Mini Classifieds

Wanted '75 Bobcat Instrument Cluster & Wiring Harness
Date: 12/09/2018 06:59 am
Wanted Postal Pinto
Date: 09/26/2019 05:31 pm
hubcaps

Date: 10/31/2018 12:04 pm
Dumping '80 yellow Pinto

Date: 06/21/2017 03:45 pm
74 Pinto Rear Side Lights

Date: 02/18/2017 05:47 pm
1971 Pinto Runabout turn key driver

Date: 07/01/2019 12:23 pm
1977 Pinto Cruising Wagon FOR SALE

Date: 08/20/2017 01:34 pm
1973 Ford Pinto Squire Wagon 3 Door

Date: 07/11/2023 11:39 pm
ENGINE COMPLETE 1971 PINTO
Date: 12/28/2017 03:55 pm

Why the Ford Pinto didn’t suck

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suckThe Ford Pinto was born a low-rent, stumpy thing in Dearborn 40 years ago and grew to become one of the most infamous cars in history. The thing is that it didn't actually suck. Really.

Even after four decades, what's the first thing that comes to mind when most people think of the Ford Pinto? Ka-BLAM! The truth is the Pinto was more than that — and this is the story of how the exploding Pinto became a pre-apocalyptic narrative, how the myth was exposed, and why you should race one.

The Pinto was CEO Lee Iacocca's baby, a homegrown answer to the threat of compact-sized economy cars from Japan and Germany, the sales of which had grown significantly throughout the 1960s. Iacocca demanded the Pinto cost under $2,000, and weigh under 2,000 pounds. It was an all-hands-on-deck project, and Ford got it done in 25 months from concept to production.

Building its own small car meant Ford's buyers wouldn't have to hew to the Japanese government's size-tamping regulations; Ford would have the freedom to choose its own exterior dimensions and engine sizes based on market needs (as did Chevy with the Vega and AMC with the Gremlin). And people cold dug it.

When it was unveiled in late 1970 (ominously on September 11), US buyers noted the Pinto's pleasant shape — bringing to mind a certain tailless amphibian — and interior layout hinting at a hipster's sunken living room. Some call it one of the ugliest cars ever made, but like fans of Mischa Barton, Pinto lovers care not what others think. With its strong Kent OHV four (a distant cousin of the Lotus TwinCam), the Pinto could at least keep up with its peers, despite its drum brakes and as long as one looked past its Russian-roulette build quality.

But what of the elephant in the Pinto's room? Yes, the whole blowing-up-on-rear-end-impact thing. It all started a little more than a year after the Pinto's arrival.

 

Grimshaw v. Ford Motor Company

On May 28, 1972, Mrs. Lilly Gray and 13-year-old passenger Richard Grimshaw, set out from Anaheim, California toward Barstow in Gray's six-month-old Ford Pinto. Gray had been having trouble with the car since new, returning it to the dealer several times for stalling. After stopping in San Bernardino for gasoline, Gray got back on I-15 and accelerated to around 65 mph. Approaching traffic congestion, she moved from the left lane to the middle lane, where the car suddenly stalled and came to a stop. A 1962 Ford Galaxie, the driver unable to stop or swerve in time, rear-ended the Pinto. The Pinto's gas tank was driven forward, and punctured on the bolts of the differential housing.

As the rear wheel well sections separated from the floor pan, a full tank of fuel sprayed straight into the passenger compartment, which was engulfed in flames. Gray later died from congestive heart failure, a direct result of being nearly incinerated, while Grimshaw was burned severely and left permanently disfigured. Grimshaw and the Gray family sued Ford Motor Company (among others), and after a six-month jury trial, verdicts were returned against Ford Motor Company. Ford did not contest amount of compensatory damages awarded to Grimshaw and the Gray family, and a jury awarded the plaintiffs $125 million, which the judge in the case subsequently reduced to the low seven figures. Other crashes and other lawsuits followed.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Mother Jones and Pinto Madness

In 1977, Mark Dowie, business manager of Mother Jones magazine published an article on the Pinto's "exploding gas tanks." It's the same article in which we first heard the chilling phrase, "How much does Ford think your life is worth?" Dowie had spent days sorting through filing cabinets at the Department of Transportation, examining paperwork Ford had produced as part of a lobbying effort to defeat a federal rear-end collision standard. That's where Dowie uncovered an innocuous-looking memo entitled "Fatalities Associated with Crash-Induced Fuel Leakage and Fires."

The Car Talk blog describes why the memo proved so damning.

