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Why the Ford Pinto didn’t suck

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suckThe Ford Pinto was born a low-rent, stumpy thing in Dearborn 40 years ago and grew to become one of the most infamous cars in history. The thing is that it didn't actually suck. Really.

Even after four decades, what's the first thing that comes to mind when most people think of the Ford Pinto? Ka-BLAM! The truth is the Pinto was more than that — and this is the story of how the exploding Pinto became a pre-apocalyptic narrative, how the myth was exposed, and why you should race one.

The Pinto was CEO Lee Iacocca's baby, a homegrown answer to the threat of compact-sized economy cars from Japan and Germany, the sales of which had grown significantly throughout the 1960s. Iacocca demanded the Pinto cost under $2,000, and weigh under 2,000 pounds. It was an all-hands-on-deck project, and Ford got it done in 25 months from concept to production.

Building its own small car meant Ford's buyers wouldn't have to hew to the Japanese government's size-tamping regulations; Ford would have the freedom to choose its own exterior dimensions and engine sizes based on market needs (as did Chevy with the Vega and AMC with the Gremlin). And people cold dug it.

When it was unveiled in late 1970 (ominously on September 11), US buyers noted the Pinto's pleasant shape — bringing to mind a certain tailless amphibian — and interior layout hinting at a hipster's sunken living room. Some call it one of the ugliest cars ever made, but like fans of Mischa Barton, Pinto lovers care not what others think. With its strong Kent OHV four (a distant cousin of the Lotus TwinCam), the Pinto could at least keep up with its peers, despite its drum brakes and as long as one looked past its Russian-roulette build quality.

But what of the elephant in the Pinto's room? Yes, the whole blowing-up-on-rear-end-impact thing. It all started a little more than a year after the Pinto's arrival.

 

Grimshaw v. Ford Motor Company

On May 28, 1972, Mrs. Lilly Gray and 13-year-old passenger Richard Grimshaw, set out from Anaheim, California toward Barstow in Gray's six-month-old Ford Pinto. Gray had been having trouble with the car since new, returning it to the dealer several times for stalling. After stopping in San Bernardino for gasoline, Gray got back on I-15 and accelerated to around 65 mph. Approaching traffic congestion, she moved from the left lane to the middle lane, where the car suddenly stalled and came to a stop. A 1962 Ford Galaxie, the driver unable to stop or swerve in time, rear-ended the Pinto. The Pinto's gas tank was driven forward, and punctured on the bolts of the differential housing.

As the rear wheel well sections separated from the floor pan, a full tank of fuel sprayed straight into the passenger compartment, which was engulfed in flames. Gray later died from congestive heart failure, a direct result of being nearly incinerated, while Grimshaw was burned severely and left permanently disfigured. Grimshaw and the Gray family sued Ford Motor Company (among others), and after a six-month jury trial, verdicts were returned against Ford Motor Company. Ford did not contest amount of compensatory damages awarded to Grimshaw and the Gray family, and a jury awarded the plaintiffs $125 million, which the judge in the case subsequently reduced to the low seven figures. Other crashes and other lawsuits followed.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Mother Jones and Pinto Madness

In 1977, Mark Dowie, business manager of Mother Jones magazine published an article on the Pinto's "exploding gas tanks." It's the same article in which we first heard the chilling phrase, "How much does Ford think your life is worth?" Dowie had spent days sorting through filing cabinets at the Department of Transportation, examining paperwork Ford had produced as part of a lobbying effort to defeat a federal rear-end collision standard. That's where Dowie uncovered an innocuous-looking memo entitled "Fatalities Associated with Crash-Induced Fuel Leakage and Fires."

The Car Talk blog describes why the memo proved so damning.

In it, Ford's director of auto safety estimated that equipping the Pinto with [an] $11 part would prevent 180 burn deaths, 180 serious burn injuries and 2,100 burned cars, for a total cost of $137 million. Paying out $200,000 per death, $67,000 per injury and $700 per vehicle would cost only $49.15 million.

The government would, in 1978, demand Ford recall the million or so Pintos on the road to deal with the potential for gas-tank punctures. That "smoking gun" memo would become a symbol for corporate callousness and indifference to human life, haunting Ford (and other automakers) for decades. But despite the memo's cold calculations, was Ford characterized fairly as the Kevorkian of automakers?

Perhaps not. In 1991, A Rutgers Law Journal report [PDF] showed the total number of Pinto fires, out of 2 million cars and 10 years of production, stalled at 27. It was no more than any other vehicle, averaged out, and certainly not the thousand or more suggested by Mother Jones.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

The big rebuttal, and vindication?

