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Runabout rear window '73 to 80.
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Various parts for 1980 Pony (good to N.O.S. condition
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Beautiful 1980 Pinto

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hubcaps

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1971 Pinto Runabout turn key driver

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Steering Wheel Needed for 1972 Pinto
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Why the Ford Pinto didn’t suck

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suckThe Ford Pinto was born a low-rent, stumpy thing in Dearborn 40 years ago and grew to become one of the most infamous cars in history. The thing is that it didn't actually suck. Really.

Even after four decades, what's the first thing that comes to mind when most people think of the Ford Pinto? Ka-BLAM! The truth is the Pinto was more than that — and this is the story of how the exploding Pinto became a pre-apocalyptic narrative, how the myth was exposed, and why you should race one.

The Pinto was CEO Lee Iacocca's baby, a homegrown answer to the threat of compact-sized economy cars from Japan and Germany, the sales of which had grown significantly throughout the 1960s. Iacocca demanded the Pinto cost under $2,000, and weigh under 2,000 pounds. It was an all-hands-on-deck project, and Ford got it done in 25 months from concept to production.

Building its own small car meant Ford's buyers wouldn't have to hew to the Japanese government's size-tamping regulations; Ford would have the freedom to choose its own exterior dimensions and engine sizes based on market needs (as did Chevy with the Vega and AMC with the Gremlin). And people cold dug it.

When it was unveiled in late 1970 (ominously on September 11), US buyers noted the Pinto's pleasant shape — bringing to mind a certain tailless amphibian — and interior layout hinting at a hipster's sunken living room. Some call it one of the ugliest cars ever made, but like fans of Mischa Barton, Pinto lovers care not what others think. With its strong Kent OHV four (a distant cousin of the Lotus TwinCam), the Pinto could at least keep up with its peers, despite its drum brakes and as long as one looked past its Russian-roulette build quality.

But what of the elephant in the Pinto's room? Yes, the whole blowing-up-on-rear-end-impact thing. It all started a little more than a year after the Pinto's arrival.

 

Grimshaw v. Ford Motor Company

On May 28, 1972, Mrs. Lilly Gray and 13-year-old passenger Richard Grimshaw, set out from Anaheim, California toward Barstow in Gray's six-month-old Ford Pinto. Gray had been having trouble with the car since new, returning it to the dealer several times for stalling. After stopping in San Bernardino for gasoline, Gray got back on I-15 and accelerated to around 65 mph. Approaching traffic congestion, she moved from the left lane to the middle lane, where the car suddenly stalled and came to a stop. A 1962 Ford Galaxie, the driver unable to stop or swerve in time, rear-ended the Pinto. The Pinto's gas tank was driven forward, and punctured on the bolts of the differential housing.

As the rear wheel well sections separated from the floor pan, a full tank of fuel sprayed straight into the passenger compartment, which was engulfed in flames. Gray later died from congestive heart failure, a direct result of being nearly incinerated, while Grimshaw was burned severely and left permanently disfigured. Grimshaw and the Gray family sued Ford Motor Company (among others), and after a six-month jury trial, verdicts were returned against Ford Motor Company. Ford did not contest amount of compensatory damages awarded to Grimshaw and the Gray family, and a jury awarded the plaintiffs $125 million, which the judge in the case subsequently reduced to the low seven figures. Other crashes and other lawsuits followed.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Mother Jones and Pinto Madness

In 1977, Mark Dowie, business manager of Mother Jones magazine published an article on the Pinto's "exploding gas tanks." It's the same article in which we first heard the chilling phrase, "How much does Ford think your life is worth?" Dowie had spent days sorting through filing cabinets at the Department of Transportation, examining paperwork Ford had produced as part of a lobbying effort to defeat a federal rear-end collision standard. That's where Dowie uncovered an innocuous-looking memo entitled "Fatalities Associated with Crash-Induced Fuel Leakage and Fires."

The Car Talk blog describes why the memo proved so damning.

In it, Ford's director of auto safety estimated that equipping the Pinto with [an] $11 part would prevent 180 burn deaths, 180 serious burn injuries and 2,100 burned cars, for a total cost of $137 million. Paying out $200,000 per death, $67,000 per injury and $700 per vehicle would cost only $49.15 million.

The government would, in 1978, demand Ford recall the million or so Pintos on the road to deal with the potential for gas-tank punctures. That "smoking gun" memo would become a symbol for corporate callousness and indifference to human life, haunting Ford (and other automakers) for decades. But despite the memo's cold calculations, was Ford characterized fairly as the Kevorkian of automakers?

