Mini Classifieds

Floor pans for my 1975 Pinto Sedan
Date: 12/09/2016 08:34 am
Wanted Pinto Fiberglass Body Parts
Date: 08/16/2018 08:54 am
Wanted Pinto Fiberglass Body Parts
Date: 08/16/2018 08:54 am
1980 Pinto for sale

Date: 11/24/2016 06:32 pm
Looking for leaf spring insulators
Date: 04/04/2020 09:38 am
Drivers side door panel Orange
Date: 05/22/2018 02:27 pm
Clutch pedal needed
Date: 01/11/2024 06:31 am
Wanted Postal Pinto
Date: 09/26/2019 05:31 pm
1971 2.0 valve cover
Date: 01/25/2019 07:09 pm

Why the Ford Pinto didn’t suck

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suckThe Ford Pinto was born a low-rent, stumpy thing in Dearborn 40 years ago and grew to become one of the most infamous cars in history. The thing is that it didn't actually suck. Really.

Even after four decades, what's the first thing that comes to mind when most people think of the Ford Pinto? Ka-BLAM! The truth is the Pinto was more than that — and this is the story of how the exploding Pinto became a pre-apocalyptic narrative, how the myth was exposed, and why you should race one.

The Pinto was CEO Lee Iacocca's baby, a homegrown answer to the threat of compact-sized economy cars from Japan and Germany, the sales of which had grown significantly throughout the 1960s. Iacocca demanded the Pinto cost under $2,000, and weigh under 2,000 pounds. It was an all-hands-on-deck project, and Ford got it done in 25 months from concept to production.

Building its own small car meant Ford's buyers wouldn't have to hew to the Japanese government's size-tamping regulations; Ford would have the freedom to choose its own exterior dimensions and engine sizes based on market needs (as did Chevy with the Vega and AMC with the Gremlin). And people cold dug it.

When it was unveiled in late 1970 (ominously on September 11), US buyers noted the Pinto's pleasant shape — bringing to mind a certain tailless amphibian — and interior layout hinting at a hipster's sunken living room. Some call it one of the ugliest cars ever made, but like fans of Mischa Barton, Pinto lovers care not what others think. With its strong Kent OHV four (a distant cousin of the Lotus TwinCam), the Pinto could at least keep up with its peers, despite its drum brakes and as long as one looked past its Russian-roulette build quality.

But what of the elephant in the Pinto's room? Yes, the whole blowing-up-on-rear-end-impact thing. It all started a little more than a year after the Pinto's arrival.

 

Grimshaw v. Ford Motor Company

On May 28, 1972, Mrs. Lilly Gray and 13-year-old passenger Richard Grimshaw, set out from Anaheim, California toward Barstow in Gray's six-month-old Ford Pinto. Gray had been having trouble with the car since new, returning it to the dealer several times for stalling. After stopping in San Bernardino for gasoline, Gray got back on I-15 and accelerated to around 65 mph. Approaching traffic congestion, she moved from the left lane to the middle lane, where the car suddenly stalled and came to a stop. A 1962 Ford Galaxie, the driver unable to stop or swerve in time, rear-ended the Pinto. The Pinto's gas tank was driven forward, and punctured on the bolts of the differential housing.

As the rear wheel well sections separated from the floor pan, a full tank of fuel sprayed straight into the passenger compartment, which was engulfed in flames. Gray later died from congestive heart failure, a direct result of being nearly incinerated, while Grimshaw was burned severely and left permanently disfigured. Grimshaw and the Gray family sued Ford Motor Company (among others), and after a six-month jury trial, verdicts were returned against Ford Motor Company. Ford did not contest amount of compensatory damages awarded to Grimshaw and the Gray family, and a jury awarded the plaintiffs $125 million, which the judge in the case subsequently reduced to the low seven figures. Other crashes and other lawsuits followed.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Mother Jones and Pinto Madness

In 1977, Mark Dowie, business manager of Mother Jones magazine published an article on the Pinto's "exploding gas tanks." It's the same article in which we first heard the chilling phrase, "How much does Ford think your life is worth?" Dowie had spent days sorting through filing cabinets at the Department of Transportation, examining paperwork Ford had produced as part of a lobbying effort to defeat a federal rear-end collision standard. That's where Dowie uncovered an innocuous-looking memo entitled "Fatalities Associated with Crash-Induced Fuel Leakage and Fires."

The Car Talk blog describes why the memo proved so damning.

In it, Ford's director of auto safety estimated that equipping the Pinto with [an] $11 part would prevent 180 burn deaths, 180 serious burn injuries and 2,100 burned cars, for a total cost of $137 million. Paying out $200,000 per death, $67,000 per injury and $700 per vehicle would cost only $49.15 million.