But what of the so-called "smoking gun" memo Dowie had unearthed? Surely Ford, and Lee Iacocca himself, were part of a ruthless establishment who didn't care if its customers lived or died, right? Well, not really. Remember that the memo was a lobbying document whose audience was intended to be the NHTSA. The memo didn't refer to Pintos, or even Ford products, specifically, but American cars in general. It also considered rollovers not rear-end collisions. And that chilling assignment of value to a human life? Indeed, it was federal regulators who often considered that startling concept in their own deliberations. The value figure used in Ford's memo was the same one regulators had themselves set forth.

In fact, measured by occupant fatalities per million cars in use during 1975 and 1976, the Pinto's safety record compared favorably to other subcompacts like the AMC Gremlin, Chevy Vega, Toyota Corolla and VW Beetle.

And what of Mother Jones' Dowie? As the Car Talk blog points out, Dowie now calls the Pinto, "a fabulous vehicle that got great gas mileage," if not for that one flaw: The legendary "$11 part."

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Pinto Racing Doesn't Suck

Back in 1974, Car and Driver magazine created a Pinto for racing, an exercise to prove brains and common sense were more important than an unlimited budget and superstar power. As Patrick Bedard wrote in the March, 1975 issue of Car and Driver, "It's a great car to drive, this Pinto," referring to the racer the magazine prepared for the Goodrich Radial Challenge, an IMSA-sanctioned road racing series for small sedans.

Why'd they pick a Pinto over, say, a BMW 2002 or AMC Gremlin? Current owner of the prepped Pinto, Fox Motorsports says it was a matter of comparing the car's frontal area, weight, piston displacement, handling, wheel width, and horsepower to other cars of the day that would meet the entry criteria. (Racers like Jerry Walsh had by then already been fielding Pintos in IMSA's "Baby Grand" class.)

Bedard, along with Ron Nash and company procured a 30,000-mile 1972 Pinto two-door to transform. In addition to safety, chassis and differential mods, the team traded a 200-pound IMSA weight penalty for the power gain of Ford's 2.3-liter engine, which Bedard said "tipped the scales" in the Pinto's favor. But according to Bedard, it sounds like the real advantage was in the turns, thanks to some add-ons from Mssrs. Koni and Bilstein.

"The Pinto's advantage was cornering ability," Bedard wrote. "I don't think there was another car in the B. F. Goodrich series that was quicker through the turns on a dry track. The steering is light and quick, and the suspension is direct and predictable in a way that street cars never can be. It never darts over bumps, the axle is perfectly controlled and the suspension doesn't bottom."

Need more proof of the Pinto's lack of suck? Check out the SCCA Washington, DC region's spec-Pinto series.

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My Somewhat Begrudging Apology To Ford Pinto

ford-pinto.jpg

I never thought I’d offer an apology to the Ford Pinto, but I guess I owe it one.

I had a Pinto in the 1970s. Actually, my wife bought it a few months before we got married. The car became sort of a wedding dowry. So did the remaining 80% of the outstanding auto loan.

During a relatively brief ownership, the Pinto’s repair costs exceeded the original price of the car. It wasn’t a question of if it would fail, but when. And where. Sometimes, it simply wouldn’t start in the driveway. Other times, it would conk out at a busy intersection.

It ranks as the worst car I ever had. That was back when some auto makers made quality something like Job 100, certainly not Job 1.

Despite my bad Pinto experience, I suppose an apology is in order because of a recent blog I wrote. It centered on Toyota’s sudden-acceleration problems. But in discussing those, I invoked the memory of exploding Pintos, perpetuating an inaccuracy.

The widespread allegation was that, due to a design flaw, Pinto fuel tanks could readily blow up in rear-end collisions, setting the car and its occupants afire.

People started calling the Pinto “the barbecue that seats four.” And the lawsuits spread like wild fire.

Responding to my blog, a Ford (“I would very much prefer to keep my name out of print”) manager contacted me to set the record straight.

He says exploding Pintos were a myth that an investigation debunked nearly 20 years ago. He cites Gary Schwartz’ 1991 Rutgers Law Review paper that cut through the wild claims and examined what really happened.

Schwartz methodically determined the actual number of Pinto rear-end explosion deaths was not in the thousands, as commonly thought, but 27.

In 1975-76, the Pinto averaged 310 fatalities a year. But the similar-size Toyota Corolla averaged 313, the VW Beetle 374 and the Datsun 1200/210 came in at 405.