In it, Ford's director of auto safety estimated that equipping the Pinto with [an] $11 part would prevent 180 burn deaths, 180 serious burn injuries and 2,100 burned cars, for a total cost of $137 million. Paying out $200,000 per death, $67,000 per injury and $700 per vehicle would cost only $49.15 million.

The government would, in 1978, demand Ford recall the million or so Pintos on the road to deal with the potential for gas-tank punctures. That "smoking gun" memo would become a symbol for corporate callousness and indifference to human life, haunting Ford (and other automakers) for decades. But despite the memo's cold calculations, was Ford characterized fairly as the Kevorkian of automakers?

Perhaps not. In 1991, A Rutgers Law Journal report [PDF] showed the total number of Pinto fires, out of 2 million cars and 10 years of production, stalled at 27. It was no more than any other vehicle, averaged out, and certainly not the thousand or more suggested by Mother Jones.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

The big rebuttal, and vindication?

But what of the so-called "smoking gun" memo Dowie had unearthed? Surely Ford, and Lee Iacocca himself, were part of a ruthless establishment who didn't care if its customers lived or died, right? Well, not really. Remember that the memo was a lobbying document whose audience was intended to be the NHTSA. The memo didn't refer to Pintos, or even Ford products, specifically, but American cars in general. It also considered rollovers not rear-end collisions. And that chilling assignment of value to a human life? Indeed, it was federal regulators who often considered that startling concept in their own deliberations. The value figure used in Ford's memo was the same one regulators had themselves set forth.

In fact, measured by occupant fatalities per million cars in use during 1975 and 1976, the Pinto's safety record compared favorably to other subcompacts like the AMC Gremlin, Chevy Vega, Toyota Corolla and VW Beetle.

And what of Mother Jones' Dowie? As the Car Talk blog points out, Dowie now calls the Pinto, "a fabulous vehicle that got great gas mileage," if not for that one flaw: The legendary "$11 part."

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Pinto Racing Doesn't Suck

Back in 1974, Car and Driver magazine created a Pinto for racing, an exercise to prove brains and common sense were more important than an unlimited budget and superstar power. As Patrick Bedard wrote in the March, 1975 issue of Car and Driver, "It's a great car to drive, this Pinto," referring to the racer the magazine prepared for the Goodrich Radial Challenge, an IMSA-sanctioned road racing series for small sedans.

Why'd they pick a Pinto over, say, a BMW 2002 or AMC Gremlin? Current owner of the prepped Pinto, Fox Motorsports says it was a matter of comparing the car's frontal area, weight, piston displacement, handling, wheel width, and horsepower to other cars of the day that would meet the entry criteria. (Racers like Jerry Walsh had by then already been fielding Pintos in IMSA's "Baby Grand" class.)

Bedard, along with Ron Nash and company procured a 30,000-mile 1972 Pinto two-door to transform. In addition to safety, chassis and differential mods, the team traded a 200-pound IMSA weight penalty for the power gain of Ford's 2.3-liter engine, which Bedard said "tipped the scales" in the Pinto's favor. But according to Bedard, it sounds like the real advantage was in the turns, thanks to some add-ons from Mssrs. Koni and Bilstein.

"The Pinto's advantage was cornering ability," Bedard wrote. "I don't think there was another car in the B. F. Goodrich series that was quicker through the turns on a dry track. The steering is light and quick, and the suspension is direct and predictable in a way that street cars never can be. It never darts over bumps, the axle is perfectly controlled and the suspension doesn't bottom."

Need more proof of the Pinto's lack of suck? Check out the SCCA Washington, DC region's spec-Pinto series.

Members
Stats
  • Total Posts: 139,573
  • Total Topics: 16,267
  • Online today: 1,185
  • Online ever: 1,681 (March 09, 2025, 10:00:10 AM)
Users Online
  • Users: 0
  • Guests: 623
  • Total: 623
F&I...more

My Somewhat Begrudging Apology To Ford Pinto

ford-pinto.jpg

I never thought I’d offer an apology to the Ford Pinto, but I guess I owe it one.

I had a Pinto in the 1970s. Actually, my wife bought it a few months before we got married. The car became sort of a wedding dowry. So did the remaining 80% of the outstanding auto loan.

During a relatively brief ownership, the Pinto’s repair costs exceeded the original price of the car. It wasn’t a question of if it would fail, but when. And where. Sometimes, it simply wouldn’t start in the driveway. Other times, it would conk out at a busy intersection.

It ranks as the worst car I ever had. That was back when some auto makers made quality something like Job 100, certainly not Job 1.

Despite my bad Pinto experience, I suppose an apology is in order because of a recent blog I wrote. It centered on Toyota’s sudden-acceleration problems. But in discussing those, I invoked the memory of exploding Pintos, perpetuating an inaccuracy.

