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Why the Ford Pinto didn’t suck

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suckThe Ford Pinto was born a low-rent, stumpy thing in Dearborn 40 years ago and grew to become one of the most infamous cars in history. The thing is that it didn't actually suck. Really.

Even after four decades, what's the first thing that comes to mind when most people think of the Ford Pinto? Ka-BLAM! The truth is the Pinto was more than that — and this is the story of how the exploding Pinto became a pre-apocalyptic narrative, how the myth was exposed, and why you should race one.

The Pinto was CEO Lee Iacocca's baby, a homegrown answer to the threat of compact-sized economy cars from Japan and Germany, the sales of which had grown significantly throughout the 1960s. Iacocca demanded the Pinto cost under $2,000, and weigh under 2,000 pounds. It was an all-hands-on-deck project, and Ford got it done in 25 months from concept to production.

Building its own small car meant Ford's buyers wouldn't have to hew to the Japanese government's size-tamping regulations; Ford would have the freedom to choose its own exterior dimensions and engine sizes based on market needs (as did Chevy with the Vega and AMC with the Gremlin). And people cold dug it.

When it was unveiled in late 1970 (ominously on September 11), US buyers noted the Pinto's pleasant shape — bringing to mind a certain tailless amphibian — and interior layout hinting at a hipster's sunken living room. Some call it one of the ugliest cars ever made, but like fans of Mischa Barton, Pinto lovers care not what others think. With its strong Kent OHV four (a distant cousin of the Lotus TwinCam), the Pinto could at least keep up with its peers, despite its drum brakes and as long as one looked past its Russian-roulette build quality.

But what of the elephant in the Pinto's room? Yes, the whole blowing-up-on-rear-end-impact thing. It all started a little more than a year after the Pinto's arrival.

 

Grimshaw v. Ford Motor Company

On May 28, 1972, Mrs. Lilly Gray and 13-year-old passenger Richard Grimshaw, set out from Anaheim, California toward Barstow in Gray's six-month-old Ford Pinto. Gray had been having trouble with the car since new, returning it to the dealer several times for stalling. After stopping in San Bernardino for gasoline, Gray got back on I-15 and accelerated to around 65 mph. Approaching traffic congestion, she moved from the left lane to the middle lane, where the car suddenly stalled and came to a stop. A 1962 Ford Galaxie, the driver unable to stop or swerve in time, rear-ended the Pinto. The Pinto's gas tank was driven forward, and punctured on the bolts of the differential housing.

As the rear wheel well sections separated from the floor pan, a full tank of fuel sprayed straight into the passenger compartment, which was engulfed in flames. Gray later died from congestive heart failure, a direct result of being nearly incinerated, while Grimshaw was burned severely and left permanently disfigured. Grimshaw and the Gray family sued Ford Motor Company (among others), and after a six-month jury trial, verdicts were returned against Ford Motor Company. Ford did not contest amount of compensatory damages awarded to Grimshaw and the Gray family, and a jury awarded the plaintiffs $125 million, which the judge in the case subsequently reduced to the low seven figures. Other crashes and other lawsuits followed.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Mother Jones and Pinto Madness

In 1977, Mark Dowie, business manager of Mother Jones magazine published an article on the Pinto's "exploding gas tanks." It's the same article in which we first heard the chilling phrase, "How much does Ford think your life is worth?" Dowie had spent days sorting through filing cabinets at the Department of Transportation, examining paperwork Ford had produced as part of a lobbying effort to defeat a federal rear-end collision standard. That's where Dowie uncovered an innocuous-looking memo entitled "Fatalities Associated with Crash-Induced Fuel Leakage and Fires."

The Car Talk blog describes why the memo proved so damning.

In it, Ford's director of auto safety estimated that equipping the Pinto with [an] $11 part would prevent 180 burn deaths, 180 serious burn injuries and 2,100 burned cars, for a total cost of $137 million. Paying out $200,000 per death, $67,000 per injury and $700 per vehicle would cost only $49.15 million.

The government would, in 1978, demand Ford recall the million or so Pintos on the road to deal with the potential for gas-tank punctures. That "smoking gun" memo would become a symbol for corporate callousness and indifference to human life, haunting Ford (and other automakers) for decades. But despite the memo's cold calculations, was Ford characterized fairly as the Kevorkian of automakers?

Perhaps not. In 1991, A Rutgers Law Journal report [PDF] showed the total number of Pinto fires, out of 2 million cars and 10 years of production, stalled at 27. It was no more than any other vehicle, averaged out, and certainly not the thousand or more suggested by Mother Jones.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

The big rebuttal, and vindication?

