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79 pinto headlight,tailight,side marker light assemblies

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Why the Ford Pinto didn’t suck

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suckThe Ford Pinto was born a low-rent, stumpy thing in Dearborn 40 years ago and grew to become one of the most infamous cars in history. The thing is that it didn't actually suck. Really.

Even after four decades, what's the first thing that comes to mind when most people think of the Ford Pinto? Ka-BLAM! The truth is the Pinto was more than that — and this is the story of how the exploding Pinto became a pre-apocalyptic narrative, how the myth was exposed, and why you should race one.

The Pinto was CEO Lee Iacocca's baby, a homegrown answer to the threat of compact-sized economy cars from Japan and Germany, the sales of which had grown significantly throughout the 1960s. Iacocca demanded the Pinto cost under $2,000, and weigh under 2,000 pounds. It was an all-hands-on-deck project, and Ford got it done in 25 months from concept to production.

Building its own small car meant Ford's buyers wouldn't have to hew to the Japanese government's size-tamping regulations; Ford would have the freedom to choose its own exterior dimensions and engine sizes based on market needs (as did Chevy with the Vega and AMC with the Gremlin). And people cold dug it.

When it was unveiled in late 1970 (ominously on September 11), US buyers noted the Pinto's pleasant shape — bringing to mind a certain tailless amphibian — and interior layout hinting at a hipster's sunken living room. Some call it one of the ugliest cars ever made, but like fans of Mischa Barton, Pinto lovers care not what others think. With its strong Kent OHV four (a distant cousin of the Lotus TwinCam), the Pinto could at least keep up with its peers, despite its drum brakes and as long as one looked past its Russian-roulette build quality.

But what of the elephant in the Pinto's room? Yes, the whole blowing-up-on-rear-end-impact thing. It all started a little more than a year after the Pinto's arrival.

 

Grimshaw v. Ford Motor Company

On May 28, 1972, Mrs. Lilly Gray and 13-year-old passenger Richard Grimshaw, set out from Anaheim, California toward Barstow in Gray's six-month-old Ford Pinto. Gray had been having trouble with the car since new, returning it to the dealer several times for stalling. After stopping in San Bernardino for gasoline, Gray got back on I-15 and accelerated to around 65 mph. Approaching traffic congestion, she moved from the left lane to the middle lane, where the car suddenly stalled and came to a stop. A 1962 Ford Galaxie, the driver unable to stop or swerve in time, rear-ended the Pinto. The Pinto's gas tank was driven forward, and punctured on the bolts of the differential housing.

As the rear wheel well sections separated from the floor pan, a full tank of fuel sprayed straight into the passenger compartment, which was engulfed in flames. Gray later died from congestive heart failure, a direct result of being nearly incinerated, while Grimshaw was burned severely and left permanently disfigured. Grimshaw and the Gray family sued Ford Motor Company (among others), and after a six-month jury trial, verdicts were returned against Ford Motor Company. Ford did not contest amount of compensatory damages awarded to Grimshaw and the Gray family, and a jury awarded the plaintiffs $125 million, which the judge in the case subsequently reduced to the low seven figures. Other crashes and other lawsuits followed.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Mother Jones and Pinto Madness

In 1977, Mark Dowie, business manager of Mother Jones magazine published an article on the Pinto's "exploding gas tanks." It's the same article in which we first heard the chilling phrase, "How much does Ford think your life is worth?" Dowie had spent days sorting through filing cabinets at the Department of Transportation, examining paperwork Ford had produced as part of a lobbying effort to defeat a federal rear-end collision standard. That's where Dowie uncovered an innocuous-looking memo entitled "Fatalities Associated with Crash-Induced Fuel Leakage and Fires."

The Car Talk blog describes why the memo proved so damning.

In it, Ford's director of auto safety estimated that equipping the Pinto with [an] $11 part would prevent 180 burn deaths, 180 serious burn injuries and 2,100 burned cars, for a total cost of $137 million. Paying out $200,000 per death, $67,000 per injury and $700 per vehicle would cost only $49.15 million.

The government would, in 1978, demand Ford recall the million or so Pintos on the road to deal with the potential for gas-tank punctures. That "smoking gun" memo would become a symbol for corporate callousness and indifference to human life, haunting Ford (and other automakers) for decades. But despite the memo's cold calculations, was Ford characterized fairly as the Kevorkian of automakers?