The widespread allegation was that, due to a design flaw, Pinto fuel tanks could readily blow up in rear-end collisions, setting the car and its occupants afire.

People started calling the Pinto “the barbecue that seats four.” And the lawsuits spread like wild fire.

Responding to my blog, a Ford (“I would very much prefer to keep my name out of print”) manager contacted me to set the record straight.

He says exploding Pintos were a myth that an investigation debunked nearly 20 years ago. He cites Gary Schwartz’ 1991 Rutgers Law Review paper that cut through the wild claims and examined what really happened.

Schwartz methodically determined the actual number of Pinto rear-end explosion deaths was not in the thousands, as commonly thought, but 27.

In 1975-76, the Pinto averaged 310 fatalities a year. But the similar-size Toyota Corolla averaged 313, the VW Beetle 374 and the Datsun 1200/210 came in at 405.

Yes, there were cases such as a Pinto exploding while parked on the shoulder of the road and hit from behind by a speeding pickup truck. But fiery rear-end collisions comprised only 0.6% of all fatalities back then, and the Pinto had a lower death rate in that category than the average compact or subcompact, Schwartz said after crunching the numbers. Nor was there anything about the Pinto’s rear-end design that made it particularly unsafe.

Not content to portray the Pinto as an incendiary device, ABC’s 20/20 decided to really heat things up in a 1978 broadcast containing “startling new developments.” ABC breathlessly reported that, not just Pintos, but fullsize Fords could blow up if hit from behind.

20/20 thereupon aired a video, shot by UCLA researchers, showing a Ford sedan getting rear-ended and bursting into flames. A couple of problems with that video:

One, it was shot 10 years earlier.

Two, the UCLA researchers had openly said in a published report that they intentionally rigged the vehicle with an explosive.

That’s because the test was to determine how a crash fire affected the car’s interior, not to show how easily Fords became fire balls. They said they had to use an accelerant because crash blazes on their own are so rare. They had tried to induce a vehicle fire in a crash without using an igniter, but failed.

ABC failed to mention any of that when correspondent Sylvia Chase reported on “Ford’s secret rear-end crash tests.”

We could forgive ABC for that botched reporting job. After all, it was 32 years ago. But a few weeks ago, ABC, in another one of its rigged auto exposes, showed video of a Toyota apparently accelerating on its own.

Turns out, the “runaway” vehicle had help from an associate professor. He built a gizmo with an on-off switch to provide acceleration on demand. Well, at least ABC didn’t show the Toyota slamming into a wall and bursting into flames.

In my blog, I also mentioned that Ford’s woes got worse in the 1970s with the supposed uncovering of an internal memo by a Ford attorney who allegedly calculated it would cost less to pay off wrongful-death suits than to redesign the Pinto.

It became known as the “Ford Pinto memo,” a smoking gun. But Schwartz looked into that, too. He reported the memo did not pertain to Pintos or any Ford products. Instead, it had to do with American vehicles in general.

It dealt with rollovers, not rear-end crashes. It did not address tort liability at all, let alone advocate it as a cheaper alternative to a redesign. It put a value to human life because federal regulators themselves did so.

The memo was meant for regulators’ eyes only. But it was off to the races after Mother Jones magazine got a hold of a copy and reported what wasn’t the case.

The exploding-Pinto myth lives on, largely because more Americans watch 20/20 than read the Rutgers Law Review. One wonders what people will recollect in 2040 about Toyota’s sudden accelerations, which more and more look like driver error and, in some cases, driver shams.

So I guess I owe the Pinto an apology. But it’s half-hearted, because my Pinto gave me much grief, even though, as the Ford manager notes, “it was a cheap car, built long ago and lots of things have changed, almost all for the better.”

Here goes: If I said anything that offended you, Pinto, I’m sorry. And thanks for not blowing up on me.

V8Junkie's 73 wagon

Started by v8junkie, December 05, 2011, 07:51:41 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

v8junkie

Sorry for the long response time...the carpet that came with the car was complete but worn so I took it to an interior shop and had a new piece custom made snaps and all. I couldn't find a premade anywhere when I was looking.
73 Pinto Wagon
64 Falcon Futura Convertible

dga57

Were you able to purchase that carpet pre-made for the car, or is it custom?  Someone was asking about rear carpet for wagons earlier this week. 


Dwayne :)
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

74 PintoWagon

Quote from: v8junkie on September 18, 2015, 08:55:08 PM
So many parts and so little time...seems like it's time or money...cant have both.
That is so true...

