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Why the Ford Pinto didn’t suck

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suckThe Ford Pinto was born a low-rent, stumpy thing in Dearborn 40 years ago and grew to become one of the most infamous cars in history. The thing is that it didn't actually suck. Really.

Even after four decades, what's the first thing that comes to mind when most people think of the Ford Pinto? Ka-BLAM! The truth is the Pinto was more than that — and this is the story of how the exploding Pinto became a pre-apocalyptic narrative, how the myth was exposed, and why you should race one.

The Pinto was CEO Lee Iacocca's baby, a homegrown answer to the threat of compact-sized economy cars from Japan and Germany, the sales of which had grown significantly throughout the 1960s. Iacocca demanded the Pinto cost under $2,000, and weigh under 2,000 pounds. It was an all-hands-on-deck project, and Ford got it done in 25 months from concept to production.

Building its own small car meant Ford's buyers wouldn't have to hew to the Japanese government's size-tamping regulations; Ford would have the freedom to choose its own exterior dimensions and engine sizes based on market needs (as did Chevy with the Vega and AMC with the Gremlin). And people cold dug it.

When it was unveiled in late 1970 (ominously on September 11), US buyers noted the Pinto's pleasant shape — bringing to mind a certain tailless amphibian — and interior layout hinting at a hipster's sunken living room. Some call it one of the ugliest cars ever made, but like fans of Mischa Barton, Pinto lovers care not what others think. With its strong Kent OHV four (a distant cousin of the Lotus TwinCam), the Pinto could at least keep up with its peers, despite its drum brakes and as long as one looked past its Russian-roulette build quality.

But what of the elephant in the Pinto's room? Yes, the whole blowing-up-on-rear-end-impact thing. It all started a little more than a year after the Pinto's arrival.

 

Grimshaw v. Ford Motor Company

On May 28, 1972, Mrs. Lilly Gray and 13-year-old passenger Richard Grimshaw, set out from Anaheim, California toward Barstow in Gray's six-month-old Ford Pinto. Gray had been having trouble with the car since new, returning it to the dealer several times for stalling. After stopping in San Bernardino for gasoline, Gray got back on I-15 and accelerated to around 65 mph. Approaching traffic congestion, she moved from the left lane to the middle lane, where the car suddenly stalled and came to a stop. A 1962 Ford Galaxie, the driver unable to stop or swerve in time, rear-ended the Pinto. The Pinto's gas tank was driven forward, and punctured on the bolts of the differential housing.

As the rear wheel well sections separated from the floor pan, a full tank of fuel sprayed straight into the passenger compartment, which was engulfed in flames. Gray later died from congestive heart failure, a direct result of being nearly incinerated, while Grimshaw was burned severely and left permanently disfigured. Grimshaw and the Gray family sued Ford Motor Company (among others), and after a six-month jury trial, verdicts were returned against Ford Motor Company. Ford did not contest amount of compensatory damages awarded to Grimshaw and the Gray family, and a jury awarded the plaintiffs $125 million, which the judge in the case subsequently reduced to the low seven figures. Other crashes and other lawsuits followed.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Mother Jones and Pinto Madness

In 1977, Mark Dowie, business manager of Mother Jones magazine published an article on the Pinto's "exploding gas tanks." It's the same article in which we first heard the chilling phrase, "How much does Ford think your life is worth?" Dowie had spent days sorting through filing cabinets at the Department of Transportation, examining paperwork Ford had produced as part of a lobbying effort to defeat a federal rear-end collision standard. That's where Dowie uncovered an innocuous-looking memo entitled "Fatalities Associated with Crash-Induced Fuel Leakage and Fires."

The Car Talk blog describes why the memo proved so damning.

In it, Ford's director of auto safety estimated that equipping the Pinto with [an] $11 part would prevent 180 burn deaths, 180 serious burn injuries and 2,100 burned cars, for a total cost of $137 million. Paying out $200,000 per death, $67,000 per injury and $700 per vehicle would cost only $49.15 million.