Perhaps not. In 1991, A Rutgers Law Journal report [PDF] showed the total number of Pinto fires, out of 2 million cars and 10 years of production, stalled at 27. It was no more than any other vehicle, averaged out, and certainly not the thousand or more suggested by Mother Jones.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

The big rebuttal, and vindication?

But what of the so-called "smoking gun" memo Dowie had unearthed? Surely Ford, and Lee Iacocca himself, were part of a ruthless establishment who didn't care if its customers lived or died, right? Well, not really. Remember that the memo was a lobbying document whose audience was intended to be the NHTSA. The memo didn't refer to Pintos, or even Ford products, specifically, but American cars in general. It also considered rollovers not rear-end collisions. And that chilling assignment of value to a human life? Indeed, it was federal regulators who often considered that startling concept in their own deliberations. The value figure used in Ford's memo was the same one regulators had themselves set forth.

In fact, measured by occupant fatalities per million cars in use during 1975 and 1976, the Pinto's safety record compared favorably to other subcompacts like the AMC Gremlin, Chevy Vega, Toyota Corolla and VW Beetle.

And what of Mother Jones' Dowie? As the Car Talk blog points out, Dowie now calls the Pinto, "a fabulous vehicle that got great gas mileage," if not for that one flaw: The legendary "$11 part."

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Pinto Racing Doesn't Suck

Back in 1974, Car and Driver magazine created a Pinto for racing, an exercise to prove brains and common sense were more important than an unlimited budget and superstar power. As Patrick Bedard wrote in the March, 1975 issue of Car and Driver, "It's a great car to drive, this Pinto," referring to the racer the magazine prepared for the Goodrich Radial Challenge, an IMSA-sanctioned road racing series for small sedans.

Why'd they pick a Pinto over, say, a BMW 2002 or AMC Gremlin? Current owner of the prepped Pinto, Fox Motorsports says it was a matter of comparing the car's frontal area, weight, piston displacement, handling, wheel width, and horsepower to other cars of the day that would meet the entry criteria. (Racers like Jerry Walsh had by then already been fielding Pintos in IMSA's "Baby Grand" class.)

Bedard, along with Ron Nash and company procured a 30,000-mile 1972 Pinto two-door to transform. In addition to safety, chassis and differential mods, the team traded a 200-pound IMSA weight penalty for the power gain of Ford's 2.3-liter engine, which Bedard said "tipped the scales" in the Pinto's favor. But according to Bedard, it sounds like the real advantage was in the turns, thanks to some add-ons from Mssrs. Koni and Bilstein.

"The Pinto's advantage was cornering ability," Bedard wrote. "I don't think there was another car in the B. F. Goodrich series that was quicker through the turns on a dry track. The steering is light and quick, and the suspension is direct and predictable in a way that street cars never can be. It never darts over bumps, the axle is perfectly controlled and the suspension doesn't bottom."

Need more proof of the Pinto's lack of suck? Check out the SCCA Washington, DC region's spec-Pinto series.

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My Somewhat Begrudging Apology To Ford Pinto

ford-pinto.jpg

I never thought I’d offer an apology to the Ford Pinto, but I guess I owe it one.

I had a Pinto in the 1970s. Actually, my wife bought it a few months before we got married. The car became sort of a wedding dowry. So did the remaining 80% of the outstanding auto loan.

During a relatively brief ownership, the Pinto’s repair costs exceeded the original price of the car. It wasn’t a question of if it would fail, but when. And where. Sometimes, it simply wouldn’t start in the driveway. Other times, it would conk out at a busy intersection.

It ranks as the worst car I ever had. That was back when some auto makers made quality something like Job 100, certainly not Job 1.

Despite my bad Pinto experience, I suppose an apology is in order because of a recent blog I wrote. It centered on Toyota’s sudden-acceleration problems. But in discussing those, I invoked the memory of exploding Pintos, perpetuating an inaccuracy.

The widespread allegation was that, due to a design flaw, Pinto fuel tanks could readily blow up in rear-end collisions, setting the car and its occupants afire.

People started calling the Pinto “the barbecue that seats four.” And the lawsuits spread like wild fire.

Responding to my blog, a Ford (“I would very much prefer to keep my name out of print”) manager contacted me to set the record straight.

He says exploding Pintos were a myth that an investigation debunked nearly 20 years ago. He cites Gary Schwartz’ 1991 Rutgers Law Review paper that cut through the wild claims and examined what really happened.