Perhaps not. In 1991, A Rutgers Law Journal report [PDF] showed the total number of Pinto fires, out of 2 million cars and 10 years of production, stalled at 27. It was no more than any other vehicle, averaged out, and certainly not the thousand or more suggested by Mother Jones.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

The big rebuttal, and vindication?

But what of the so-called "smoking gun" memo Dowie had unearthed? Surely Ford, and Lee Iacocca himself, were part of a ruthless establishment who didn't care if its customers lived or died, right? Well, not really. Remember that the memo was a lobbying document whose audience was intended to be the NHTSA. The memo didn't refer to Pintos, or even Ford products, specifically, but American cars in general. It also considered rollovers not rear-end collisions. And that chilling assignment of value to a human life? Indeed, it was federal regulators who often considered that startling concept in their own deliberations. The value figure used in Ford's memo was the same one regulators had themselves set forth.

In fact, measured by occupant fatalities per million cars in use during 1975 and 1976, the Pinto's safety record compared favorably to other subcompacts like the AMC Gremlin, Chevy Vega, Toyota Corolla and VW Beetle.

And what of Mother Jones' Dowie? As the Car Talk blog points out, Dowie now calls the Pinto, "a fabulous vehicle that got great gas mileage," if not for that one flaw: The legendary "$11 part."

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Pinto Racing Doesn't Suck

Back in 1974, Car and Driver magazine created a Pinto for racing, an exercise to prove brains and common sense were more important than an unlimited budget and superstar power. As Patrick Bedard wrote in the March, 1975 issue of Car and Driver, "It's a great car to drive, this Pinto," referring to the racer the magazine prepared for the Goodrich Radial Challenge, an IMSA-sanctioned road racing series for small sedans.

Why'd they pick a Pinto over, say, a BMW 2002 or AMC Gremlin? Current owner of the prepped Pinto, Fox Motorsports says it was a matter of comparing the car's frontal area, weight, piston displacement, handling, wheel width, and horsepower to other cars of the day that would meet the entry criteria. (Racers like Jerry Walsh had by then already been fielding Pintos in IMSA's "Baby Grand" class.)

Bedard, along with Ron Nash and company procured a 30,000-mile 1972 Pinto two-door to transform. In addition to safety, chassis and differential mods, the team traded a 200-pound IMSA weight penalty for the power gain of Ford's 2.3-liter engine, which Bedard said "tipped the scales" in the Pinto's favor. But according to Bedard, it sounds like the real advantage was in the turns, thanks to some add-ons from Mssrs. Koni and Bilstein.

"The Pinto's advantage was cornering ability," Bedard wrote. "I don't think there was another car in the B. F. Goodrich series that was quicker through the turns on a dry track. The steering is light and quick, and the suspension is direct and predictable in a way that street cars never can be. It never darts over bumps, the axle is perfectly controlled and the suspension doesn't bottom."

Need more proof of the Pinto's lack of suck? Check out the SCCA Washington, DC region's spec-Pinto series.

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My Somewhat Begrudging Apology To Ford Pinto

ford-pinto.jpg

I never thought I’d offer an apology to the Ford Pinto, but I guess I owe it one.

I had a Pinto in the 1970s. Actually, my wife bought it a few months before we got married. The car became sort of a wedding dowry. So did the remaining 80% of the outstanding auto loan.

During a relatively brief ownership, the Pinto’s repair costs exceeded the original price of the car. It wasn’t a question of if it would fail, but when. And where. Sometimes, it simply wouldn’t start in the driveway. Other times, it would conk out at a busy intersection.

It ranks as the worst car I ever had. That was back when some auto makers made quality something like Job 100, certainly not Job 1.

Despite my bad Pinto experience, I suppose an apology is in order because of a recent blog I wrote. It centered on Toyota’s sudden-acceleration problems. But in discussing those, I invoked the memory of exploding Pintos, perpetuating an inaccuracy.

The widespread allegation was that, due to a design flaw, Pinto fuel tanks could readily blow up in rear-end collisions, setting the car and its occupants afire.

People started calling the Pinto “the barbecue that seats four.” And the lawsuits spread like wild fire.

Responding to my blog, a Ford (“I would very much prefer to keep my name out of print”) manager contacted me to set the record straight.

He says exploding Pintos were a myth that an investigation debunked nearly 20 years ago. He cites Gary Schwartz’ 1991 Rutgers Law Review paper that cut through the wild claims and examined what really happened.