The government would, in 1978, demand Ford recall the million or so Pintos on the road to deal with the potential for gas-tank punctures. That "smoking gun" memo would become a symbol for corporate callousness and indifference to human life, haunting Ford (and other automakers) for decades. But despite the memo's cold calculations, was Ford characterized fairly as the Kevorkian of automakers?

Perhaps not. In 1991, A Rutgers Law Journal report [PDF] showed the total number of Pinto fires, out of 2 million cars and 10 years of production, stalled at 27. It was no more than any other vehicle, averaged out, and certainly not the thousand or more suggested by Mother Jones.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

The big rebuttal, and vindication?

But what of the so-called "smoking gun" memo Dowie had unearthed? Surely Ford, and Lee Iacocca himself, were part of a ruthless establishment who didn't care if its customers lived or died, right? Well, not really. Remember that the memo was a lobbying document whose audience was intended to be the NHTSA. The memo didn't refer to Pintos, or even Ford products, specifically, but American cars in general. It also considered rollovers not rear-end collisions. And that chilling assignment of value to a human life? Indeed, it was federal regulators who often considered that startling concept in their own deliberations. The value figure used in Ford's memo was the same one regulators had themselves set forth.

In fact, measured by occupant fatalities per million cars in use during 1975 and 1976, the Pinto's safety record compared favorably to other subcompacts like the AMC Gremlin, Chevy Vega, Toyota Corolla and VW Beetle.

And what of Mother Jones' Dowie? As the Car Talk blog points out, Dowie now calls the Pinto, "a fabulous vehicle that got great gas mileage," if not for that one flaw: The legendary "$11 part."

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Pinto Racing Doesn't Suck

Back in 1974, Car and Driver magazine created a Pinto for racing, an exercise to prove brains and common sense were more important than an unlimited budget and superstar power. As Patrick Bedard wrote in the March, 1975 issue of Car and Driver, "It's a great car to drive, this Pinto," referring to the racer the magazine prepared for the Goodrich Radial Challenge, an IMSA-sanctioned road racing series for small sedans.

Why'd they pick a Pinto over, say, a BMW 2002 or AMC Gremlin? Current owner of the prepped Pinto, Fox Motorsports says it was a matter of comparing the car's frontal area, weight, piston displacement, handling, wheel width, and horsepower to other cars of the day that would meet the entry criteria. (Racers like Jerry Walsh had by then already been fielding Pintos in IMSA's "Baby Grand" class.)

Bedard, along with Ron Nash and company procured a 30,000-mile 1972 Pinto two-door to transform. In addition to safety, chassis and differential mods, the team traded a 200-pound IMSA weight penalty for the power gain of Ford's 2.3-liter engine, which Bedard said "tipped the scales" in the Pinto's favor. But according to Bedard, it sounds like the real advantage was in the turns, thanks to some add-ons from Mssrs. Koni and Bilstein.

"The Pinto's advantage was cornering ability," Bedard wrote. "I don't think there was another car in the B. F. Goodrich series that was quicker through the turns on a dry track. The steering is light and quick, and the suspension is direct and predictable in a way that street cars never can be. It never darts over bumps, the axle is perfectly controlled and the suspension doesn't bottom."

Need more proof of the Pinto's lack of suck? Check out the SCCA Washington, DC region's spec-Pinto series.

Members
  • Total Members: 7,895
  • Latest: tdok
Stats
  • Total Posts: 139,581
  • Total Topics: 16,270
  • Online today: 1,459
  • Online ever: 3,214 (June 20, 2025, 10:48:59 AM)
Users Online
  • Users: 0
  • Guests: 85
  • Total: 85
F&I...more

My Somewhat Begrudging Apology To Ford Pinto

ford-pinto.jpg

I never thought I’d offer an apology to the Ford Pinto, but I guess I owe it one.

I had a Pinto in the 1970s. Actually, my wife bought it a few months before we got married. The car became sort of a wedding dowry. So did the remaining 80% of the outstanding auto loan.

During a relatively brief ownership, the Pinto’s repair costs exceeded the original price of the car. It wasn’t a question of if it would fail, but when. And where. Sometimes, it simply wouldn’t start in the driveway. Other times, it would conk out at a busy intersection.

It ranks as the worst car I ever had. That was back when some auto makers made quality something like Job 100, certainly not Job 1.

Despite my bad Pinto experience, I suppose an apology is in order because of a recent blog I wrote. It centered on Toyota’s sudden-acceleration problems. But in discussing those, I invoked the memory of exploding Pintos, perpetuating an inaccuracy.

The widespread allegation was that, due to a design flaw, Pinto fuel tanks could readily blow up in rear-end collisions, setting the car and its occupants afire.

People started calling the Pinto “the barbecue that seats four.” And the lawsuits spread like wild fire.