BTW, carpeting looks great..
Art
65 Falcon 2DR 200 IL6 with C4.

v8junkie

Little overdue update on the wagon...looks like the ranchero/falcon 8" is actually just a bit narrower than the pintos stock rearend. whoda thunk?

The car actually came with a/c but i never knew until actually getting under the hood. I've always been so busy with the body and interior I haven't been that far until now. Now I have to decide when I do the swap if I keep the a/c or not...I'm leaning towards yes...but that means a lot of extra work getting everything to fit..the challenge is why everyone doesn't do it though right?

I got a used aod transmission for it so it'll cruise the freeway a little easier. Hopefully it wont need to be rebuilt right away...always a risk

Got all the stereo and carpeting purchased but haven't installed anything permanently because I've been so busy with other projects and I don't want to get started on something and have to stop and come back to "where did I leave off"

So many parts and so little time...seems like it's time or money...cant have both.
73 Pinto Wagon
64 Falcon Futura Convertible

v8junkie

Finally got the carpet for the cargo area of my wagon..not cheap but the quality is great!  :)
73 Pinto Wagon
64 Falcon Futura Convertible

v8junkie

Does anyone make a decent carpet kit for the rear of the wagons (cargo area)? or the rest of the wagon?  The cargo area of this wagon's carpet is worn out and the rest of the car has shag carpet that is too disco for me...lol. Thanks!
73 Pinto Wagon
64 Falcon Futura Convertible

v8junkie

Thanks for the input, I need to pull the panels anyhow to decide if I want to mini-tub this thing like I did my Camaro. I am glad to hear the sound is good from back there. I was thinking if speakers didnt go there I would have to run wire up to the headliner somehow and make a panel for the hatch. That just seems like it would be a wiring and sealing nightmare.
73 Pinto Wagon
64 Falcon Futura Convertible

old 1973

 You are correct on location ,I have a 73 squire I did not need to build custom rear panels ,there is an area just past rear wheel wells that will accept  6x9's  and that the rear seat operates as normal. I did however have to cut some sheet metal behind where I mounted them ,so the magnet and part of speaker would fit into the recess. It ended up a clean install and overall sound is good.,my next part will be front speakers.
My rides: 1972 Squire wagon (Kermit)#121
               1973 Squire wagon (Penny) #120
                1975 Mpg sedan (Pumpkin) # 122
                 1978 cruiser wagon (casper)

v8junkie

Question for the pinto owners out there... What/where have those of you who have done stereos in wagons found to be a good spot for speakers in the rear? I have no problem building door panels for the front to get what I need, but it seems I have to go all the way behind the wheelwell to install any speakers for rear fill. I am not sure I want to start building custom side panels for it because I want to keep the backseat functional while up and down.
73 Pinto Wagon
64 Falcon Futura Convertible

v8junkie

Put the alarm in today, Viper 350plus and SPAL door lock kit. It's the same alarm I used in my 68 and after installing it once the second time was even faster. I added keyless entry since I have no door locks anymore and also dome light supervision. I cant believe how 'virgin' this car is...it is really nice to work on a car that isnt full of stripped out bolts and wiring nightmares. I started on the stereo while i was doing alarm. Got pretty much all the stereo wiring done that requires disassemble of dash. Neighbors are already coming over when I have it out of the garage to check it out and tell me their Pinto stories... :)
73 Pinto Wagon
64 Falcon Futura Convertible

falconwagon62

Wagon is looking great!!!!
I have just started mine, 1976 Wagon....I did a 78 Crusing Wagon 2 years ago on here....and I am President of the Falcon Club, in the state of Ohio!!! and Co-hosts of the 2012 Falcon Nations....Pinto's and Falcon's....gotta be a personalty thing...lol
www.ovcfca.com
www.falconclub.com

v8junkie

I also wanted to note, the neon door handle mechanism works flawlessly with the pintos original door rods and the opening and shutting of the door is sooo easy. No special tricks or fancy fabrication needed there. I would tell anyone thinking about doing this that the neon handles are perfect for these doors.

The gas door/cap on the other hand works really well but may have been easier if taken from a car with driver side fuel door vs. the neons passenger side. I am nothing but happy with the way it came out though.
73 Pinto Wagon
64 Falcon Futura Convertible

v8junkie

I took the whole assembly off the neon, it has the filler neck and all. So it is using dodge neon fuel door, gas cap, and filler neck. In hindsight I would have probably took the quarter off a van or something that had the neck on the opposing side for ease. This fit really well though. Only area that needed to be reworked is where the filler neck and the body come together.
73 Pinto Wagon
64 Falcon Futura Convertible

dga57

Quote from: r4pinto on March 17, 2012, 06:28:32 PM
Looks really good. what kind of gas cap are you gonna use behind that fuel door?