But what of the so-called "smoking gun" memo Dowie had unearthed? Surely Ford, and Lee Iacocca himself, were part of a ruthless establishment who didn't care if its customers lived or died, right? Well, not really. Remember that the memo was a lobbying document whose audience was intended to be the NHTSA. The memo didn't refer to Pintos, or even Ford products, specifically, but American cars in general. It also considered rollovers not rear-end collisions. And that chilling assignment of value to a human life? Indeed, it was federal regulators who often considered that startling concept in their own deliberations. The value figure used in Ford's memo was the same one regulators had themselves set forth.

In fact, measured by occupant fatalities per million cars in use during 1975 and 1976, the Pinto's safety record compared favorably to other subcompacts like the AMC Gremlin, Chevy Vega, Toyota Corolla and VW Beetle.

And what of Mother Jones' Dowie? As the Car Talk blog points out, Dowie now calls the Pinto, "a fabulous vehicle that got great gas mileage," if not for that one flaw: The legendary "$11 part."

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Pinto Racing Doesn't Suck

Back in 1974, Car and Driver magazine created a Pinto for racing, an exercise to prove brains and common sense were more important than an unlimited budget and superstar power. As Patrick Bedard wrote in the March, 1975 issue of Car and Driver, "It's a great car to drive, this Pinto," referring to the racer the magazine prepared for the Goodrich Radial Challenge, an IMSA-sanctioned road racing series for small sedans.

Why'd they pick a Pinto over, say, a BMW 2002 or AMC Gremlin? Current owner of the prepped Pinto, Fox Motorsports says it was a matter of comparing the car's frontal area, weight, piston displacement, handling, wheel width, and horsepower to other cars of the day that would meet the entry criteria. (Racers like Jerry Walsh had by then already been fielding Pintos in IMSA's "Baby Grand" class.)

Bedard, along with Ron Nash and company procured a 30,000-mile 1972 Pinto two-door to transform. In addition to safety, chassis and differential mods, the team traded a 200-pound IMSA weight penalty for the power gain of Ford's 2.3-liter engine, which Bedard said "tipped the scales" in the Pinto's favor. But according to Bedard, it sounds like the real advantage was in the turns, thanks to some add-ons from Mssrs. Koni and Bilstein.

"The Pinto's advantage was cornering ability," Bedard wrote. "I don't think there was another car in the B. F. Goodrich series that was quicker through the turns on a dry track. The steering is light and quick, and the suspension is direct and predictable in a way that street cars never can be. It never darts over bumps, the axle is perfectly controlled and the suspension doesn't bottom."

Need more proof of the Pinto's lack of suck? Check out the SCCA Washington, DC region's spec-Pinto series.

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My Somewhat Begrudging Apology To Ford Pinto

ford-pinto.jpg

I never thought I’d offer an apology to the Ford Pinto, but I guess I owe it one.

I had a Pinto in the 1970s. Actually, my wife bought it a few months before we got married. The car became sort of a wedding dowry. So did the remaining 80% of the outstanding auto loan.

During a relatively brief ownership, the Pinto’s repair costs exceeded the original price of the car. It wasn’t a question of if it would fail, but when. And where. Sometimes, it simply wouldn’t start in the driveway. Other times, it would conk out at a busy intersection.

It ranks as the worst car I ever had. That was back when some auto makers made quality something like Job 100, certainly not Job 1.

Despite my bad Pinto experience, I suppose an apology is in order because of a recent blog I wrote. It centered on Toyota’s sudden-acceleration problems. But in discussing those, I invoked the memory of exploding Pintos, perpetuating an inaccuracy.

The widespread allegation was that, due to a design flaw, Pinto fuel tanks could readily blow up in rear-end collisions, setting the car and its occupants afire.

People started calling the Pinto “the barbecue that seats four.” And the lawsuits spread like wild fire.

Responding to my blog, a Ford (“I would very much prefer to keep my name out of print”) manager contacted me to set the record straight.

He says exploding Pintos were a myth that an investigation debunked nearly 20 years ago. He cites Gary Schwartz’ 1991 Rutgers Law Review paper that cut through the wild claims and examined what really happened.

Schwartz methodically determined the actual number of Pinto rear-end explosion deaths was not in the thousands, as commonly thought, but 27.

In 1975-76, the Pinto averaged 310 fatalities a year. But the similar-size Toyota Corolla averaged 313, the VW Beetle 374 and the Datsun 1200/210 came in at 405.