The government would, in 1978, demand Ford recall the million or so Pintos on the road to deal with the potential for gas-tank punctures. That "smoking gun" memo would become a symbol for corporate callousness and indifference to human life, haunting Ford (and other automakers) for decades. But despite the memo's cold calculations, was Ford characterized fairly as the Kevorkian of automakers?

Perhaps not. In 1991, A Rutgers Law Journal report [PDF] showed the total number of Pinto fires, out of 2 million cars and 10 years of production, stalled at 27. It was no more than any other vehicle, averaged out, and certainly not the thousand or more suggested by Mother Jones.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

The big rebuttal, and vindication?

But what of the so-called "smoking gun" memo Dowie had unearthed? Surely Ford, and Lee Iacocca himself, were part of a ruthless establishment who didn't care if its customers lived or died, right? Well, not really. Remember that the memo was a lobbying document whose audience was intended to be the NHTSA. The memo didn't refer to Pintos, or even Ford products, specifically, but American cars in general. It also considered rollovers not rear-end collisions. And that chilling assignment of value to a human life? Indeed, it was federal regulators who often considered that startling concept in their own deliberations. The value figure used in Ford's memo was the same one regulators had themselves set forth.

In fact, measured by occupant fatalities per million cars in use during 1975 and 1976, the Pinto's safety record compared favorably to other subcompacts like the AMC Gremlin, Chevy Vega, Toyota Corolla and VW Beetle.

And what of Mother Jones' Dowie? As the Car Talk blog points out, Dowie now calls the Pinto, "a fabulous vehicle that got great gas mileage," if not for that one flaw: The legendary "$11 part."

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Pinto Racing Doesn't Suck

Back in 1974, Car and Driver magazine created a Pinto for racing, an exercise to prove brains and common sense were more important than an unlimited budget and superstar power. As Patrick Bedard wrote in the March, 1975 issue of Car and Driver, "It's a great car to drive, this Pinto," referring to the racer the magazine prepared for the Goodrich Radial Challenge, an IMSA-sanctioned road racing series for small sedans.

Why'd they pick a Pinto over, say, a BMW 2002 or AMC Gremlin? Current owner of the prepped Pinto, Fox Motorsports says it was a matter of comparing the car's frontal area, weight, piston displacement, handling, wheel width, and horsepower to other cars of the day that would meet the entry criteria. (Racers like Jerry Walsh had by then already been fielding Pintos in IMSA's "Baby Grand" class.)

Bedard, along with Ron Nash and company procured a 30,000-mile 1972 Pinto two-door to transform. In addition to safety, chassis and differential mods, the team traded a 200-pound IMSA weight penalty for the power gain of Ford's 2.3-liter engine, which Bedard said "tipped the scales" in the Pinto's favor. But according to Bedard, it sounds like the real advantage was in the turns, thanks to some add-ons from Mssrs. Koni and Bilstein.

"The Pinto's advantage was cornering ability," Bedard wrote. "I don't think there was another car in the B. F. Goodrich series that was quicker through the turns on a dry track. The steering is light and quick, and the suspension is direct and predictable in a way that street cars never can be. It never darts over bumps, the axle is perfectly controlled and the suspension doesn't bottom."

Need more proof of the Pinto's lack of suck? Check out the SCCA Washington, DC region's spec-Pinto series.

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My Somewhat Begrudging Apology To Ford Pinto

ford-pinto.jpg

I never thought I’d offer an apology to the Ford Pinto, but I guess I owe it one.

I had a Pinto in the 1970s. Actually, my wife bought it a few months before we got married. The car became sort of a wedding dowry. So did the remaining 80% of the outstanding auto loan.

During a relatively brief ownership, the Pinto’s repair costs exceeded the original price of the car. It wasn’t a question of if it would fail, but when. And where. Sometimes, it simply wouldn’t start in the driveway. Other times, it would conk out at a busy intersection.

It ranks as the worst car I ever had. That was back when some auto makers made quality something like Job 100, certainly not Job 1.