Schwartz methodically determined the actual number of Pinto rear-end explosion deaths was not in the thousands, as commonly thought, but 27.

In 1975-76, the Pinto averaged 310 fatalities a year. But the similar-size Toyota Corolla averaged 313, the VW Beetle 374 and the Datsun 1200/210 came in at 405.

Yes, there were cases such as a Pinto exploding while parked on the shoulder of the road and hit from behind by a speeding pickup truck. But fiery rear-end collisions comprised only 0.6% of all fatalities back then, and the Pinto had a lower death rate in that category than the average compact or subcompact, Schwartz said after crunching the numbers. Nor was there anything about the Pinto’s rear-end design that made it particularly unsafe.

Not content to portray the Pinto as an incendiary device, ABC’s 20/20 decided to really heat things up in a 1978 broadcast containing “startling new developments.” ABC breathlessly reported that, not just Pintos, but fullsize Fords could blow up if hit from behind.

20/20 thereupon aired a video, shot by UCLA researchers, showing a Ford sedan getting rear-ended and bursting into flames. A couple of problems with that video:

One, it was shot 10 years earlier.

Two, the UCLA researchers had openly said in a published report that they intentionally rigged the vehicle with an explosive.

That’s because the test was to determine how a crash fire affected the car’s interior, not to show how easily Fords became fire balls. They said they had to use an accelerant because crash blazes on their own are so rare. They had tried to induce a vehicle fire in a crash without using an igniter, but failed.

ABC failed to mention any of that when correspondent Sylvia Chase reported on “Ford’s secret rear-end crash tests.”

We could forgive ABC for that botched reporting job. After all, it was 32 years ago. But a few weeks ago, ABC, in another one of its rigged auto exposes, showed video of a Toyota apparently accelerating on its own.

Turns out, the “runaway” vehicle had help from an associate professor. He built a gizmo with an on-off switch to provide acceleration on demand. Well, at least ABC didn’t show the Toyota slamming into a wall and bursting into flames.

In my blog, I also mentioned that Ford’s woes got worse in the 1970s with the supposed uncovering of an internal memo by a Ford attorney who allegedly calculated it would cost less to pay off wrongful-death suits than to redesign the Pinto.

It became known as the “Ford Pinto memo,” a smoking gun. But Schwartz looked into that, too. He reported the memo did not pertain to Pintos or any Ford products. Instead, it had to do with American vehicles in general.

It dealt with rollovers, not rear-end crashes. It did not address tort liability at all, let alone advocate it as a cheaper alternative to a redesign. It put a value to human life because federal regulators themselves did so.

The memo was meant for regulators’ eyes only. But it was off to the races after Mother Jones magazine got a hold of a copy and reported what wasn’t the case.

The exploding-Pinto myth lives on, largely because more Americans watch 20/20 than read the Rutgers Law Review. One wonders what people will recollect in 2040 about Toyota’s sudden accelerations, which more and more look like driver error and, in some cases, driver shams.

So I guess I owe the Pinto an apology. But it’s half-hearted, because my Pinto gave me much grief, even though, as the Ford manager notes, “it was a cheap car, built long ago and lots of things have changed, almost all for the better.”

Here goes: If I said anything that offended you, Pinto, I’m sorry. And thanks for not blowing up on me.

Adding up to 2018 (a Pinto age retrospective)

Started by Wittsend, January 02, 2018, 09:49:29 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

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blupinto

lol Too much math.  Anyway, my Pinto is older than me (I'm 45). She is 47 and in better shape than I am! lol
One can never have too many Pintos!

72DutchWagon

Hmm,  nobody noticed that the "Bentley" in the picture is a 2001-2003 repro (sort of) of the classics?

While the dohc twin camshaft turned up in about  1988, different Ford models in different markets didn't all get the new engine that year. This explains the availability of the Pinto 2.0 in some engine bays till 1994. See for yourself what could be found in Transit engine bays at http://fordtransit.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=107091 .
According to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Transit the DOHC was introduced in the Transit in 1994.
In Brisca F2 racing, it took until 2015 before the Zetec was allowed to be used next to/take over from  the Pinto.

Pintosopher

Quote from: 72DutchWagon on January 04, 2018, 03:06:18 PM
To start off, all the best for the New Year to everyone!
Now let me see,  according to Wittsend's math; I'm from 63, plus legal driving age here 18 = 81, minus age Donkey (2018-1972=) 46, makes 1935.
Would I, as an 18 year old in 81 be interested in anything  on wheels from 35?
Well, one car comes to mind.
I think I've always loved these dinosaurs.
I remember several years ago being passed on the freeway  in normal weekday traffic by one of these going about 80 mph.  Now that makes an impression on a guy.