Yes, there were cases such as a Pinto exploding while parked on the shoulder of the road and hit from behind by a speeding pickup truck. But fiery rear-end collisions comprised only 0.6% of all fatalities back then, and the Pinto had a lower death rate in that category than the average compact or subcompact, Schwartz said after crunching the numbers. Nor was there anything about the Pinto’s rear-end design that made it particularly unsafe.

Not content to portray the Pinto as an incendiary device, ABC’s 20/20 decided to really heat things up in a 1978 broadcast containing “startling new developments.” ABC breathlessly reported that, not just Pintos, but fullsize Fords could blow up if hit from behind.

20/20 thereupon aired a video, shot by UCLA researchers, showing a Ford sedan getting rear-ended and bursting into flames. A couple of problems with that video:

One, it was shot 10 years earlier.

Two, the UCLA researchers had openly said in a published report that they intentionally rigged the vehicle with an explosive.

That’s because the test was to determine how a crash fire affected the car’s interior, not to show how easily Fords became fire balls. They said they had to use an accelerant because crash blazes on their own are so rare. They had tried to induce a vehicle fire in a crash without using an igniter, but failed.

ABC failed to mention any of that when correspondent Sylvia Chase reported on “Ford’s secret rear-end crash tests.”

We could forgive ABC for that botched reporting job. After all, it was 32 years ago. But a few weeks ago, ABC, in another one of its rigged auto exposes, showed video of a Toyota apparently accelerating on its own.

Turns out, the “runaway” vehicle had help from an associate professor. He built a gizmo with an on-off switch to provide acceleration on demand. Well, at least ABC didn’t show the Toyota slamming into a wall and bursting into flames.

In my blog, I also mentioned that Ford’s woes got worse in the 1970s with the supposed uncovering of an internal memo by a Ford attorney who allegedly calculated it would cost less to pay off wrongful-death suits than to redesign the Pinto.

It became known as the “Ford Pinto memo,” a smoking gun. But Schwartz looked into that, too. He reported the memo did not pertain to Pintos or any Ford products. Instead, it had to do with American vehicles in general.

It dealt with rollovers, not rear-end crashes. It did not address tort liability at all, let alone advocate it as a cheaper alternative to a redesign. It put a value to human life because federal regulators themselves did so.

The memo was meant for regulators’ eyes only. But it was off to the races after Mother Jones magazine got a hold of a copy and reported what wasn’t the case.

The exploding-Pinto myth lives on, largely because more Americans watch 20/20 than read the Rutgers Law Review. One wonders what people will recollect in 2040 about Toyota’s sudden accelerations, which more and more look like driver error and, in some cases, driver shams.

So I guess I owe the Pinto an apology. But it’s half-hearted, because my Pinto gave me much grief, even though, as the Ford manager notes, “it was a cheap car, built long ago and lots of things have changed, almost all for the better.”

Here goes: If I said anything that offended you, Pinto, I’m sorry. And thanks for not blowing up on me.

2.0 ticking noise

Started by yhalkeeiron, September 28, 2014, 07:36:59 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

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amc49

That's why if they set cold the space is so big, the valves extend with temperature to be longer and then they are tighter clearance. Ideally, when engine hot you want maybe .002"-.004", or just enough to make sure valve cannot stick open to lose power and to let oil film not be wiped dry to kill lobes.

The Crane Cams reference to setting valves is great but for V-8s where you cannot see the lobes buried in the vee. These you can easily view the lobe to make the high point exactly opposite the follower contact point and set the valve there. Piece of cake...........

yhalkeeiron

Thanks for all the help. Sorry I wasn't much help. All I know so far is when my motor warms up it seemed like the ticking noise went away. And it takes a while since I'm not using a thermostat. My car is in the body shop getting painted. When she gets out I'm definitely going to figure it out thanks again

yhalkeeiron


amc49

Doesn't matter if valve is adjusted hot or cold so long as you have temperature COMPENSATED for that. If they say set hot, then do so and come back and re-measure the cold numbers and then set them cold using the modded numbers, or set cold and then re-measure at engine hot to set them hot. Most set cold for obvious reasons.

These are easy but big springs can push cam around a bit in the towers to mod the setting a bit. It becomes a nightmare like on motorcycle with 16 valves and cams being pushed all out of dead flat to modify the valve clearances hugely. You get to where you set as close as you can to TDC compression point as the clearance changes all over the base circle when cams move around as other valves force them out of true. Just moving around base circle could vary .003" and easy. Some engines you set as much as .004" too loose intentionally simply to guarantee they are closing at some point since you don't really ever know. I saw engines with up to .003" clearance when running act like valves being held open, a curious phenomenon. It seems that sitting still and running can be very different conditions real world.