Yes, there were cases such as a Pinto exploding while parked on the shoulder of the road and hit from behind by a speeding pickup truck. But fiery rear-end collisions comprised only 0.6% of all fatalities back then, and the Pinto had a lower death rate in that category than the average compact or subcompact, Schwartz said after crunching the numbers. Nor was there anything about the Pinto’s rear-end design that made it particularly unsafe.

Not content to portray the Pinto as an incendiary device, ABC’s 20/20 decided to really heat things up in a 1978 broadcast containing “startling new developments.” ABC breathlessly reported that, not just Pintos, but fullsize Fords could blow up if hit from behind.

20/20 thereupon aired a video, shot by UCLA researchers, showing a Ford sedan getting rear-ended and bursting into flames. A couple of problems with that video:

One, it was shot 10 years earlier.

Two, the UCLA researchers had openly said in a published report that they intentionally rigged the vehicle with an explosive.

That’s because the test was to determine how a crash fire affected the car’s interior, not to show how easily Fords became fire balls. They said they had to use an accelerant because crash blazes on their own are so rare. They had tried to induce a vehicle fire in a crash without using an igniter, but failed.

ABC failed to mention any of that when correspondent Sylvia Chase reported on “Ford’s secret rear-end crash tests.”

We could forgive ABC for that botched reporting job. After all, it was 32 years ago. But a few weeks ago, ABC, in another one of its rigged auto exposes, showed video of a Toyota apparently accelerating on its own.

Turns out, the “runaway” vehicle had help from an associate professor. He built a gizmo with an on-off switch to provide acceleration on demand. Well, at least ABC didn’t show the Toyota slamming into a wall and bursting into flames.

In my blog, I also mentioned that Ford’s woes got worse in the 1970s with the supposed uncovering of an internal memo by a Ford attorney who allegedly calculated it would cost less to pay off wrongful-death suits than to redesign the Pinto.

It became known as the “Ford Pinto memo,” a smoking gun. But Schwartz looked into that, too. He reported the memo did not pertain to Pintos or any Ford products. Instead, it had to do with American vehicles in general.

It dealt with rollovers, not rear-end crashes. It did not address tort liability at all, let alone advocate it as a cheaper alternative to a redesign. It put a value to human life because federal regulators themselves did so.

The memo was meant for regulators’ eyes only. But it was off to the races after Mother Jones magazine got a hold of a copy and reported what wasn’t the case.

The exploding-Pinto myth lives on, largely because more Americans watch 20/20 than read the Rutgers Law Review. One wonders what people will recollect in 2040 about Toyota’s sudden accelerations, which more and more look like driver error and, in some cases, driver shams.

So I guess I owe the Pinto an apology. But it’s half-hearted, because my Pinto gave me much grief, even though, as the Ford manager notes, “it was a cheap car, built long ago and lots of things have changed, almost all for the better.”

Here goes: If I said anything that offended you, Pinto, I’m sorry. And thanks for not blowing up on me.

What people from the outside looking in think...

Started by beegle55, March 19, 2008, 03:55:30 PM

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dave1987

I am in Kirkland Washington for business training right now and I haven't seen one Pinto, much less any classics of any merrit.

Anyhow...

Last Friday I did a lot of running around town after work (I was off at 5 PM) and I noticed a lot of classics driving around. It was a really nice sunny day, not to mention hot out, but it was still odd how many classics were out around my area of the city of Boise.

Driving down the freeway at 65 I noticed this restorted beautiful dark puple 69 Camaro. I am not a Chevy person but I do have a profound respect for classic cars of all makes. I sped up to take a closer look at this beauty and the driver looks over real quick and then turns is attention back to the road ahead of him. Not even 5 seconds he turns to take a second look as if in disbelief. I gave the driver a thumbs up and he smiled and waved back. He didn't speed up to show off or anything intimidating like most muscle car drivers do around Idaho. Right then I knew I wasn't the only one in Idaho who drove a classic to enjoy it, not to show off!

After getting off the freeway I was driving down one of the main streets and a guy on a Harley comments on the car saying it's a pretty hot car and he wishes he had one. I smiled and said thanks as he sped up to pass.

Not five minutes later I'm driving down another road and a young kid (probably in his early 20s like myself) passes by in a Maverick, takes a good look to smile and wave.

Then I finally arrive at my work place (McDonalds) to drop off some things I grabbed from the main office. I left my lights on (why I had them on I do not know). This young guy arond my age group follows me in and waits at the front counter for around 10 minutes while I am back in the office puttings things away. I come back out and he tells me I left my lights on. I told him thanks and he says he understand because his car does the same thing. As we walk out I see him walk to his car and he is driving a very nice restored, highly reflective black fastback mustang with a high back end. I smiled and went back in. I would have stayed to chat with him if I didn't have so much to do before coming here to Kirkland.