Despite my bad Pinto experience, I suppose an apology is in order because of a recent blog I wrote. It centered on Toyota’s sudden-acceleration problems. But in discussing those, I invoked the memory of exploding Pintos, perpetuating an inaccuracy.

The widespread allegation was that, due to a design flaw, Pinto fuel tanks could readily blow up in rear-end collisions, setting the car and its occupants afire.

People started calling the Pinto “the barbecue that seats four.” And the lawsuits spread like wild fire.

Responding to my blog, a Ford (“I would very much prefer to keep my name out of print”) manager contacted me to set the record straight.

He says exploding Pintos were a myth that an investigation debunked nearly 20 years ago. He cites Gary Schwartz’ 1991 Rutgers Law Review paper that cut through the wild claims and examined what really happened.

Schwartz methodically determined the actual number of Pinto rear-end explosion deaths was not in the thousands, as commonly thought, but 27.

In 1975-76, the Pinto averaged 310 fatalities a year. But the similar-size Toyota Corolla averaged 313, the VW Beetle 374 and the Datsun 1200/210 came in at 405.

Yes, there were cases such as a Pinto exploding while parked on the shoulder of the road and hit from behind by a speeding pickup truck. But fiery rear-end collisions comprised only 0.6% of all fatalities back then, and the Pinto had a lower death rate in that category than the average compact or subcompact, Schwartz said after crunching the numbers. Nor was there anything about the Pinto’s rear-end design that made it particularly unsafe.

Not content to portray the Pinto as an incendiary device, ABC’s 20/20 decided to really heat things up in a 1978 broadcast containing “startling new developments.” ABC breathlessly reported that, not just Pintos, but fullsize Fords could blow up if hit from behind.

20/20 thereupon aired a video, shot by UCLA researchers, showing a Ford sedan getting rear-ended and bursting into flames. A couple of problems with that video:

One, it was shot 10 years earlier.

Two, the UCLA researchers had openly said in a published report that they intentionally rigged the vehicle with an explosive.

That’s because the test was to determine how a crash fire affected the car’s interior, not to show how easily Fords became fire balls. They said they had to use an accelerant because crash blazes on their own are so rare. They had tried to induce a vehicle fire in a crash without using an igniter, but failed.

ABC failed to mention any of that when correspondent Sylvia Chase reported on “Ford’s secret rear-end crash tests.”

We could forgive ABC for that botched reporting job. After all, it was 32 years ago. But a few weeks ago, ABC, in another one of its rigged auto exposes, showed video of a Toyota apparently accelerating on its own.

Turns out, the “runaway” vehicle had help from an associate professor. He built a gizmo with an on-off switch to provide acceleration on demand. Well, at least ABC didn’t show the Toyota slamming into a wall and bursting into flames.

In my blog, I also mentioned that Ford’s woes got worse in the 1970s with the supposed uncovering of an internal memo by a Ford attorney who allegedly calculated it would cost less to pay off wrongful-death suits than to redesign the Pinto.

It became known as the “Ford Pinto memo,” a smoking gun. But Schwartz looked into that, too. He reported the memo did not pertain to Pintos or any Ford products. Instead, it had to do with American vehicles in general.

It dealt with rollovers, not rear-end crashes. It did not address tort liability at all, let alone advocate it as a cheaper alternative to a redesign. It put a value to human life because federal regulators themselves did so.

The memo was meant for regulators’ eyes only. But it was off to the races after Mother Jones magazine got a hold of a copy and reported what wasn’t the case.

The exploding-Pinto myth lives on, largely because more Americans watch 20/20 than read the Rutgers Law Review. One wonders what people will recollect in 2040 about Toyota’s sudden accelerations, which more and more look like driver error and, in some cases, driver shams.

So I guess I owe the Pinto an apology. But it’s half-hearted, because my Pinto gave me much grief, even though, as the Ford manager notes, “it was a cheap car, built long ago and lots of things have changed, almost all for the better.”

Here goes: If I said anything that offended you, Pinto, I’m sorry. And thanks for not blowing up on me.

