the Pinto's favor. But according to Bedard, it sounds like the real advantage was in the turns, thanks to some add-ons from Mssrs. Koni and Bilstein.

"The Pinto's advantage was cornering ability," Bedard wrote. "I don't think there was another car in the B. F. Goodrich series that was quicker through the turns on a dry track. The steering is light and quick, and the suspension is direct and predictable in a way that street cars never can be. It never darts over bumps, the axle is perfectly controlled and the suspension doesn't bottom."

Need more proof of the Pinto's lack of suck? Check out the SCCA Washington, DC region's spec-Pinto series.

Members
Stats
  • Total Posts: 139,573
  • Total Topics: 16,267
  • Online today: 1,722
  • Online ever: 1,722 (Today at 02:19:48 AM)
Users Online
  • Users: 0
  • Guests: 533
  • Total: 533
F&I...more

My Somewhat Begrudging Apology To Ford Pinto

ford-pinto.jpg

I never thought I’d offer an apology to the Ford Pinto, but I guess I owe it one.

I had a Pinto in the 1970s. Actually, my wife bought it a few months before we got married. The car became sort of a wedding dowry. So did the remaining 80% of the outstanding auto loan.

During a relatively brief ownership, the Pinto’s repair costs exceeded the original price of the car. It wasn’t a question of if it would fail, but when. And where. Sometimes, it simply wouldn’t start in the driveway. Other times, it would conk out at a busy intersection.

It ranks as the worst car I ever had. That was back when some auto makers made quality something like Job 100, certainly not Job 1.

Despite my bad Pinto experience, I suppose an apology is in order because of a recent blog I wrote. It centered on Toyota’s sudden-acceleration problems. But in discussing those, I invoked the memory of exploding Pintos, perpetuating an inaccuracy.

The widespread allegation was that, due to a design flaw, Pinto fuel tanks could readily blow up in rear-end collisions, setting the car and its occupants afire.

People started calling the Pinto “the barbecue that seats four.” And the lawsuits spread like wild fire.

Responding to my blog, a Ford (“I would very much prefer to keep my name out of print”) manager contacted me to set the record straight.

He says exploding Pintos were a myth that an investigation debunked nearly 20 years ago. He cites Gary Schwartz’ 1991 Rutgers Law Review paper that cut through the wild claims and examined what really happened.

Schwartz methodically determined the actual number of Pinto rear-end explosion deaths was not in the thousands, as commonly thought, but 27.

In 1975-76, the Pinto averaged 310 fatalities a year. But the similar-size Toyota Corolla averaged 313, the VW Beetle 374 and the Datsun 1200/210 came in at 405.

Yes, there were cases such as a Pinto exploding while parked on the shoulder of the road and hit from behind by a speeding pickup truck. But fiery rear-end collisions comprised only 0.6% of all fatalities back then, and the Pinto had a lower death rate in that category than the average compact or subcompact, Schwartz said after crunching the numbers. Nor was there anything about the Pinto’s rear-end design that made it particularly unsafe.

Not content to portray the Pinto as an incendiary device, ABC’s 20/20 decided to really heat things up in a 1978 broadcast containing “startling new developments.” ABC breathlessly reported that, not just Pintos, but fullsize Fords could blow up if hit from behind.

20/20 thereupon aired a video, shot by UCLA researchers, showing a Ford sedan getting rear-ended and bursting into flames. A couple of problems with that video:

One, it was shot 10 years earlier.

Two, the UCLA researchers had openly said in a published report that they intentionally rigged the vehicle with an explosive.

That’s because the test was to determine how a crash fire affected the car’s interior, not to show how easily Fords became fire balls. They said they had to use an accelerant because crash blazes on their own are so rare. They had tried to induce a vehicle fire in a crash without using an igniter, but failed.

ABC failed to mention any of that when correspondent Sylvia Chase reported on “Ford’s secret rear-end crash tests.”

We could forgive ABC for that botched reporting job. After all, it was 32 years ago. But a few weeks ago, ABC, in another one of its rigged auto exposes, showed video of a Toyota apparently accelerating on its own.