I really felt the strength of a non bias classic car community that day. No one said anything bad about the car except for some kids who wanted to race me and though I was driving a "cheby" (that is exactly how they pronounced it too). I really love the atmosphere in Boise about classic cars. People come up to me all the time asking about the car, following me around a store just to ask about it or to see if they could go back outside to take a closer look at it. No one seems to care that it is a Pinto, but everyone remembers owning one and how much fun they had with them, wishing they never sold them.

In some way I find driving my Pinto daily as a contribution to the community. To bring back fond memories of their past, and to bring a smile to everyone's face as they see me driving around the neighborhood and town in general.
1978 Ford Pinto Sedan - Family owned since new

Remembering Jeff Fitcher with every drive in my 78 Sedan.

I am a Pinto Surgeon. Fixing problems and giving Pintos a chance to live again is more than a hobby, it's a passion!

r4pinto

I wasn't aware of that. I'll keep that in mind next time I order pizza. OH well, now back to topic.
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

apintonut

Quote from: r4pinto on May 19, 2008, 01:53:01 PM
I just saw this post & thought I'd mention my recent conversation with the pizza delivery guy. I went to get the pizza from him, and he saw my Pinto sitting in the driveway. Next thing I knew he was going on & on how he had one & loved it, not to mention how he couldn't believe I had one. He was so nice & liked the car, even done up in primer & bondo that he got a tip. Normally I don't give tips since there's that $1.75 delivery charge, but felt like it since he was being nice about the Pinto.


that $1.75 goes to the store not the driver tips pay the gas and upkeep on the car he still only makes minimum wage i know thats how i pay for part of my pinto addiction!
74 hatch soon to be turbo 2.3
73 sedan soon to be painted
stiletto parts(4 sale)
79 pinto wagon & beentoad
wtb 75 yellow w/ black int. (rally?) like profile pic.

r4pinto

I just saw this post & thought I'd mention my recent conversation with the pizza delivery guy. I went to get the pizza from him, and he saw my Pinto sitting in the driveway. Next thing I knew he was going on & on how he had one & loved it, not to mention how he couldn't believe I had one. He was so nice & liked the car, even done up in primer & bondo that he got a tip. Normally I don't give tips since there's that $1.75 delivery charge, but felt like it since he was being nice about the Pinto.
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

Fred Morgan

cookieboy don't forget to throw some flames on the side, that would be HOT.   :lol:    :)
Fred Morgan- Missing from us...
January 20th 1951-January 6th 2014

Beloved PCCA Parts Supplier and Friend to many.
Post your well wishes,
http://www.fordpinto.com/in-memory-of-our-fallen-pinto-heros/fred-morgan-23434/

Cookieboystoys

I am seriously considering turning my 77 cruising wagon into a fire/rescue themed ride...

complete with ladders, etc... then pull a little cart with a fire hose....
It's all about the Pintos! Baby!

Pintony

On Saturday I went to 3 car cruises.
The fist 2 were small but the last one was FULL of nice rides.
I lucked out and got a good parking spot.
I was standing there with my clkeaning rag tring to catch any spots I might have missed.
Some guy walks up about "50 yrs old" and asks "Didn't ford stop making the Pinto because it was DANGEROUS"? I was in the middle of my reply about how the front wheel drive was the up and comming thing, and he said something about FIRE.
So I asked if he had ever seen a Pinto on fire? He said no. I asked about a Fiero.
By then there was a small crowd and they all said they had seen Fiero burning on the side of the road.
So I asked them to let me know IF they saw a Fiero at this show??

I grabed my Extinguisher and put it by the front bumper and no one asked the rest of the night. 8)
From Pintony

beegle55

Quote from: apintonut on May 19, 2008, 01:36:28 AM
i drove one to high school in the mid 90's it got me very teased. but now i have not herd a bad thing in about 10 years! they all love it.  i didnt change my mind. i just changed  every one els's mind on what they thought of my car.
I wish I could drive mine to school.... I want to next year but that will take a couple thousand dollars and gas will probably be $100/gal. next year and I wouldn't be able to afford it lol. BUT the thought to just buy a Pinto to tinker with would be nice... a good 4 cyl thats easy on gas and in a car I love... sounds good to me.  :fastcar:

    -beegle55
2005 Jeep GC 5.7 HEMI
1993 Ford Mustang
1991 Ford Mustang GT
1988 Ford Mustang
1980 Ford Pinto Cruising- Mint, Fully documented
1979 Ford Pinto Trunk- 2.3L 4 speed
1978 Ford Pinto HB- 302 drag car
1976 Ford Pinto Runabout- 40,000 mi, V6
1972 Ford Maverick Grabber (real)
1970 Ford Mustang 302

apintonut

i drove one to high school in the mid 90's it got me very teased. but now i have not herd a bad thing in about 10 years! they all love it.  i didnt change my mind. i just changed  every one els's mind on what they thought of my car.
74 hatch soon to be turbo 2.3
73 sedan soon to be painted
stiletto parts(4 sale)
79 pinto wagon & beentoad
wtb 75 yellow w/ black int. (rally?) like profile pic.

XCorePintoLover

Nowadays I can't go anywhere, or even get of my car without someone saying something like how much they love my car and had one when they came out.

So who's to say that no one like them? Everyone that has approached me has loved them. Even when I was broke down on the side of the road rebuilding my carb people were stopping to tell me they loved my car.
Until recently, I drove a '79 Bahama Blue 2.3 Automatic Hatch.


Is the proud mommy of a baby girl, Haylee. :D

D.R.Ball

Well as for that last post, I think I will have to challenge that, but it's okay because I own both of the cars in the last reply....Yes I have a 1976 Ford Pinto and a 1971 Datsun 240Z.......But as for plain old gas and go cars the Pinto beats anything I have owned,including a Beetle......I fact that is why I bought an other one.....It just has taken me  longer to reanimate this previously dead car than I thought.....BUT I still have not found any of the so called Bombs !!!! Now a WWII Sherman Tank was known as a American(Tommy) Cooker or a Rosen IE it lite up the first time every time.....It was hit by a German anti tank round....

Wittsend

"(Pinto) the only car I have ever driven or rode in where my legs didn't cramp up."

Strangely the seating accommodations of the Pinto are VERY similar to those of a '72 240Z I owned. And, yes, you could put your legs out straight in that car too. In fact, the similarities don't stop at the front leg room.  The perspective of the hood (inside, looking out), the  window sill position, the dash (dual gauge pod) etc. etc..
Tom


Pintony

Quote from: Bipper on March 21, 2008, 10:40:40 AM
I get that same look when I take the '73 to the local Shell to get it filled with propane.


Last Saturday I was driving the brown 71 around in the city I live in. There was a man, probably in his 70's driving a Rolls Royce from the 60's or 70's. He got up next to me for about a half mile and was just starring at the car the whole time until he turned off the street. A lowly Pinto being admired by a Rolls Royce owner. You got to love it!

Bob   

Hey Bob,
Maybe he was just tring to make sure he was out of the flame travel distance? ;D
See you in a few weeks...
From Pintony

Ponygal

I think you just totally summed up the entire forum's feeling right there popbumper. Well put.
'77 Sedan "Gladys"
2.3L auto - swapping to T-5 2009
Dark brown, saddle interior
Supertrapp, Grant wheel, more mods on the way...

popbumper

These are wonderful cars. They were never built to be fashionable, classy, or for race use. "Out of the box", they were affordable, pedestrian, and common. The reason Ford had great success wiith them is because they were the "average man's" car, and were adequate. They came in "flavors" that made sense, and were swept up by the buying public.

I have owned two hatches (a new '77, a beat '80), and a converted panel wagon (1979), which was my Grandfather's car. Each one of these cars was a testament to reliability - the '79 wagon literally sat for years between ours and the neighbors house while in transition from my use to my brothers, and after a few harsh winters, and some gas in the carb, fired right up. This car carried me many years across Pennsylvania from Philadelphia to Erie, an eight hour drive, with no worse issue than a broken rear shock tab.

The appeal for me is simple, and echoed in many responses here - it's DIFFERENT. I >had< a 1957 Chevy, which I bought in 1982, spent many years, $$ restoring, and let go of in 1995. Now I go to car shows and see TOO MANY of them, the same thing, over and over, replete with thousands of dollars of chrome and exotic paint jobs, never to be driven or enjoyed. SO? Give me a fun, different car that I can enjoy, and people can look at, and say "huh"?? After all, isn't that the point?

Chris
Restoring a 1976 MPG wagon - purchased 6/08

302Pinto

I drive a '79 sedan with a 302 and a white with black stripe BOSS paint job. I am 6'1", and it is the only car I have ever driven or rode in where my legs didn't cramp up. I drove all the way from central MO to southeastern OH to northern PA and back without a single cramp. And everytime I drive I come across a Honda or a Cavalier that wants to race, and all I have to do is smile and wave and they never see me again. It's one of the greatest feelings in the world, and it gets even better when it's some guy driving with his girlfriend in the passenger seat! It's also funny when I'm driving through a parking lot and pull up next to a new car with an alarm system and give it just a little gas. I don't know how many of those alarms I've set of by accident because of the dual glasspacks.