30+ MPG w/ modification

Started by joecool85, August 01, 2006, 08:08:31 AM

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earthquake

An easy way to raise compresson is to mill the head.You can take 60 thou off a 2.0 and still use a cam with a 470 lift without problems,This raises the  comp ratio 1 full point.However the motor is not a no interference motor any more so don't break a timing belt.The same applys to the 2.3 but the cam has a lower max lift than the 2.0.I have 90 thou milled from my 2.3 with a 60 thou increase in the piston eyebrows.
73 sedan parts car,80 crusin wagon conversion,76 F 250 460 SCJ,74 Ranchero 4x4,88 mustang lx convertable,and the readheaded step child 86 uhhh Chevy 4x4(Sorry guys it was cheap)

joecool85

The wagon also weighs considerably more.  I wouldn't expect to, easily, get better than 25-26mpg.  There are a lot of good things listed in this thread for mpg gains though.  First, like already stated, check your tire pressure.  Do an oil change, new air filter, tune your carb, new fuel filter (do this before tuning the carb), and use an electric fan for the rad instead of the mechanical one that comes on it.
Life is what you make it.
http://www.thatraymond.com

dholvrsn

I meant '79 wagon.

The '80 Pony that I had way back when got MPG in the high twenties. Even got 31 or 32 MPG on the interstate to St. Louis and back. I know the wagon has a bit of a disadvantage with an automatic.

Anyway, the distributer was advanced at seven degrees before a dialed it up to 20. The previous carburetor was running a bit rich too.

I'm thinking about doing the old time thing of setting the timing by ear where you advance it until the engine runs the best and then retard it slightly until it starts to bog.
'80 MPG Pony, '80-'92
'79 porthole wagon, '06-on
'80 trunk model. '17-on
-----
'98 Dodge Ram 1500
'95 Buick Riviera
'63 Studebaker Champ
'57 Studebaker Silver Hawk
'51 Studebaker Commander Starlight
'47 Studebaker Champion
'41 Studebaker Commander Land Cruiser

goodolboydws

A 70 Pinto wagon? Must be a typo.

I'd do a compression test first, both wet and dry.
There isn't much you can do without tearing down the engine, if the compression is low across all cylinders on a high mileage engine, for example.

I and some people that I personally know have used RESTORE (look in auto parts stores and WalMart s/b under $8 for a 4, or under $10 for 6 cyl engine) with some fairly decent results to improve compression somewhat and to reduce oil usage, but I've not personally seen a big increase in fuel mileage. (But then again none of my engines on which i've used it have been down much on all or most cylinders either.)

If you're barely getting 20 now, don't expect miracles from the engine, but changing HOW you drive and doing a lot of little things like emptying the car of extra weight, keeping the tires highly but properly inflated, checking for dragging brakes, changing the air filter, doing a decent tune up and running a more fuel efficient engine oil can together have a significant effect on your mileage.   

Bumping the timing a few degrees isn't going to make much of a change in terms of fuel ecomomy, UNLESS it is considerably off from where it is SUPPOSED to be, for whatever reason. If the engine timing is now running where it should be, it WILL DEFINITELY increase the combustion chamber temperature, so if you decide to do that, you will be increasing the odds of getting a burnt exhaust valve if the engine is already using too much oil through the valve guides.   

dholvrsn

My old '70 wagon is barely getting over 20 mpg. I'd just like to bump it up to 25 or so. I'll probably move the timing up 3 or 4 degrees. Anything else?

I'm not going to screw around with it tooooo much because I'm going to drop a turbo 2.3 in it this winter.
'80 MPG Pony, '80-'92
'79 porthole wagon, '06-on
'80 trunk model. '17-on
-----
'98 Dodge Ram 1500
'95 Buick Riviera
'63 Studebaker Champ
'57 Studebaker Silver Hawk
'51 Studebaker Commander Starlight
'47 Studebaker Champion
'41 Studebaker Commander Land Cruiser