Turns out, the “runaway” vehicle had help from an associate professor. He built a gizmo with an on-off switch to provide acceleration on demand. Well, at least ABC didn’t show the Toyota slamming into a wall and bursting into flames.

In my blog, I also mentioned that Ford’s woes got worse in the 1970s with the supposed uncovering of an internal memo by a Ford attorney who allegedly calculated it would cost less to pay off wrongful-death suits than to redesign the Pinto.

It became known as the “Ford Pinto memo,” a smoking gun. But Schwartz looked into that, too. He reported the memo did not pertain to Pintos or any Ford products. Instead, it had to do with American vehicles in general.

It dealt with rollovers, not rear-end crashes. It did not address tort liability at all, let alone advocate it as a cheaper alternative to a redesign. It put a value to human life because federal regulators themselves did so.

The memo was meant for regulators’ eyes only. But it was off to the races after Mother Jones magazine got a hold of a copy and reported what wasn’t the case.

The exploding-Pinto myth lives on, largely because more Americans watch 20/20 than read the Rutgers Law Review. One wonders what people will recollect in 2040 about Toyota’s sudden accelerations, which more and more look like driver error and, in some cases, driver shams.

So I guess I owe the Pinto an apology. But it’s half-hearted, because my Pinto gave me much grief, even though, as the Ford manager notes, “it was a cheap car, built long ago and lots of things have changed, almost all for the better.”

Here goes: If I said anything that offended you, Pinto, I’m sorry. And thanks for not blowing up on me.

Well, just about to get started on my 79 hatchback-long

Started by russosborne, June 23, 2010, 04:44:42 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

dga57

Quote from: russosborne on July 25, 2010, 11:17:46 PM
Well, you never know. In a few years these could be the new Mustangs as far as collectors go.
Or not. :-)

And the less you ask those types the better, in my opinion. Why give them reasons to look closer.

On another note, I got the engine and trans out of the Blazer tonight. What a pain. ended up having to have my wife drive the Blazer forward while I held on to the hoist. Didn't break anything, but came real close. I didn't have the engine hoist chain on the right places, and when it was free of the Blazer the engine rotated and almost hit the driveway on the top. But finally got it back right side up and in the garage and safely on the ground.

Boy is this thing huge! This is going to be interesting.

Russ

Sounds like you have your work cut out for you! :surprised:

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

russosborne

Well, you never know. In a few years these could be the new Mustangs as far as collectors go.
Or not. :-)

And the less you ask those types the better, in my opinion. Why give them reasons to look closer.

On another note, I got the engine and trans out of the Blazer tonight. What a pain. ended up having to have my wife drive the Blazer forward while I held on to the hoist. Didn't break anything, but came real close. I didn't have the engine hoist chain on the right places, and when it was free of the Blazer the engine rotated and almost hit the driveway on the top. But finally got it back right side up and in the garage and safely on the ground.

Boy is this thing huge! This is going to be interesting.

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

r4pinto

I agree with Dwayne. Your car isn't a Ford Mustang that was junked, & you are just making sure the VIN stays with the car. If you are in doubt you may want to check with your local BMV or police dept. They might be able to give you some info as to what to do..

Just a though.
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

dga57

Nothing you've described doing should be considered VIN tampering.  What you are doing is making sure the right VIN stays with the right car.  Shouldn't be an issue.

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

russosborne


Something else dash related, I need to figure out how to include the vin from the Pinto dash into the new setup. I was thinking about cutting off the part of the dash that goes along the windshield, and using the Pinto piece there. Another minor detail. I really don't want to be arrested for vin tampering. :-)
Which reminds me, I need to keep the upper part of the fender aprons that have the vin stamped. What I am thinking about doing is cutting the aprons out from the frame rail up to about 3 inches from the top. I have some either 1.5 or 2 inch angle steel that I would run underneath the top for reinforcement, and I was thinking about folding the extra apron that is left around the bottom of it, making it smooth from inside the engine compartment.
Not the best way to go, would rather do something like a 12 point roll cage, but that ain't happening, plus you lose the vin's that way. I seriously doubt if I would ever sell this car, but you never know for sure what the future may bring. Plus, this is affordable and different.