Responding to my blog, a Ford (“I would very much prefer to keep my name out of print”) manager contacted me to set the record straight.

He says exploding Pintos were a myth that an investigation debunked nearly 20 years ago. He cites Gary Schwartz’ 1991 Rutgers Law Review paper that cut through the wild claims and examined what really happened.

Schwartz methodically determined the actual number of Pinto rear-end explosion deaths was not in the thousands, as commonly thought, but 27.

In 1975-76, the Pinto averaged 310 fatalities a year. But the similar-size Toyota Corolla averaged 313, the VW Beetle 374 and the Datsun 1200/210 came in at 405.

Yes, there were cases such as a Pinto exploding while parked on the shoulder of the road and hit from behind by a speeding pickup truck. But fiery rear-end collisions comprised only 0.6% of all fatalities back then, and the Pinto had a lower death rate in that category than the average compact or subcompact, Schwartz said after crunching the numbers. Nor was there anything about the Pinto’s rear-end design that made it particularly unsafe.

Not content to portray the Pinto as an incendiary device, ABC’s 20/20 decided to really heat things up in a 1978 broadcast containing “startling new developments.” ABC breathlessly reported that, not just Pintos, but fullsize Fords could blow up if hit from behind.

20/20 thereupon aired a video, shot by UCLA researchers, showing a Ford sedan getting rear-ended and bursting into flames. A couple of problems with that video:

One, it was shot 10 years earlier.

Two, the UCLA researchers had openly said in a published report that they intentionally rigged the vehicle with an explosive.

That’s because the test was to determine how a crash fire affected the car’s interior, not to show how easily Fords became fire balls. They said they had to use an accelerant because crash blazes on their own are so rare. They had tried to induce a vehicle fire in a crash without using an igniter, but failed.

ABC failed to mention any of that when correspondent Sylvia Chase reported on “Ford’s secret rear-end crash tests.”

We could forgive ABC for that botched reporting job. After all, it was 32 years ago. But a few weeks ago, ABC, in another one of its rigged auto exposes, showed video of a Toyota apparently accelerating on its own.

Turns out, the “runaway” vehicle had help from an associate professor. He built a gizmo with an on-off switch to provide acceleration on demand. Well, at least ABC didn’t show the Toyota slamming into a wall and bursting into flames.

In my blog, I also mentioned that Ford’s woes got worse in the 1970s with the supposed uncovering of an internal memo by a Ford attorney who allegedly calculated it would cost less to pay off wrongful-death suits than to redesign the Pinto.

It became known as the “Ford Pinto memo,” a smoking gun. But Schwartz looked into that, too. He reported the memo did not pertain to Pintos or any Ford products. Instead, it had to do with American vehicles in general.

It dealt with rollovers, not rear-end crashes. It did not address tort liability at all, let alone advocate it as a cheaper alternative to a redesign. It put a value to human life because federal regulators themselves did so.

The memo was meant for regulators’ eyes only. But it was off to the races after Mother Jones magazine got a hold of a copy and reported what wasn’t the case.

The exploding-Pinto myth lives on, largely because more Americans watch 20/20 than read the Rutgers Law Review. One wonders what people will recollect in 2040 about Toyota’s sudden accelerations, which more and more look like driver error and, in some cases, driver shams.

So I guess I owe the Pinto an apology. But it’s half-hearted, because my Pinto gave me much grief, even though, as the Ford manager notes, “it was a cheap car, built long ago and lots of things have changed, almost all for the better.”

Here goes: If I said anything that offended you, Pinto, I’m sorry. And thanks for not blowing up on me.

Yellow Rose Ford meet in Ft. Worth, Texas - NO PINTOS

Started by popbumper, August 09, 2008, 03:43:17 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

popbumper

Well then, good grief, y'all come down to Texas, and we'll build us a monster garage out in a big 'ol field. You won't have a heating bill down here - we get the heat for free - but the air conditioning bill might kill ya  :laugh:!

Chris
Restoring a 1976 MPG wagon - purchased 6/08

Cookieboystoys

Quote from: Pintony on August 11, 2008, 10:46:43 PM
Hey Cookieboy,
I'll go-in 1/2 zees with you but it will have to be a bit farther south!!!

if we go 1/2 zees... we'll need one that fit's 40! because we know the only reason we don't have more is because we don't have room. And... if the building is that big! we'll need to think farther south so we can work year round and not have a heat bill  :lol:
It's all about the Pintos! Baby!

Cookieboystoys

Quote from: Pintony on August 11, 2008, 08:47:58 AM
You will need to build a garage just to store your trophys soon!!!

Thanks Chris and Tony,

I don't know about a garage for the trophys... small shelf maybe  ;)

I keep getting Beat! by the VW Bugs! (hear that dangerusdug!)