Schwartz methodically determined the actual number of Pinto rear-end explosion deaths was not in the thousands, as commonly thought, but 27.

In 1975-76, the Pinto averaged 310 fatalities a year. But the similar-size Toyota Corolla averaged 313, the VW Beetle 374 and the Datsun 1200/210 came in at 405.

Yes, there were cases such as a Pinto exploding while parked on the shoulder of the road and hit from behind by a speeding pickup truck. But fiery rear-end collisions comprised only 0.6% of all fatalities back then, and the Pinto had a lower death rate in that category than the average compact or subcompact, Schwartz said after crunching the numbers. Nor was there anything about the Pinto’s rear-end design that made it particularly unsafe.

Not content to portray the Pinto as an incendiary device, ABC’s 20/20 decided to really heat things up in a 1978 broadcast containing “startling new developments.” ABC breathlessly reported that, not just Pintos, but fullsize Fords could blow up if hit from behind.

20/20 thereupon aired a video, shot by UCLA researchers, showing a Ford sedan getting rear-ended and bursting into flames. A couple of problems with that video:

One, it was shot 10 years earlier.

Two, the UCLA researchers had openly said in a published report that they intentionally rigged the vehicle with an explosive.

That’s because the test was to determine how a crash fire affected the car’s interior, not to show how easily Fords became fire balls. They said they had to use an accelerant because crash blazes on their own are so rare. They had tried to induce a vehicle fire in a crash without using an igniter, but failed.

ABC failed to mention any of that when correspondent Sylvia Chase reported on “Ford’s secret rear-end crash tests.”

We could forgive ABC for that botched reporting job. After all, it was 32 years ago. But a few weeks ago, ABC, in another one of its rigged auto exposes, showed video of a Toyota apparently accelerating on its own.

Turns out, the “runaway” vehicle had help from an associate professor. He built a gizmo with an on-off switch to provide acceleration on demand. Well, at least ABC didn’t show the Toyota slamming into a wall and bursting into flames.

In my blog, I also mentioned that Ford’s woes got worse in the 1970s with the supposed uncovering of an internal memo by a Ford attorney who allegedly calculated it would cost less to pay off wrongful-death suits than to redesign the Pinto.

It became known as the “Ford Pinto memo,” a smoking gun. But Schwartz looked into that, too. He reported the memo did not pertain to Pintos or any Ford products. Instead, it had to do with American vehicles in general.

It dealt with rollovers, not rear-end crashes. It did not address tort liability at all, let alone advocate it as a cheaper alternative to a redesign. It put a value to human life because federal regulators themselves did so.

The memo was meant for regulators’ eyes only. But it was off to the races after Mother Jones magazine got a hold of a copy and reported what wasn’t the case.

The exploding-Pinto myth lives on, largely because more Americans watch 20/20 than read the Rutgers Law Review. One wonders what people will recollect in 2040 about Toyota’s sudden accelerations, which more and more look like driver error and, in some cases, driver shams.

So I guess I owe the Pinto an apology. But it’s half-hearted, because my Pinto gave me much grief, even though, as the Ford manager notes, “it was a cheap car, built long ago and lots of things have changed, almost all for the better.”

Here goes: If I said anything that offended you, Pinto, I’m sorry. And thanks for not blowing up on me.

My Cruiser Wagon Project.....

Started by TIGGER, July 31, 2006, 12:23:06 AM

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TIGGER

I swapped the horn again and it is working again.  Hopefully this one lasts as this is my last spare.
79 4cyl Wagon
73 Turbo HB
78 Cruising Wagon (sold 8/6/11)

TIGGER

I think it is ok.  I restored the center a few years back so I know that is good.  I took a meter to wire and it seems to get power when the button is pushed.  I did not have to play with it tonight but I hope to get some time tomorrow.
79 4cyl Wagon
73 Turbo HB
78 Cruising Wagon (sold 8/6/11)

75bobcatv6

Could the wiring for the horn be bad?

TIGGER

Unfortunately my horn quit working again >:(  I have a third spare that I will try.
79 4cyl Wagon
73 Turbo HB
78 Cruising Wagon (sold 8/6/11)

discolives78

Hey Tigger!