Russ
Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

russosborne

I have to keep coming up with things I can do for free, like playing with installing the tank. I really would rather work on the engine install, but just the front sump oil pan is several hundred dollars. So that won't be happening any time soon.
Fitting the dash is something else that should be essentially free. I can buy bolts and nuts type stuff, just not expensive things.

Once I get the dash to fit (if I can do that) then I can start working on the wiring, which is fun for me. having the complete Mustang wiring harness, as well as the Pinto and the Mustang II harness will give me lots of ways to do things.

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dga57

Quote from: russosborne on July 25, 2010, 12:54:55 AM
It is all from a 1996 Mustang GT convertible. Not that the convertible part matters as far as I know. :-)
That dash weighs a ton! I could barely get it out of the back seat of the Taurus by myself. It looks like it is several inches deeper than the stock dash, which may make this really difficult. I will have to get it somehow mocked up in the car and try sitting and getting in and out to see if there is enough room. And the console has the emergency brake hand lever on the passenger side, instead of in the middle. And that is one thing I didn't get, the Mustang ebrake stuff. But moving the Pinto one shouldn't be that hard, if that is how I go.

It would definitely be unique, if nothing else. But I am going for more than just that. If if looks cobbled together I won't do it. Hoping that I can make it look like something that Ford could have done.

Who knows? I will be doing good if I can get this car back together again in any configuration.

And how is this for an idea? The Mustang gas tank has a largish bump on the top on one side. I was thinking about cutting the spare tire well out and flipping it over and re-installing it, so the gas tank bump would just fit inside that. If I went with a fuel cell, I would have to do some modifying anyway, and I kind of prefer using the factory tank. There are tons of stuff available from new tanks, senders, to even covers (the factory one has a cover even) for them. Shoot, another thing I didn't get was the tank straps. But those are available cheap as well.

Russ

A friend of mine has a '96 Mustang Cobra SVT convertible.  That dash in your Pinto will be awesome!  I hope it works!

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

russosborne

It is all from a 1996 Mustang GT convertible. Not that the convertible part matters as far as I know. :-)
That dash weighs a ton! I could barely get it out of the back seat of the Taurus by myself. It looks like it is several inches deeper than the stock dash, which may make this really difficult. I will have to get it somehow mocked up in the car and try sitting and getting in and out to see if there is enough room. And the console has the emergency brake hand lever on the passenger side, instead of in the middle. And that is one thing I didn't get, the Mustang ebrake stuff. But moving the Pinto one shouldn't be that hard, if that is how I go.

It would definitely be unique, if nothing else. But I am going for more than just that. If if looks cobbled together I won't do it. Hoping that I can make it look like something that Ford could have done.

Who knows? I will be doing good if I can get this car back together again in any configuration.

And how is this for an idea? The Mustang gas tank has a largish bump on the top on one side. I was thinking about cutting the spare tire well out and flipping it over and re-installing it, so the gas tank bump would just fit inside that. If I went with a fuel cell, I would have to do some modifying anyway, and I kind of prefer using the factory tank. There are tons of stuff available from new tanks, senders, to even covers (the factory one has a cover even) for them. Shoot, another thing I didn't get was the tank straps. But those are available cheap as well.

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dga57

I'm really surprised that the width of the two dashes is so similar.  I hope that swap works... it will be interesting to see a totally unexpected dash layout in a Pinto!  What year Mustang did this stuff come from?  I know you probably said somewhere before, but I don't remember.  I'm anxious to see the end result!!!

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

russosborne

and the last for tonight. I am not going back out, too muggy.
first is comparing the Pinto dash to the Mustang dash. I thought that the Mustang one would be way too wide, but they are very close. There is a lot of difference in the depth, though. I am going to have to tear the Mustang dash apart to work with it, it is really heavy all loaded up. Hate to do that, but I can't even begin to try anything with it the way (weigh) it is. :-)

Second one is the gas tank from the Mustang. I got it and all the lines even.