In '07, Barrett-Jackson Collector Car Auction in Palm Springs sold Lot #1, a '76 Pinto Runabout with 7,091 actual miles for $11,500. Now tell me Pinto's aren't worth something.

About the fuel tanks exploding, I know of one of the stories that started all the paranoia. An older woman was driving down I-70 in MO and came up to a construction zone and had to stop. Unfortunately, it was on a steep downslope just over the crest of a hill. A semi trailer cruizing at about 75 mph came over the hill and was unable to stop fast enough due to a fully loaded trailer. He rear-ended her doing about 65-70 and the Pinto was launched over 200 feet into the woods. After landing the car exploded and the woman's family sued Ford for poor fuel tank design. I feel sorry for the woman for two reasons. First, she was killed in an accident which is terrible for anyone. Second, her family was so greedy they wanted to sue Ford for something that could have happened to just about make of car when rear-ended by a semi traveling that fast. And, a few decades earlier the rear bumper for several cars was the gas tank and no one complained. Doesn't that seem a little strange to you?

Pintony

Quote from: 71 pintoracer on March 21, 2008, 11:38:36 PM
The funny thing is the younger generation doesn't even know what they are. I pulled through Hardee's drive thru one time and the little girl working the window said "I like your car, what is it?" I replied "It's a Pinto." She looked confused and said "Is it new?" I said "No, they stopped making these cars when you were just a gleam in your daddy's eye!" Her friends working there came over to look at it and one girl said "Is it fast?" I said "Fast enough to make you pee your pants!" They just squealed and giggled!!
Ha FUNNY!!!
That is a good read there 71 pintoracer.
Tooo Funny!!!!

71pintoracer

I guess the people who ask "why" are just ignorant to the love affair that we have to our Pinto's. At one car show I went to I got two of those to which I replied "how many other Pintos do you see here? When was the last time you saw one driving down the road? Everyone has a Mustang, Camaro or Honda." Most of the time though people love it. I get stares and thumbs up on the interstate all the time, and people will follow me when I pull in somewhere so they can get a better look. People take pictures of it at the gas station or grocery store and many of them say "I had one, I really liked that car." The funny thing is the younger generation doesn't even know what they are. I pulled through Hardee's drive thru one time and the little girl working the window said "I like your car, what is it?" I replied "It's a Pinto." She looked confused and said "Is it new?" I said "No, they stopped making these cars when you were just a gleam in your daddy's eye!" Her friends working there came over to look at it and one girl said "Is it fast?" I said "Fast enough to make you pee your pants!" They just squealed and giggled!!
If you don't have time to do it right, when will you have time to do it over?

Pintosopher

 Regarding the issue of Fuel tanks and collisions, Refer to the Fordpinto.com home page under Goals #3 . Then go to bric a brac and read the whole article and then look at the bottom of the page under the headings of fuel tank design.
This is old news, been there- done that!

Pintosopher
Now , where's my Black helicopter?  :nocool: :lost: :lol:
Yes, it is possible to study and become a master of Pintosophy.. Not a religion , nothing less than a life quest for non conformity and rational thought. What Horse did you ride in on?

Check my Pinto Poems out...

earthquake

Quote from: D.R.Ball on March 21, 2008, 07:33:12 AM
So I guess to end the debate have ANY OF YOU EVER FOUND A FORD PINTO IN THE WREACKING YARD BECAUSE OF A REAR END (GAS TANK FIRE).....Anyone?????? My answer is HELL NO......Engine bay fires of cars(any make) YES!!!!! It would seem to me that most modern EFI cars have that problem....BUT really, gas tank fires due to being rear ended....Not so much.....BTW maybe we need to have the MYTHBUSTERS on the case.....As for those damn skyjackers didn't a Pinto have a gas tank fire due to having those installed and the getting rear ended????? Like I stated earlier I have yet to any pinto in the wrecking yard due to blowing up....Has anyone.......
Having spent the last 35 + years in more than 9 different wrecking yards,After 15 yrs as a registered tow operator,And 13 phone calls to operators I have worked with or for,None of us have ever had a fire by rearender.I have delt with over 100 vehicle fires myself,Many different reasons for the fires.Most fires are caused by the electrical system,much more common in newer cars than older for obvious reasons.Second reason is fuel system,more common in older cars than newer cars Reasons also obvious.Last is accidents,These are few and far between.I may have had 1or2 in 15 yrs.To put this in perspective,I have a better chance of getting killed on the job(5 OF MY CO WORKERS HAVE BEEN KILLED IN THE 15 YRS I HAVE BEEN IN THE INDUSTRY)than finding a car fire caused by a rear ender.
      Doc.
73 sedan parts car,80 crusin wagon conversion,76 F 250 460 SCJ,74 Ranchero 4x4,88 mustang lx convertable,and the readheaded step child 86 uhhh Chevy 4x4(Sorry guys it was cheap)