I love roller rockers but leery of them 'lasting forever', the needle bearings are hard as sh-t and they will like all hardened rollers pretty much come apart all at once to do massive damage with little warning at all at the end of life, they do not wear slowly to show for a while. Just a thought.............I NEVER trust them 'forever'. The damage them rollers do is never light either. After a certain point I always changed them for insurance. Like connecting rod, the all or nothing at all theorem in practice. If only running stock springload and valve I'd stay with stock rocker, they wear slower and you can watch it play out over longterm time to fix it later. Much less risk there. And heavily used possible 'taxi' rollers? No way would I go there, but then that's me after seeing how much those little bearings can tear up in all kinds of other engines. Now, if one could find a low mile set yeah, fine.

Scott Hamilton

Ahh, ok... Thanks much for the return post. Looks like I'm in the hunt for these and stash them for the next go around. If I find a source for all, I'll post it here.  :)
Yellow 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
Green 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
White 73, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
The Lemon, the Lime and the Coconut, :)

dick1172762

Sorry but as usual, Esslinger is only telling part of the truth. 2.3 rocker arms and 2.0 rocker arms are the same as Esslinger stated, BUT the 2.0 they are talking about is the 2.0 Ranger engine which is a 2.3 that for what ever reason, has a smaller bore with all else the same as a 2.3 Pinto engine. Plain and simple, the 2.3 rocker arms will not work on a non Ranger 2.0 engine. The only part that will fit both is the oil filter. Best bet is to get on a forum from over there (which there are many) and post a wanted ad for the roller rocker arm. There should be many as they were used on taxi's all over that part of the world in the 60s & 70s. Wish you luck, but it will be well worth the hunt. You will never lose a cam with then. If you get the 2.0 roller rocker arms, no cam change will be necessary as they were interchangeable with the stock rocker arms.
Its better to be a has-been, than a never was.

Scott Hamilton

Thanks Dick-
Did some searching and could not find a kit to order from Burton and then I found this from our site...
http://www.fordpinto.com/pintos-wanted/2-0-roller-rockers-valves-etc/
Very good information as well.  Looks like I can use the 2.3 rollers on a 2.0 with a different cam... Looking into now with much interest....
Yellow 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
Green 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
White 73, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
The Lemon, the Lime and the Coconut, :)

dick1172762

Quote from: Scott Hamilton on October 12, 2014, 12:42:07 PM
Yes- I have been told this before... I guess I just don't feel comfortable with this unless I send a head to be reworked and refitted by Ivy Engines where it can be don't right, I know I don't have the skills for this. And to really look at the big picture it might have been less expensive in the long run but looking at what I invested in everything to this point, I don't want to get off this train just yet...  Still so expensive to do this..
:)
The Pinto 2.0 roller rocker arm are a direct drop in with no cam change or any extra parts or skill necessary to install. I used them on stock cams and racing cams with no problems what so ever. Were no different to install than a stock rocker arm. Just remove the old and install the new. Then set the lash and enjoy the peace of mind that this set up will out last the car.
Its better to be a has-been, than a never was.

Scott Hamilton

Quote from: amc49 on October 02, 2014, 12:42:45 PM
If you get wonky abnormal wear on parts they can tick and be dead on apparent clearance. The valve tip to follower wear rather than follower to cam can do it too. The follower tip is radiused, if valve tip wears out of flat to sideways angled the rocker motion can have the follower swing very fast sideways, the rapid motion will tick as it resets with every on/off.

AMC, I did not response to your post until now but I did discuss this with my head guy- I did find the rocker tip wear to be generally centered but there were 3 that were off closer to the tip of the rocker- none past the tip however. I showed this to him when I took it in because of your post. He seemed to key on this and I suspect that is why he replaced all the valves. BUT.. I still have the warn rockers abet them being only ~4K miles on them... do you (or anyone else) think I need to replace the cam and rockers as well since the valves were replaced?
Yellow 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
Green 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
White 73, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
The Lemon, the Lime and the Coconut, :)

Scott Hamilton

Some pictures... Have the game on working on the Pinto... Can't get any better than this!