Third one is the steering column and wheel from the Mustang. Both of the airbags were deployed when the car got hit in the front. I wouldn't even try to use them anyway. Not too sure about the column, it is a tilt, which would really be helpful for someone as old and fat as I am. But I really don't like the steering wheel. But it has the cruise control controls in it. Not too sure what to do there. Cruise control would really be good, helps keep me from getting tickets. And I have a steering wheel I REALLY want to use, it is the one I have had on the car since the first couple of days I had it. It was originally meant for my 69 Mustang, but it works well on here. One of the old style 3 chrome spokes with holes in the spokes and a soft foam type black grip. The only wheel I really enjoy. Had one on my high school 69 Mustang even.
Speaking of which, I just found a place that still sells the bare foot gas pedal pedals. :-) Yes, had one of those on my high school car.

He honestly gave me everything he won't be using on his project, to use or sell or give away as I see fit. Going to try to use it all, but some of it just might not be physically possible to use in a Pinto. ABS brakes, for one. Hoping to be able to use the cruise control. Since I am using the engine, trans, and computers from the same car, it should work, if I can figure out how to change the controls around.
Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

russosborne

And a few more.
First is most of the wiring harness laid out. He gave me the entire harness.
Second is a lot of the stuff I got installed in the Pinto. :-)  I really have run out of room in the garage.

Third is the console from the Mustang.

Fourth is the dash.

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

russosborne

Well, I had to go out and get the Taurus cleaned out at least so we can go shopping tomorrow. So here are some pictures of stuff other than the engine and trans that I got.

Top picture is of the Mustang driveshaft. The second one is of the Mustang and Pinto driveshafts together, Mustang on the left.
Third one is of the Mustang carpet, he gave the whole thing to me. Might come in handy, stock Pinto carpet won't work for me except for the area in front of the bucket seats, if that.
Last pic is of the wiring harness still in the Taurus trunk.
Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

russosborne

I never liked that shift. Mainly cause most places made you come in Sunday night, and I like having Sunday night off. That's my relaxation night.
Plus it was always hard for me to go to bed that late in the day and then get up that evening. Never seemed like I got any real sleep. All in my head, I know.

But at least you understand how things are working "off" shifts. People who only work day shifts usually don't get it.

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dga57

Quote from: russosborne on July 24, 2010, 09:27:52 PM
My usual response to that is
"I AM positive. I am positive things will get screwed up"
But I am too tired to even make that response right now. I had to get up at 9am. that is more like 2 am to you day shifter types. I don't usually get up until close to 1pm.
thinking about going to bed right now, which is like way early. I don't usually go to bed until 3am or later. It is 10:27 here right now.
Russ

I've been called a lot of things, but never a day-shifter.  In fact, I'm the consummate night-shifter!  30 years and counting on the third (graveyard) shift.  I normally go to bed around 9:00 a.m. and get up around 3:00-3:30 p.m..  I work 10 p.m. til 8:00 a.m. during the week and 7:30 p.m. til 8:00 a.m. on weekends (every other weekend).  Probably couldn't function if they put me on any other shift after all this time!   :lol:

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

russosborne

My usual response to that is
"I AM positive. I am positive things will get screwed up"
But I am too tired to even make that response right now. I had to get up at 9am. that is more like 2 am to you day shifter types. I don't usually get up until close to 1pm.
thinking about going to bed right now, which is like way early. I don't usually go to bed until 3am or later. It is 10:27 here right now.
Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dga57

Quote from: russosborne on July 24, 2010, 09:03:53 PM
What a long day. But successful. Got the engine/trans and misc. home without any issues. Getting them out of the blazer may be a different story, but not going to try tonight.
No pictures yet, will take some tomorrow. I still have to find a place to put all this stuff.
Russ

Russ,
Glad to hear that the Blazer got you there and back safe and sound!  Maybe things are going to go better... starting now!  Think positive!
Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

russosborne

What a long day. But successful. Got the engine/trans and misc. home without any issues. Getting them out of the blazer may be a different story, but not going to try tonight.
No pictures yet, will take some tomorrow. I still have to find a place to put all this stuff.
Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dga57

I don't know whether it will work or not, but if you're making modifications anyway, I think Mustang II tailights would be awesome on a Pinto!