If I'm gonna build a garage... will need to hold 20! Pintos!!  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

with a paint booth and hoist, lots of air tools, welding supplies.... the list goes one....

but let's get back on topic here.... bring them Pinto's to the shows. I've been to many shows over the last couple years and it is OK! to bring a less than perfect/show car for the local get togethers. I have brought my less than perfect cars (when I can find drivers) and people comment and like to see them too....

My Pinto at the show --> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TaXRPm9oAl0
It's all about the Pintos! Baby!

popbumper

Restoring a 1976 MPG wagon - purchased 6/08

Cookieboystoys

Quote from: Smeed on August 10, 2008, 09:05:43 PM
I went to 2 local shows and no pintos either.

same here... only time you see more than 1 Pinto is when I can find a driver for one of the other cars.

This weekend I got a trophy for 2nd place in 1966-1987 non-stock with the 1973

I am starting to see a few VW's, Pacers, Gremlins, etc.... so far I'm the only Pinto in the area willing to go to the shows.
It's all about the Pintos! Baby!

Smeed

I went to 2 local shows and no pintos either. We gotta pull all of these cars from barns and garages and get them winning some medals  :) Although, I do like having something most people dont see every day.

'73 runabout

popbumper

Dick:

  You bet! Had no idea you were in the DFW area, sorry!

Chris
Restoring a 1976 MPG wagon - purchased 6/08

71pintoracer

I went to an all-Ford car show a few years ago at a place called Auto Krafters,  they sell resto parts) and they didn't have a class to put my Pinto in!  :wow:
If you don't have time to do it right, when will you have time to do it over?

dick1172762

Chris! Put me on your list for next years show too. On another note, have you found any Pintos in the local junk yards? I need a front bumper for my 80 model. I hate to try getting one shiped in, due to the freight cost. Let me know if you see one when your out looking for parts. Thanks.
Its better to be a has-been, than a never was.

popbumper

Pintaro: You got it!  Would love to hav eyou out, yours would be the talk of the show!

Fastbak390 - show? In PLANO? Dog, I am in Richardson, I used to live in Plano! Next time something comes up. please let me know. Come on out sometime and see the wagon. I am getting it done slowly....will get full steam on ot once the heat dies down.

Chris
Restoring a 1976 MPG wagon - purchased 6/08

fastbak390

I'm carrying the Pinto torch at several Dallas area car meets. I don't enter shows yet since mine desperately needs a paint job, but that'll happen soon enough. Hopefully we can make it a two man team.

Here's a pic from the Monday night Plano meet. There was a REALLY nice Mustang II out there a few weeks ago.


1971 Trunk 2.0 - (mostly) AK Miller Turbo Setup

Pintaro

popbumper,let me know next year.I can make it to Fort Worth in about 3 hours.Maybe I can bring the Poison Pinto.I have family all around there too.
                                                                      Pintaro

gordie

More of us need to get our Pinto's out to show the world how great they are!  That is a tall order in Southern CA as there are probably six events to choose from each weekend. Also there are cruise nights in different locations every night and if you want to drive full time going to car events you could almost do it here!

popbumper

Just got back from the show held at the Amon Carter facility (near Will Rogers center), attended today with my family. This show is an all-Ford show which was hosted by the North Texas Mustang club, so you guessed it - there were droves of Mustangs in all flavors. My favorite(s) were the two '71 Mach 1's (owned by the same guy), one in "Pewter" and one in Grabber Lime. Absolutely top notch restorations.

Amid the many other 65-70 models were a lot of interesting modified cars, all with their share of big motors, body accents, and wild paint schemes. There was also a section of Thunderbirds, Cougars, Fairlanes, Panteras, GT's, Model A's, Torinos, and Falcons. There was a smattering of 90's models mustangs (b-o-r-i-n-g, sorry, I hate them, Ford REALLY got its act together with the new models), but no Mustang II's (gee, that's 'cause guys like us love to pull them aparrt for the front end suspensions).  :lol:

Interestingly, there was also a single '76 Maverick Stallion - it was the first of it's kind I had ever seen up close and live, in red and black. There was even a single Ford Focus that someone had meticulously repainted, built up, and detailed. Not my thing, but hey....

And, you also guessed it - NO PINTOS. Man, I am just so disappointed to see the lack of Pintos represented nowadays, especially in an all-Ford show. I mentioned to several people that I had I Pinto wagon I was working on, and thier eyes lit up. They suggested that next year I DEFINITELY bring it as it would be a really neat car to see.

So there's the plan. If I gotta be the only guy in Texas to have a Pinto at a big local car show, I'll do it. I can't wait.

Chris

Restoring a 1976 MPG wagon - purchased 6/08