I'm glad to hear you've been driving your Pinto! Projects take time and I guess we all have setbacks from time to time. I just drove, and didn't work on my car for 3 years, and then started changing things, and haven't stopped yet. My horn doesn't work. It's the button in that aftermarket wheel, or the mounting kit, or something. It worked when I got the car. If I replace the fuse and hold the horn button in my hand, it works. Put the button in the wheel and the fuse blows. Wrap the horn button in electrical tape, fuse holds. Turn a corner, fuse blows. That's the only thing that doesn't work on my car, and I'm hoping going back to an original steering wheel will help. Also, the aftermarket wheel blocks the gauges, cuz it's smaller than the factory. Good luck with all your projects, and keep the wife happy!

Chuck


A virtual version of my last Pinto. Was Registered Ride #111. Missed every day.

TIGGER

75BobcatV6, I have some spares if you need one.
79 4cyl Wagon
73 Turbo HB
78 Cruising Wagon (sold 8/6/11)

75bobcatv6

hmm anyone know where i could get that Steering grommet? mine is missing.... Tigger the car looks great and am glad you have it back on the road.

TIGGER

Thanks Dave, I will check that tomorrow.  The horn on the car has never worked since I have owned it.  This morning I pulled the horn off and tested it.  I was no good.  While I was at my mom's I pulled the horn off my parts car.  It works so now the crusing wagon has a working horn ;D  The last thing on this car that does not work is the rear window defogger.  I think it is due to the contact being detached from the window.  This is a common thing with these cars as age seems to weaken the bond.  My 79 has the same issue.  I have an NOS piece of glass for that car as the window that is currently in it has a lot of broken traces. 

Has anyone had any luck bonding the contact back on the glass?  I tried some stuff we use at work for repairing traces on boards but it did not work well.   
79 4cyl Wagon
73 Turbo HB
78 Cruising Wagon (sold 8/6/11)

dave1987

TIGGER, for the water leak, I would double check the "seal" (looks like the end of a small toilet plunger) were the steering shaft exits through the floor. I have had instances where this pops out after I have worked under the dash and I haven't pushed it into place well enough.
1978 Ford Pinto Sedan - Family owned since new

Remembering Jeff Fitcher with every drive in my 78 Sedan.

I am a Pinto Surgeon. Fixing problems and giving Pintos a chance to live again is more than a hobby, it's a passion!

TIGGER

I hate water leaks >:(  I thought I was done with them but aparently I sprung a leak on the drivers side somewhere.  The underlayment has been damp.  I have been checking the carpets regularly since I have been driving the car and the drivers side is getting wetter.  The car sat for a few weeks at my mom's house thru some heavy down pours and was dry as a bone inside.  I am wondering if the car leaks when driving in the rain.  When I bought the car, I removed the plastic fender liners in order to clean out all the pine needles from the cowl.  I installed the pass side before I started driving the car but never got around to installing the drivers.  I removed the fender today to re-seam seal the pinch welds underneath.  It looked so so but I wanted to be sure the pinch welds were sealed up tight to prevent any leaks.  I suggest everyone doing that while they have the fenders off.  When I put the fender back, I installed the plastic fenderliner.  The inside is dry now.  I will keep my eye on it to see if it is still leaking.  While I had the car in the garage I decided to remove the heater box to clean the inside and to swap out the heater core.  There were a lot of pine needles inside the heater box.  It will be nice to know that there will be no more pine needles coming out of the vents when the fan is blowing.  I removed the seat to make it easier to work under the dash.  Before I put the seat back in I installed the door sill. Before with the seat installed, there was not enough carpet to cover properly.  The person that installed this aftermarket carpet originally didn't get everything to fit properly before he started trimming the excess. 
79 4cyl Wagon
73 Turbo HB
78 Cruising Wagon (sold 8/6/11)

Fred Morgan

Gerhard I need to check my Rachero since it reads way low. I have my wife follow me down the road, we use 2 way radio or mobile phones. Hey anybody got gears.  Fred   :)
Fred Morgan- Missing from us...
January 20th 1951-January 6th 2014

Beloved PCCA Parts Supplier and Friend to many.
Post your well wishes,
http://www.fordpinto.com/in-memory-of-our-fallen-pinto-heros/fred-morgan-23434/

TIGGER

Thanks Guys.  I tell you it has taken me quite a lot of time and some money to get this car to this point.  At one point I thought I bit off more than I could chew.  I thought the same with my 67 Mustang years ago but I stuck with it and am glad I did.  You just need to get over the hump and then things usually tend to fall into place.  I am not done with the CW as there still are some things I need to take care of but at least it is driveable and the wife is off my case about it sitting around.  Now I need to focus on the blue Pinto in my avitar.  That is the car that the car I originally wanted to fix up before the Crusing Wagon came into my life.