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

russosborne

Ok, take two.
Taillight mounting.
I was thinking about mounting either the stock taillights or who knows what ones from the inside. At least on my 79, they look like they were added at the last minute the way they are mounted.
Might mean having to do some cutting on the rear panel, but what is a little more modifying? :-)
Probably going to be adding a higher floor to the back, so there wouldn't be any worry about hitting the lights when doing stuff in the hatch area.

I have actually thought about using the ones I kept from the II. Haven't taken a serious look at if they would be even close, but I do like the 3 section look they have. 69 Mustang taillights are my all time favorite, the way the 3 sections stick out on each side. Maybe I can come up with something similar.
Thoughts?
Russ
(let's see if this posts THIS time)
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

russosborne

Yeah, mine is/was a glue in. Why did they use a gasked at all? Seems like Ford finds a better way of doing stuff, and then they insist on going back to the old way. My 69 Mustang windshield was a glue in. It also had a removable cowl panel, which was a change from the earlier Mustangs, and then on the II's and Pinto's Ford went back to the welded in place ones that make cowl rust repair extremely painful.

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dave1987

may or june of 78 they stopped using the gaskets and switched to glue in. So if you have a later production 78 model it's a glue in. The glue in glass is also larger than the gasket glass. Gasket glass is the same for 71-mid 78, after that you have bigger glass. Glue in type windshields cannot be used with a gasket, they are far to large. You CAN glue in a late model windshield into an earlier model, but you will need the outside AND inside trim for the late model. The inside trim from a late model fills in where the gasket on an early model would normally be. I've done a lot of research on the two if you can't tell....;) :P
1978 Ford Pinto Sedan - Family owned since new

Remembering Jeff Fitcher with every drive in my 78 Sedan.

I am a Pinto Surgeon. Fixing problems and giving Pintos a chance to live again is more than a hobby, it's a passion!

popbumper

Quote from: russosborne on July 23, 2010, 01:48:25 PM
Chris, I hope you don't look like me. That would be awful for you.

It did take 2 years before I took it apart.

Definitely going to Dayton tomorrow. I really am worried about my Blazer making it both ways without any problems, but how do you turn down a free deal like this? Looked into renting something, but we just can't afford it. If you are in Ohio and between Akron and Dayton tomorrow and see a metallic dark red Blazer 4 door and a white Ford Taurus alongside the road, that will be me and my wife.

Russ

Russ:

  Fraternal twin then, perhaps. Besides, I ain't no prize anyways, so no biggie. I just like the parallels between these projects.

  Now, first, if I saw you on the side of the road I'd stop to help. And second, the wife is from Toledo, so the next time we visit the area (next year probably), I expect an invite - er..., would appreciate visiting with you!

Chris
Restoring a 1976 MPG wagon - purchased 6/08

Bigtimmay

Quote from: dave1987 on July 23, 2010, 01:01:38 AM
Hey russ! I removed my windshield this spring and cut the gasket away from the windshield, then pulled the separated the cut section away from the windshield. I cut down into the gasket around the edge of the windshield and just pulled up the gasket that was on top of the windshield, was pretty easy. A sharp razor is the key here!

This link takes you to the post in my project log that has pictures of the glass still on the car after cutting away the top of the gasket that holds the windshield down and in from the outside.

http://www.fordpinto.com/index.php/topic,7356.msg94946.html#msg94946
That will work on 78 and down car im pretty sure in 79 they started glueing the windsheilds in.

If i lived anywhere close to ya id just go pick that motor up for ya in my dually so you wouldnt have to worry about not making it.Hope the trip goes welll with no prblems though.
1978 Mercury Bobcat 2.3t swapped.Always needs more parts!

russosborne

Quote from: popbumper on July 22, 2010, 05:25:34 PM
Russ:

  Just STOP it. Now I know you ARE my long lost twin - you were looking for cheap transportation.....next thing you know the car is coming COMPLETELY apart.