Bipper

Quote from: pintosopher on March 20, 2008, 12:16:42 PM
The look on the employees  faces at the time was worth all the grief of using my beaker and funnels.

I get that same look when I take the '73 to the local Shell to get it filled with propane.

Quote from: ni2sml on March 20, 2008, 11:50:20 AM

A couple of weeks ago I had a guy pull level with me in traffic, honking and waving frantically.

Last Saturday I was driving the brown 71 around in the city I live in. There was a man, probably in his 70's driving a Rolls Royce from the 60's or 70's. He got up next to me for about a half mile and was just starring at the car the whole time until he turned off the street. A lowly Pinto being admired by a Rolls Royce owner. You got to love it!

Bob   
71 Sedan, stock
72 Pangra
73 Runabout, 2L turbo propane

Pintosopher

Greetings all,
In reviewing the commentary in the thread, I see all types of reactive and mostly supportive perceptions about what the public reaction to Pinto ownership was, or currently is.
Regarding the gas tank issue, this has been debated ad nauseum, and it's been established that the final repair design was "adequate" but a poor band aid, for a flawed design.
Yes ,we've seen the crash photos of toasted rear-ended Pintos, but we've never really discussed the 64-66 Mustang and it's lack of a trunk floor and the resulting consequences of a rear end collision. But it's a cult classic of enormous following and no less or more a great design. Yes, I'll bet there were burned up rear-ended pintos in salvage yards, but not much was worth holding onto for salvage after the fires. Heck, look at the Crown Victoria Police interceptor fuel tank recall.
The Bottom line today is : if there's still prejudice against these cars, Do we really care?
I enjoy and revel in the distinctive misperceptions of the general populace, as do Many Corvair owners, and even Vega owners!
Oh Lord won't ya buy me a Taurus....

Pintosopher ... Not Society's Child
Yes, it is possible to study and become a master of Pintosophy.. Not a religion , nothing less than a life quest for non conformity and rational thought. What Horse did you ride in on?

Check my Pinto Poems out...

hellfirejim

I used to own a Pinto a long time ago.  Don't remember the exact year but it was a full glass hatchback.  I drove it 35,000 miles in one year.  Was a terrific car.

Fast forward to today.  I was looking for a new projectcar and I found I was really interested in turbos so i started looking at forums and found turboford.   Well one thing led to another and i found my 75 about 3 miles from my house.  I am damn glad I have it for anumber of reasons but 2 stand out the most.

1. The PEOPLE.  I have made some really cool friends while doing this and I suspect there will be more.
2. I have a problem having a car that I see coming down the street like I am driving.  I like being different and the odds of seeing another Pinto in my area is slim to none.

PS: About the issue of exploding gas tank.... What about the a*****e that hits you at 55mph????  These are small cars and all small cars all have the same issue. 

jim
It's a good day to be alive!
PCCA Pinto Number #385


D.R.Ball

So I guess to end the debate have ANY OF YOU EVER FOUND A FORD PINTO IN THE WREACKING YARD BECAUSE OF A REAR END (GAS TANK FIRE).....Anyone?????? My answer is HELL NO......Engine bay fires of cars(any make) YES!!!!! It would seem to me that most modern EFI cars have that problem....BUT really, gas tank fires due to being rear ended....Not so much.....BTW maybe we need to have the MYTHBUSTERS on the case.....As for those damn skyjackers didn't a Pinto have a gas tank fire due to having those installed and the getting rear ended????? Like I stated earlier I have yet to any pinto in the wreacking yard due to blowing up....Has anyone.......

Wittsend

  I was 14 when the Pinto hit the market. Back then guys all ran around with what were then called "slotted" mags (today they seemed to be referred to with the term "kidney bean" wheels).  Anyway, these were very deep dished wheels (lots of offset) and the only way to use them was to jack up the rear of the car with shackle extenders or air shocks, leaving them to stick many inches outside the edge of the wheel well opening. This look was then accompanied with stainless steel flaps screwed to the lower rear of the wheel well.