On a side note, I took the car to the swapmeet this morning.  The speedo gear made a difference but I cannot tell how far it is off now.  I wish I had a GPS unit that I could check against.  I will have to figure something out.  Also, the new used door seals did the trick.  The door frames no longer rattle on rough roads and the wind does not whistle on the Highway. It is much nicer to drive now.  The next thing on the list is the alignment and and then the heater core.
79 4cyl Wagon
73 Turbo HB
78 Cruising Wagon (sold 8/6/11)

popbumper

Glad to hear, Tigger. My progress has been slow - but sure - I don't imagine I will be on the road realistically until 2010, though that would be a nice 50th birthday present.

Happy trails!!

Chris
Restoring a 1976 MPG wagon - purchased 6/08

r4pinto

That's great to hear Gerhard. I tell ya, it's success stories like this that make me want to work on my car again. If it weren't for the friggin cold & snow I would be able to.  >:(
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

TIGGER

Update, I have been driving the car almost every day for the past 2 months.  I have got quite a few comments on it.  I flushed the heater core and got a little more heat out of it but I still think it is going to require a replacement.  Either that or it will be the water pump.  Today I changed the speedo gear to a different one to get the speedo a little closer to being correct.  I also installed some mint door seals I saved from a few years back.  I hope this keeps some of the wind out on the freeway.  The last major thing needed is an alignment.  I plan on making an appointment this coming week.
79 4cyl Wagon
73 Turbo HB
78 Cruising Wagon (sold 8/6/11)

popbumper

Quote from: TIGGER on September 01, 2008, 10:49:45 PM
No, I used regular Krylon.  It was quite transparent and needed a lot of coats to cover the faded plastic.  I am not too happy with the way it covered as I feel I have a lot of paint on them.

They look good, but I understand your feeling about the plastic condition. Mine (wagon) rear plastic panels are pretty nasty - dry and crumbling - I am actually considering covering them in vinyl that matches the vinyl used on the doors. I realize it's non-original, but I think it would look pretty good.

Thos crumbling plastic panels are a real problem,. and I doubt they would EVER be remanufactured!!

Chris
Restoring a 1976 MPG wagon - purchased 6/08

TIGGER

Update, I drove the car for about a week and a half and had to park it at my Mom's house due to other projects (not car releated) that I needed my truck for.  It has sat there for a little over a month till today.  I was happy to find the interior nice and dry inside 8)  We have had quite a bit of rain in the last two weeks and I was beginning to wonder if the interior was still water tight or if I was going to have a soggy carpet.  Anyway, it is looking like I will need a new heater core as there is not much heat coming from the vents.  It is a good thing that it is plugged as it will get me to clean out all the leaves from the inside of the heater box.  I am getting tired of having crap blow out all the time, making a mess inside.   I hope to get back to this car soon......
79 4cyl Wagon
73 Turbo HB
78 Cruising Wagon (sold 8/6/11)

TIGGER

Today I took the car and got it smogged.  It passed ;D  I then went to the DMV and renewed the plates.  I noticed today the speedo is way off, like 15-20MPH.  I do not remember it being off when I drove the car home.  I did not change the rear end or the speedo cable.  All I did was swap out the C3's and the 13" modular wheel to 13" slots. I guess I will have to do some homework and see what tooth gear I have in it now.

All in all, the car drove good today for its official maden voyage.
79 4cyl Wagon
73 Turbo HB
78 Cruising Wagon (sold 8/6/11)

TIGGER

So this weekend I got the AM radio working again as well as hooking up the heater cables and fan.  Lots of crap came out of the vents when I turned on the fan.  I had to vaccuum the whole car again >:(  I got insurance on the car today so if all goes well, I will go smog it on my way to work.  I went and put some fresh gas in it this evening.  The car seems like it needs an alignment but that will have to wait till next month.
79 4cyl Wagon
73 Turbo HB
78 Cruising Wagon (sold 8/6/11)