Oh my. This is like looking in a mirror in so many ways. It's somewhat painful.... :P

Chris

Chris, I hope you don't look like me. That would be awful for you.

It did take 2 years before I took it apart.

Definitely going to Dayton tomorrow. I really am worried about my Blazer making it both ways without any problems, but how do you turn down a free deal like this? Looked into renting something, but we just can't afford it. If you are in Ohio and between Akron and Dayton tomorrow and see a metallic dark red Blazer 4 door and a white Ford Taurus alongside the road, that will be me and my wife.

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

dave1987

Hey russ! I removed my windshield this spring and cut the gasket away from the windshield, then pulled the separated the cut section away from the windshield. I cut down into the gasket around the edge of the windshield and just pulled up the gasket that was on top of the windshield, was pretty easy. A sharp razor is the key here!

This link takes you to the post in my project log that has pictures of the glass still on the car after cutting away the top of the gasket that holds the windshield down and in from the outside.

http://www.fordpinto.com/index.php/topic,7356.msg94946.html#msg94946
1978 Ford Pinto Sedan - Family owned since new

Remembering Jeff Fitcher with every drive in my 78 Sedan.

I am a Pinto Surgeon. Fixing problems and giving Pintos a chance to live again is more than a hobby, it's a passion!

popbumper

Russ:

  Just STOP it. Now I know you ARE my long lost twin - you were looking for cheap transportation.....next thing you know the car is coming COMPLETELY apart.

Oh my. This is like looking in a mirror in so many ways. It's somewhat painful.... :P

Chris
Restoring a 1976 MPG wagon - purchased 6/08

russosborne

I guess I just got lucky. I wasn't even looking for a Pinto when I bought this, I was just looking for cheap transportation that I could work on myself if it broke. Found a whole lot of early 90's stuff that you couldn't see the engine with all the stuff in the way and most wouldn't pass emissions(which we have in Akron). Then I found this on Craig's list over near Findlay. I didn't even look underneath it, was too scared too.
The seller had it on here for sale, but I didn't even know this site existed then. He is the one that told me about here.

There is lots of rust on the outer body though. Hood and doors are shot, and quarter panels need replaced as well. But yeah, it is pretty solid for a midwest car. Think the seller told me he got this one either in Indiana or right on the border.

Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.

r4pinto

Russ I just have one question.... How did you find a Pinto in Ohio that didn't have much rust underneath?? Mine is a rust bucket & so was the one I got in Alliance lol. I saw the pics on car domain & it looks like you got a good base to start out with. I am jeaulous! Can't wait to see the finished product.
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

dga57

Quote from: russosborne on July 22, 2010, 02:38:30 AM
Well, might be road tripping to Dayton this Saturday after all. The guy giving me the engine and stuff says he will have it all out of the donor car by tomorrow. Waiting to here back from him.
Hope my Blazer can survive the trip. Can't afford to rent anything.
Yes, I can find something to stress about in any situation. :-)

Have done nothing to the Pinto. Been stressed at work, so much so that if something went wrong I might revert back to my old ways of throwing stuff and beating on stuff. So I am avoiding the Pinto for now.
Russ

Avoiding the Pinto is probably a wise decision.  Hope things become a bit less stressful for you soon!

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

russosborne

Well, might be road tripping to Dayton this Saturday after all. The guy giving me the engine and stuff says he will have it all out of the donor car by tomorrow. Waiting to here back from him.
Hope my Blazer can survive the trip. Can't afford to rent anything.
Yes, I can find something to stress about in any situation. :-)

Have done nothing to the Pinto. Been stressed at work, so much so that if something went wrong I might revert back to my old ways of throwing stuff and beating on stuff. So I am avoiding the Pinto for now.
Russ
In Glendale, Arizona

RIP Casey, Mallory, Abby, and Sadie. We miss you.

79 Pinto ESS fully caged fun car. In progress. 8inch 4.10 gears. 351C and a T5 waiting to go in.