That's an interesting question.  I just bought a new 2012 Lincoln MKT and it doesn't have a gas cap at all behind the fuel door. You just open the door, shove the nozzle in, and that's that! 
Dwayne :)
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

r4pinto

Looks really good. what kind of gas cap are you gonna use behind that fuel door?
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

v8junkie

A couple of better pictures since final paint...She is at the glass shop now getting all glass replaced or reinstalled. Wont be long before the transformation begins *evil grin*
73 Pinto Wagon
64 Falcon Futura Convertible

v8junkie

Not Pinto related but out of same garage...the rearend for my Camaro showed up! 33 spline Moser 12-bolt narrowed and set up for the 4-link for the 68...:D
73 Pinto Wagon
64 Falcon Futura Convertible

v8junkie

I have not got that far yet, the seats might be too big...I have a few cars though. They will go in something. after buying the book to figure out wiring and the cost of seats I am determined to use them in something...lol
73 Pinto Wagon
64 Falcon Futura Convertible

Scott Hamilton

Did you ever install the Lexus seats in the Wagon?

I'm thinking this is a real neat 'upgrade' and I'm interested in how this goes. I was never fond of the stock Pinto seat and looked into Fox Body seat replacements at one time- The Lexus seats seem very regal-
Yellow 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
Green 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
White 73, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
The Lemon, the Lime and the Coconut, :)

v8junkie

She is out of paint, some assembly required....next stop, glass shop! WooHoo!
73 Pinto Wagon
64 Falcon Futura Convertible

Scott Hamilton

How cool is this! Love the door handled and fuel door mods- really good stuff... Keep posting shots and keep us updated. You are really lucky to even have a body shop to work on your pinto... Last time I had any work done I had to go to the local ford dealer and that was like pulling teeth. No one wants or takes pride in their work these days- it's really nice to see stuff like this.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Yellow 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
Green 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
White 73, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
The Lemon, the Lime and the Coconut, :)

v8junkie

Picture of the interior I took while it was getting some of the rust around firewall worked on...
73 Pinto Wagon
64 Falcon Futura Convertible

Pinturbo75

id leave the paint as is, straight 6 it with a turbo along with steelies and dogdish caps and roll...
75 turbo pinto trunk, megasquirt2, 133lb injectors, bv head, precision 6265 turbo, 3" exhaust,bobs log, 8.8, t5,, subframe connectors, 65 mm tb, frontmount ic, traction bars, 255 lph walbro,
73 turbo pinto panel wagon, ms1, 85 lb inj, fmic, holset hy35, 3" exhaust, msd, bov,

v8junkie

That is a bummer, I would love knowing as soon as I got my parts the car would be gone...
73 Pinto Wagon
64 Falcon Futura Convertible

Pinturbo75

man, i wish you were closer, id kill for the leftovers of the ranchero.....
75 turbo pinto trunk, megasquirt2, 133lb injectors, bv head, precision 6265 turbo, 3" exhaust,bobs log, 8.8, t5,, subframe connectors, 65 mm tb, frontmount ic, traction bars, 255 lph walbro,
73 turbo pinto panel wagon, ms1, 85 lb inj, fmic, holset hy35, 3" exhaust, msd, bov,

v8junkie

Shot of the door handle being grafted in..I used rear doors off the neon and will be using keyless entry with the rear hatch as a backup. I did this because I do not want to have to use 2 keys and the handles look better w/o locks in them. Still deciding on mirrors. Most everything is in the pillar now and I am not sure I want to go to that extreme on this build...
73 Pinto Wagon
64 Falcon Futura Convertible

dave1987

1978 Ford Pinto Sedan - Family owned since new

Remembering Jeff Fitcher with every drive in my 78 Sedan.

I am a Pinto Surgeon. Fixing problems and giving Pintos a chance to live again is more than a hobby, it's a passion!

dga57

I like the idea of a flip-open fuel door on a Pinto!  No worries about losing it or having it stolen!
Dwayne :)
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

v8junkie

I know that once a car is painted you are supposed to move on to something, anything besides the body...but here we go again...I bought the rear doors and the rear quarter off a neon and am grafting them into the wagon. My paint guy is SO patient with me thankfully. Pics will be added as I go of course...and BIG thanks to Fred for the piece that goes between bumper and car! It got here safely and is worth every penny. :)
73 Pinto Wagon
64 Falcon Futura Convertible

blupinto

I'm with Scott- that is a delicious color!  ;D
One can never have too many Pintos!