TIGGER

No, I used regular Krylon.  It was quite transparent and needed a lot of coats to cover the faded plastic.  I am not too happy with the way it covered as I feel I have a lot of paint on them.
79 4cyl Wagon
73 Turbo HB
78 Cruising Wagon (sold 8/6/11)

dholvrsn

Did you use any kind of specialty paint to stick to the plastic?
'80 MPG Pony, '80-'92
'79 porthole wagon, '06-on
'80 trunk model. '17-on
-----
'98 Dodge Ram 1500
'95 Buick Riviera
'63 Studebaker Champ
'57 Studebaker Silver Hawk
'51 Studebaker Commander Starlight
'47 Studebaker Champion
'41 Studebaker Commander Land Cruiser

TIGGER

Today,. I painted the cargo panels.  The drivers side turned out good but the pass side came out ok.  I was not too happy with it.  They are in bad shape but look better painted.  I put the back seat in.  All I have left to install are the door sills but I have to make some of those cardboard pieces that go over the rocker channel.  After that I will have to fix the radio and the horn and the car will be done (I hope)
79 4cyl Wagon
73 Turbo HB
78 Cruising Wagon (sold 8/6/11)

dga57

Tigger,
So sorry to hear of your family's loss.  Our dog, Jake, is nearly 12 years old and even though he looks healthy as a horse, I know with every passing day we're inching closer and closer toward the end. 
Looks like you're coming right along with that project... keep up the good work!
Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

TIGGER

We got home late tonight so I did not have much time before it got dark.  I got the kick panels in and I got the heater motor working again.  Tomorrow I plan on working on the cargo panels and rear seat.. 
79 4cyl Wagon
73 Turbo HB
78 Cruising Wagon (sold 8/6/11)

TIGGER

Thanks 75bobcatv6

Here is a pic of where I left off last night.  I want to work on it today but the boss made other plans so the car will have to wait till this evening.
79 4cyl Wagon
73 Turbo HB
78 Cruising Wagon (sold 8/6/11)

75bobcatv6

Sorry to hear that tigger. my buddies dog passed away last weekend, She too was fine all day was out playing and Just suddenly was Sick and throwing up. I'm sure like cleo shes in good hands where ever she might be

TIGGER

Today started out pretty crappy as our Pit died early this morning :( As near as we can tell, she must have had a heart attack or siezure or something as she was fine earlier when she was playing with the wiener.  She was a very good dog and will be missed dearly by all of my family.  Needless to say my family and I were all a little messed up this morning so we canceled our plans and did our own thing today.  I went out and played with the crusing wagon.  I picked up some carpet underlayment on my way home yesterday to put under the carpet as the burlap stuff was removed from the replacement carpet by one of the previous owners.  I got the underlayment down and the carpet put back.  I got the new seats installed as well as the shifter bezel and ebrake cover.  By that time I finished it was about dark so I checked the shifter to see if it sill lit up.  It did but there were a few dash lights out  ??? It took me about a half an hour to replace the bulbs.  Now they all work again.  Here are a few pics.  I will get some with the seats installed tomorrow.  After all that is done, the next order of business will be to finish painting the rear cargo panels.  I started that project last fall and never finished it. 
79 4cyl Wagon
73 Turbo HB
78 Cruising Wagon (sold 8/6/11)

TIGGER

 No need to run the sprinker on it today as it has been raining most of the afternoon ???  I just checked on it and there is no water from under the dash 8)  The pass door is leaking though, coming from under the door panel into the rocker channed.  It is a good thing the door sills are out or the carpet would be getting soaked now.  When I put the door panels back on, I siliconed some thick plastic in place of the deteriorated original tar paper stuff.  I do not understand why it is leaking.  I guess I will have to pull the panel off and run the water to see where it is coming from.
79 4cyl Wagon
73 Turbo HB
78 Cruising Wagon (sold 8/6/11)

TIGGER

Bill, I will see if the button's on the original front seats to the car are any good.  If so you can have them. 

Yesterday was a nice day so I decided to fool with the wiper assembly.  It looks like I got it fixed now.  I parked the car in the front lawn and ran a sprinker over it for a couple hours and had no water leaks from under the dash.  I had one small one from my pass door seal that I will have to fix.  I will run the sprinkler and hose on it again today to make sure I got them all.  If all goes well, the interior will go back into the car this week ;D
79 4cyl Wagon
73 Turbo HB
78 Cruising Wagon (sold 8/6/11)

77turbopinto

Glad you did not get out-bid! I still want the buttons LOL.

(that was back in the day where you could see who you were bidding against)


Bill
Thanks to all U.S. Military members past & present.