Yellow 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
Green 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
White 73, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
The Lemon, the Lime and the Coconut, :)

74 PintoWagon

That's the true way of doing it, this way no matter where your cam is timed at when you adjust them they'll always be on the heel.
Art
65 Falcon 2DR 200 IL6 with C4.

Scott Hamilton

Quote from: dick1172762 on October 04, 2014, 11:41:55 AM
Roller rocker arm please.

Yes- I have been told this before... I guess I just don't feel comfortable with this unless I send a head to be reworked and refitted by Ivy Engines where it can be don't right, I know I don't have the skills for this. And to really look at the big picture it might have been less expensive in the long run but looking at what I invested in everything to this point, I don't want to get off this train just yet...  Still so expensive to do this..
:)
Yellow 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
Green 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
White 73, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
The Lemon, the Lime and the Coconut, :)

Scott Hamilton

Have not heard back from yhalkeeiron so I'm going to continue his thread still hoping for his results... :)

I received my Head back from the machine shop and he replaced all the valves and 4 exhaust guides. He still could not guarantee that we don't have an issue and I completely understood. He left the valves for me to adjust and I like that so I can know they are right before I put it back in the car. Was working with the head on the bench today and was really taking my time asking myself all kinds of questions/ double double checking this go around and found something interesting, or so I think.

With the lobe straight up I adjust the valve to spec and started rotating the cam around and found that with the cam lob to one side (not straight up) the gap was greater. Hmmm... This is a new cam from Burton with ~4Kmiles on it already (Detroit Stampede Trip) and the wear looks very normal and passed the machine shop inspection. FYI, all the rockers were kept with the correct lobes on rework. So I'm thinking that the adjustment needs to be correct at 'Base Circle' which would be the lowest point on the cam lob in reference to the center of the cam rod... correct? OK, so that stopped me from adjusting any further and I started worshipping at the Google God extensively and found this on a Crane cams reference site...
**************************************
Setting Valve Lash on Mechanical Cams
All the valves must be set individually and only when the lifter is properly located on the base circle of the lobe. At this position the valve is
closed and there is no lift taking place. How will you know when the valve you are adjusting is in the proper position with the lifter on the base
circle of the cam? This can be accomplished by watching the movement of the valves.
1. When the engine is hot (at operating temperature) remove the valve covers and pick the cylinder you are going to adjust.
2. Hand turn the engine in its normal direction of rotation while watching the exhaust valve on that particular cylinder. When the
exhaust valve begins to open, stop and adjust that cylinder's intake valve. (Why? Because when the exhaust is just beginning to open,
the intake lifter will be on the base circle of the lobe, so the intake is the one we can now adjust.)
3. Use a feeler gauge, set to the correct valve lash, and place it between the tip of the valve stem and rocker arm. Adjust until you
arrive at the proper setting and lock the adjuster in place.
4. After the intake valve has been adjusted, continue to rotate the engine, watching that same intake valve. The intake valve will go to
full lift and then begin to close. When the intake is almost closed, stop and adjust the exhaust valve on that particular cylinder. (Again,
when we see the intake valve almost closed, we are sure that the exhaust lifter is on the base circle of the lobe.) Use the feeler gauge
and follow the procedure described before in step 3.
5. Both valves on this cylinder are now adjusted, so move to your next cylinder and follow the same procedure again. In the future you
may find shortcuts to this method, but it still remains the best way to do the job correctly.
http://www.cranecams.com/pdf-tech-tips/mech-lift.pdf
*********************************************

Now this is odiously talking about a V8 with lifters etc... BUT this looks valid fro our engines too?
I'm thinking that this is a correct way to look at adjusting the 2.0 valves on our Pintos... BUT I have always adjusted them cold... ? This seems to make sense to get the cam in the right position to adjust the gap to the correct spec. Does this translate to our 2.0 in your opinion?

What do you guys think?
Yellow 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
Green 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
White 73, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
The Lemon, the Lime and the Coconut, :)

Scott Hamilton

Quote from: HOSS429 on October 01, 2014, 07:41:45 PM
turn the radio up louder . ;D

Actually, I did this for a while... the ticking noise really grinds on me and I can't relax... It's funny but sometimes it's the only thing to do..
:)
Yellow 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
Green 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
White 73, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
The Lemon, the Lime and the Coconut, :)

amc49

If valve grinding guy worth his salt he has been keeping it on all the time, every time valves are cut he is supposed to record how much off each one to clean face up and then later takes one half that amount off the stem tips to keep all geometry pretty close to dead on. Could be a problem on non-induction hardened exhaust seats though, they will need monster cutting every time you do them. You can lose the head over the seat being so deep nothing fits anymore. Could take so much off exhaust tip that valve gets into lock grooves.