  What so struck me all those years ago about the Pinto was how wide a wheel/tire combination could be fit -  without exceeding the wheel wells.  In that regard the Pinto was WAY ahead of it's time.  Back then I was a Datsun 510 guy (still have one too).  Though, I must admit I was a closet admirer of the Pinto.  And, that is why I own one today.

  Regarding everyone having one, yea. My step-sister had the bicentennial Pinto, my youngest brother has a 72 - 1600, he sold it to the middle brother who also had a 72 - 2000 and later a 73 "vinyl woodie" wagon. I haven't had contact with him in years, but last we spoke he always wanted another early wagon.  I guess I'm living my brothers dream.
Tom

Smeed

Quote from: Ponygal on March 20, 2008, 02:20:15 PM
I've always wanted a cool little "ugly" car from the 70's as a daily driver, and fell in love with Pintos many years ago.

The Pinto is the Audrey Hepburn of the car world!

'73 runabout

crazyhorse

Being a regular on "The Dragon" AKA US129 through Deal's Gap. I get a LOT of attention from Hi HP cars. They just cannot understand why this little car with 88HP can hang with them. On that road HP is NOTHING. Handling is EVERYTHING. If you've driven Pintos long enough, you know how unstable they are at speed. That instability works to thier advantage in the twisties. The only 4cyl cars that give me probs are the Miatas, and Solstice/Sky twins. My Pinto isn't fast, but it tracks like it's on rails.

If you get to this part of the coutry you NEED to check this road out.
www.tailofthedragon.com
How to tell when a redneck's time is up: He combines these two sentences... Hey man, hold my beer. Hey y'all watch this!
'74 Runabout, stock 2300,auto  RIP Darlin.
'95 Olds Gutless "POS"
'97 Subaru Legacy wagon "Kat"

Ponygal

Oh I just love these stories. Makes me happy I decided to "go with a car that was really DIFFERENT" this time around, rather than the '98ish Jetta TDI I had intended on searching for. I can't wait til my car is finally on the road.

I also own a '66 Mustang, and call me a big fat follower if you will, but I have wanted one since I knew what the car was all about, and was thrilled to drag her carcass home on a dolley that snowy night. I didn't want one because everyone else had one, I wanted one BECAUSE I WANTED ONE!! that being said, I've always wanted a cool little "ugly" car from the 70's as a daily driver, and fell in love with Pintos many years ago. My heart still breaks over the '76 wagon I passed up on years ago because the fiancée didn't think parts were available anymore for the 2.0.

I look forward to the horrified faces on all the Honda drivers out there when I pull up behind their perfectly shined car with my brown & black beast. She's here, she's ugly and she ain't goin' away anytime soon! :D
'77 Sedan "Gladys"
2.3L auto - swapping to T-5 2009
Dark brown, saddle interior
Supertrapp, Grant wheel, more mods on the way...

beegle55

I will race anyone in my school or town with my little supposed POS Pinto and see who gets the last laugh  :2fast4u:
2005 Jeep GC 5.7 HEMI
1993 Ford Mustang
1991 Ford Mustang GT
1988 Ford Mustang
1980 Ford Pinto Cruising- Mint, Fully documented
1979 Ford Pinto Trunk- 2.3L 4 speed
1978 Ford Pinto HB- 302 drag car
1976 Ford Pinto Runabout- 40,000 mi, V6
1972 Ford Maverick Grabber (real)
1970 Ford Mustang 302

Pintosopher

My two cents,
It's been many years since my '72 was street legal (barely) but even then I found a way to swap intakes and get it smogged every 2 years with a stock motor internally. But I also could get Leaded Unocal 87 in '88, so I could play more with tuning. Then I decided to swap Motors for smog check and put the hot engine in most of the time, and cocktailed my own gas blend at the pump.
The look on the employees  faces at the time was worth all the grief of using my beaker and funnels. The usual comment was "how much V8?" and  "can I see under the hood?"  My 3 inch tip exiting under the passenger door would emit a cam stumble with the Webers that fooled most of them.  The disbelief that it was a 2.0L four was answered by a 7000 rpm burnout as both rear tyres let go into the boulevard. An it continued through second and a chirp in third.
  I am tempted to relinquish my now spotless driving record and return to my old habits, but I just am this close to another age related insurance discount with my carrier.

Live long , blaze a path of significant glory...
Pintosopher
Yes, it is possible to study and become a master of Pintosophy.. Not a religion , nothing less than a life quest for non conformity and rational thought. What Horse did you ride in on?

Check my Pinto Poems out...