73pintogeek

 :text_yb_lol:
Hmmmm...Glad to see I`m not the only one....guess I could take the 2.0 out of my `74 and put it in my `71 Van...I dunno...maybe shave the head`s first...and then Dyno it...no...no...put the 302 out of the van in the `73 ...I`m sooooo confused....
A bad day workin` on my Pinto is better than a good day at work!

pintoguy76

1974 Ford Pinto Wagon with 1991 Mustang DIS EFI 2.3 and stock Pinto 4 Speed

1996 Chevy C2500 Suburban with 6.5L Turbo Diesel/4L80E 4x2

1980 Volvo 265 with 1997 S-10 4.3 and a modified 700R4

2010 GMC Sierra SLE 1500 4x2 5.3 6L80E

joecool85

The fuel injected ranger has 9.5:1 and runs fine on 87 octane.  My sister has an escort with 9.4:1 that runs fine on 87, again, fuel injected.  As far as I know, carbs/fuel injection doesn't matter when figuring out what you want for compression, but I could be wrong.  I do however know that you can run up to 10:1 on 87 octane as long as you keep your car tuned well (timing etc).  Also, to get 9.5 you could probably just grab some newer 2.3 internals from a junkyard for cheap.
Life is what you make it.
http://www.thatraymond.com

pintoguy76

Yeah id like to have about 9.5:1 Compression. Wonder what it would take to make that. Might take some pricey pistons and they might not be exactly 9.5......which would probably require higher octane. with 9.5 you could get by with 87 or 89 octane, barly, but you could. Beyond that who knows. This kind of makes me worry that the 74 wagon im about to buy may not make the best milage in the world. Maybe i should consider putting a new head on my 76 engine and dropping it in my 74. And putting the 74 engine in the 76. Since it wont get driven too much i dont think.
1974 Ford Pinto Wagon with 1991 Mustang DIS EFI 2.3 and stock Pinto 4 Speed

1996 Chevy C2500 Suburban with 6.5L Turbo Diesel/4L80E 4x2

1980 Volvo 265 with 1997 S-10 4.3 and a modified 700R4

2010 GMC Sierra SLE 1500 4x2 5.3 6L80E

joecool85

8.4 to 8.6 might not make a huge difference, but going to 9.0 does.  For one, its the lowest compression you can run E85 effectively, and for two it is one of the better mpg CRs as well as an ok performance CR.
Life is what you make it.
http://www.thatraymond.com

pintoguy76

Its really hard to say what the actual compression is.....its possible it could be none of the above. All depends on pistons, heads (chambers) etc. one or two tenths of a point i dont think matters too much anyways.
1974 Ford Pinto Wagon with 1991 Mustang DIS EFI 2.3 and stock Pinto 4 Speed

1996 Chevy C2500 Suburban with 6.5L Turbo Diesel/4L80E 4x2

1980 Volvo 265 with 1997 S-10 4.3 and a modified 700R4

2010 GMC Sierra SLE 1500 4x2 5.3 6L80E

joecool85

So 76 is 9:1 compression, good to know.  Now...according to http://pintopage.fordpinto.com/ the compression on the 74-75 was 8.6, not 8.4  I guess it doesn't matter too much as I'm more interested in the 77-78, maybe a 76.
Life is what you make it.
http://www.thatraymond.com

pintoguy76

Quote from: lugnut on August 09, 2006, 05:05:15 PM
Thats good to know.  I can also add that I had a 1974 Wagon w/ 2.3 and 4 speed that could barely reach 20 mpg. It was my first car after school, and it was 2 years old and had around 15k miles when I got it. When I got tired of the loan  payments, I sold it and got a 65 Mustang  289 Auto that managed to get 16 mpg!