The collapsed tappet gap check would locate you correctly somewhat for a 2.3. On a 2.0 I assume a centered rub patch on rocker arm, not running off one end. Valve tip should not really uncover on end of rocker slot, anything like over halfway is destruction. Cam bearing and guides pretty much can't get off far enough to do harm unless guide dead wore out and valve flopping sideways. I would watch how far up ball has to move to take up clearance, further out is evidence of getting out of shape there. I do not know what the 'brand new' standard would be there though.

dick1172762

Its better to be a has-been, than a never was.

Scott Hamilton

AMC, thanks...

Sounds like this has happened to you before. I was thinking of replacing the ball studs due to the wear- I have always been told that this is not necessary but it's still on my mind. With the head off I see a wear pattern on the rocker pads that look centered but the tips, (what you suggested to look at) are generally centered but some are closer to the tip of the rocker. This looks like a real good suggestion.

Another question for all that a dealing with these old engines- It's likely that most 2.0 heads out there have been redone 2-3 times in the past. Valve seats replaced, reground, ball studs having many different rockers over the years- how do you set everything back to factory and 'know' it's right? All new parts but that leaves the valve guides, seats and cam bearing surfaces as a unknown...

Not to hijack this thread- still very interested in how yhalkeeiron re adjust turns out...
Yellow 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
Green 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
White 73, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
The Lemon, the Lime and the Coconut, :)

amc49

If you get wonky abnormal wear on parts they can tick and be dead on apparent clearance. The valve tip to follower wear rather than follower to cam can do it too. The follower tip is radiused, if valve tip wears out of flat to sideways angled the rocker motion can have the follower swing very fast sideways, the rapid motion will tick as it resets with every on/off.

HOSS429

turn the radio up louder . ;D

Scott Hamilton

Let me know what you find... I have a head I just took off where I could not adjust out the tick... My head guy heard it running and told me it 's time to pull it. I have only 4k mile on a fresh rebuild....  Very interested in what you find...
Yellow 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
Green 72, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
White 73, Runabout, 2000cc, 4Spd
The Lemon, the Lime and the Coconut, :)

yhalkeeiron

Ok thanks I'll go through it again and see what happens

Pinto5.0

Yeah the lash is set with the valve closed. Since the lobe lifts the follower you want the top of the lobe 180 degrees from full opening to set lash
'73 Sedan (I'll get to it)
'76 Wagon driver
'80 hatch(Restoring to be my son's 1st car)~Callisto
'71 half hatch (bucket list Pinto)~Ghost
'72 sedan 5.0/T5~Lemon Squeeze

yhalkeeiron

Ok that would make the valve all the way open correct? How would I be able to check the gap with a filler gauge?

Pinto5.0

Quote from: yhalkeeiron on September 28, 2014, 09:34:54 PM
Ok ill try it again. I did set it one at a time. and the lobe was all the way up. But maybe I miss something

All the way up? It should be down. You want the bottom of the lobe against the follower
'73 Sedan (I'll get to it)
'76 Wagon driver
'80 hatch(Restoring to be my son's 1st car)~Callisto
'71 half hatch (bucket list Pinto)~Ghost
'72 sedan 5.0/T5~Lemon Squeeze

yhalkeeiron

Ok ill try it again. I did set it one at a time. and the lobe was all the way up. But maybe I miss something

Pinto5.0

I agree, do each valve at base & see what happens
'73 Sedan (I'll get to it)
'76 Wagon driver
'80 hatch(Restoring to be my son's 1st car)~Callisto
'71 half hatch (bucket list Pinto)~Ghost
'72 sedan 5.0/T5~Lemon Squeeze

72pair

And do the valves the old fashioned way ie turn each lobe to center base circle and adjust. I had a hipo cam that drove me nuts with the ticking because I was adjusting both valves at TDC on each cylinder. Set the lash a lobe at a time and it purred! 
72 sedan 2.0, c-4 beater now hot 2.0, 4-speed
72 sedan 2.3, t-5, 8" running project
80 Bobcat hatchback 2.3, 4-spd, 97K

yhalkeeiron

I did the intake at 008 and the  exhaust at .010 and still a slight ticking noise. The engine is running nice and smooth

amc49

Run the rockers..............

yhalkeeiron

My Pinto seems to be making a slight ticking noise at idle speeds it sounds like it's coming from the valve cover please help if anyone might know what it could be thanks