According to chiltons, the 74  2.3 made the most horsepower (102@5200) on 8.4 compression, while 75 was behind it at 97@4400 also with 8.4:1 compression. The 76-77 was 92@5000 with 9.0:1 Compression, and the 78-80 was dragging butt with 88hp@4800 and 9.0:1 Compression.
1974 Ford Pinto Wagon with 1991 Mustang DIS EFI 2.3 and stock Pinto 4 Speed

1996 Chevy C2500 Suburban with 6.5L Turbo Diesel/4L80E 4x2

1980 Volvo 265 with 1997 S-10 4.3 and a modified 700R4

2010 GMC Sierra SLE 1500 4x2 5.3 6L80E

pintoguy76

Quote from: Original74 on August 09, 2006, 07:24:01 AM
If Pintoguy got 27 at 80 MPH, I am sure he could get something in the range of 32 or better at 65 MPH. Wow, 80 MPH in a Pinto...never had 3.00 gears, but man, you had to be way into the secondaries at that speed! LOL

Dave

Nope that was after a fresh tune up, on my way to kansas city a year ago. I drove 272 miles and put 10 gallons in the car to fill it up. It had awesome power, it ran like a striped butt ape. Too bad that only lasted about a week then it was back to its old self again. I dont know what was up with that but i only got into the secondarys twice that trip. Bear in mind 3.00s with a small tire like that is really equal to a lower ratio in comparison to a truck or something. I was turning some 3400 RPM. Now then that the newness has worn off the tuneup i recently made 25 at speeds varying between 65 and 75, and several stops along the trip and many hills. Not as much power either.
1974 Ford Pinto Wagon with 1991 Mustang DIS EFI 2.3 and stock Pinto 4 Speed

1996 Chevy C2500 Suburban with 6.5L Turbo Diesel/4L80E 4x2

1980 Volvo 265 with 1997 S-10 4.3 and a modified 700R4

2010 GMC Sierra SLE 1500 4x2 5.3 6L80E

lugnut

Quote from: joecool85 on August 06, 2006, 07:10:19 AM
I think I know why you have better mpg than some of the other 2.3 guys.  From 77-80 the 2.3 had 9:1 compression, before that it was 8.6:1    :o
Thats good to know.  I can also add that I had a 1974 Wagon w/ 2.3 and 4 speed that could barely reach 20 mpg. It was my first car after school, and it was 2 years old and had around 15k miles when I got it. When I got tired of the loan  payments, I sold it and got a 65 Mustang  289 Auto that managed to get 16 mpg!

Original74

If Pintoguy got 27 at 80 MPH, I am sure he could get something in the range of 32 or better at 65 MPH. Wow, 80 MPH in a Pinto...never had 3.00 gears, but man, you had to be way into the secondaries at that speed! LOL

Dave
Dave Herbeck- Missing from us... He will always be with us

1974 Sedan, 'Geraldine', 45,000 miles, orange and white, show car.
1976 Runabout, project.
1979 Sedan, 'Jade', 429 miles, show car, really needs to be in a museum. I am building him one!
1979 Runabout, light blue, 39,000 miles, daily driver

joecool85

Really?  34...wow.  If I could do mid 30s, like 34-35 on the interstate, I would be totally ecstatic!
Life is what you make it.
http://www.thatraymond.com

pintoguy76

Ive made a maximum of 27.2 MPG out my stock 76 pinto at 80 MPH. it has a 2.3 with a rebuilt carb (rebuilt by me and i really dont know what im doing) with the EGR wiped out, a 4 speed (no overdrive) 3.00 Gears and 185-75-13 tires. The engine has a burnt valve in cylinder number three due to an intake leak it had right there. I assume that was the problem anyways, it makes sence to me. 30 mpg should be easily acheivable. i beleive the sales ads for a pinto said they were rated at 34 miles per gallon.
1974 Ford Pinto Wagon with 1991 Mustang DIS EFI 2.3 and stock Pinto 4 Speed

1996 Chevy C2500 Suburban with 6.5L Turbo Diesel/4L80E 4x2

1980 Volvo 265 with 1997 S-10 4.3 and a modified 700R4

2010 GMC Sierra SLE 1500 4x2 5.3 6L80E

joecool85

Well, I've decided that I'm going to hold out on getting a pinto till I can find a 77-78 that I like, since those are my fav years.  I think with this list:

5spd mustang tranny
4.10 gears
header and freeflowing exhaust system
K&N air filter
rebuilt or new carb
roller cam out of ranger
upgraded ignition (high output coil, silicone wires etc)
Electric radiator fan

I should be looking at about 110hp/130tq and 32mpg highway, 28mpg regular driving (for me that is 45mph backroads and stuff.)
Life is what you make it.
http://www.thatraymond.com

joecool85

Quote from: lugnut on August 04, 2006, 04:55:06 PM
I bet that the 5 speed alone will get you there;  I had a 78 cruising wagon 4 speed that got 28-30 mpg.

I think I know why you have better mpg than some of the other 2.3 guys.  From 77-80 the 2.3 had 9:1 compression, before that it was 8.6:1    :o
Life is what you make it.
http://www.thatraymond.com

joecool85

Thanks for the suggestions.  Good to know that 30 mpg should be pretty easy.  I'd really like to keep it carb'd.  I know EFI should get 30mpg with no mods, probably mid to high 30s with some work, but I like carbs, there is a certain magic to it.  It looks like the 2.3 might be around 9:1 stock so I wouldn't need to change the compression ratio.
Life is what you make it.
http://www.thatraymond.com

lugnut

I bet that the 5 speed alone will get you there;  I had a 78 cruising wagon 4 speed that got 28-30 mpg.  It had a 2.3 with the feedback carb (Calif. Emissions)  Had an electronic/vacuum unit that would lean the mixture according to an oxygen sensor at cruising speed. However, that mpg was before they changed us over to oxygenated fuel. Probably would be 5-10% less now... How about one of those Holley EFI units- do they still make them?
I don't think the fancy ignition will help much.  At highway speed the stock Duraspark works fine- I mean, if you light the charge reliably, you are good- can't ignite it again.
  Also might help a bit to see if you can get some weight out of the car somehow.
Just some thoughts...
mike

joecool85

I was pretty sure that was from a 2.3, but I'm not 100% sure.  Someone feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.
Life is what you make it.
http://www.thatraymond.com

77turbopinto

Quote from: joecool85 on August 04, 2006, 01:03:35 PM
...a 5spd mustang tranny, they have a 0.69 5th gear.

Would that be one from a 2.3, 3.8 (?) or a 5.0 car? You do know that they are not a direct interchange, right? (the t-5 bells will interchange, but the trannys are different)

Bill
Thanks to all U.S. Military members past & present.

joecool85

Did some calculations and if the 4spd manual tranny is a 1:1 in 4th gear, then 3.08 gears would have the same overall ratio on the interstate.  Anyone know the gearing in the manual trannies?
Life is what you make it.
http://www.thatraymond.com

joecool85

You can get 4.56 in an 8" rear.  And 4.10 would be great for a 5spd mustang tranny, they have a 0.69 5th gear.
Life is what you make it.
http://www.thatraymond.com

robw

are you sure you want 4:10's in the rear end? they are awfully low considering you most likley won't run any tire over 28" tall. I got 4:11's in my 1976 chevy K-10 spinning 35's and it'll rip most cars out of the hole and still do 65-70mph fairly easily down the highway.I just think you might want something a little tamer in the rear end and are you sure you can even get 4:10's for pinto carrier. you might have to upgrade to a 8.8 or an early bronco 9 inch.just my two cents

joecool85

The more I'm thinking, the more I think that maybe something between 8.7 and 9.2 would be a better compression if I'm keeping it carb'd.
Life is what you make it.
http://www.thatraymond.com

joecool85

I'm thinking raising the compression ratio to 9.5 (like the later 2.3s have) might be a good idea as well.  Maybe give a tick more hp, a little better mpg, and also be able to run E85.
Life is what you make it.
http://www.thatraymond.com

joecool85

So, this seems to be the list I'm looking at:

5spd mustang tranny
4.10 gears
header and freeflowing exhaust system
K&N air filter
rebuilt or new carb
roller cam out of ranger
upgraded ignition (no points/condensors, high output coil, silicone wires etc)

This should bring the car up to around 30-32 on the highway by my estimates, as well as 105-110hp.
Life is what you make it.
http://www.thatraymond.com