Oh, and last year for 2.0L EAO in Europe was 1994 (Ford Transit van), so youngest engine is 24 years old.
Engine parts still widely available.
Wasn't that Transit motor a 2.0 L 8valve  twin cam?
Yes, it is possible to study and become a master of Pintosophy.. Not a religion , nothing less than a life quest for non conformity and rational thought. What Horse did you ride in on?

Check my Pinto Poems out...

72DutchWagon

To start off, all the best for the New Year to everyone!
Now let me see,  according to Wittsend's math; I'm from 63, plus legal driving age here 18 = 81, minus age Donkey (2018-1972=) 46, makes 1935.
Would I, as an 18 year old in 81 be interested in anything  on wheels from 35?
Well, one car comes to mind.
I think I've always loved these dinosaurs.
I remember several years ago being passed on the freeway  in normal weekday traffic by one of these going about 80 mph.  Now that makes an impression on a guy.

Oh, and last year for 2.0L EAO in Europe was 1994 (Ford Transit van), so youngest engine is 24 years old.
Engine parts still widely available.

dick1172762

More like a rats tail and very hard to catch for any improvement. The horse in "horsepower" is very hard to catch some times too!
Its better to be a has-been, than a never was.

Pintosopher

Quote from: dick1172762 on January 03, 2018, 04:58:45 PM
  NO WAY! 1934 was the year of the 100 mph V8 Ford which was Bonnie and Clyde most used get away car. Clyde wrote a letter to Henry Ford thanking him for such a fast car. Was also the year I first saw day light. Don't use me for a reference point as I lie a lot and a real lot when it comes to racing cars. Did I ever tell you about the time I won the Daytona 500? Well set back, get your feet off the floor, and get ready for one hell of a story.
Does this mean it's a "Dickensian Tale"  "Please sir, may I have more Horsepower?"
Yes, it is possible to study and become a master of Pintosophy.. Not a religion , nothing less than a life quest for non conformity and rational thought. What Horse did you ride in on?

Check my Pinto Poems out...

Pintosopher

Quote from: dick1172762 on January 04, 2018, 10:45:14 AM
The 1929 Ford was a neat car and very doable being made into a hot rod 10 years or so after it was made. I had several in the 50's including one with a V8 flat head Ford engine. Was a great time for a gearhead.
Yep, I had a Flat head once, Then they put me in School and all my hair started  to fall out ;D
Yes, it is possible to study and become a master of Pintosophy.. Not a religion , nothing less than a life quest for non conformity and rational thought. What Horse did you ride in on?

Check my Pinto Poems out...

dick1172762

The 1929 Ford was a neat car and very doable being made into a hot rod 10 years or so after it was made. I had several in the 50's including one with a V8 flat head Ford engine. Was a great time for a gearhead.
Its better to be a has-been, than a never was.

Pintosopher

Sorry, but if I use your formula , I wind up with a 1929 Ford ,Possibly a Tractor with steel wheels! :o
Yes, it is possible to study and become a master of Pintosophy.. Not a religion , nothing less than a life quest for non conformity and rational thought. What Horse did you ride in on?

Check my Pinto Poems out...

Wittsend

Quote from: pintosopher on January 04, 2018, 07:25:38 AM
Well, when I entered the world, Dick was a Frisky young guy with racing intentions and possibly a licensed driver ;) But I digress, Dick might be more famous than Teddy Roosevelt. and his mug should be on Mt. Rushmore ;D

Or, maybe Mt. Race-more! :-)

Wittsend

Quote from: dick1172762 on January 03, 2018, 04:58:45 PM
  NO WAY! 1934 was the year of the 100 mph V8 Ford which was Bonnie and Clyde most used get away car. Clyde wrote a letter to Henry Ford thanking him for such a fast car. Was also the year I first saw day light. Don't use me for a reference point as I lie a lot and a real lot when it comes to racing cars. Did I ever tell you about the time I won the Daytona 500? Well set back, get your feet off the floor, and get ready for one hell of a story.

Ahhh..., but that proves my point. So you take 1934 and add 16 years for the (presumed) driving age. That makes it 1950. But then you subtract the age of a the oldest Pinto (43 years) and you come to 1907. Not too many cars around then and in step with my "close to a time when there were no cars" statement (sorry Dick).

  The point I was trying to make was if a 16 year old kid today was buying a 43 year old Pinto what model year car would that have been equivalent to when you, (me, others) were 16.  I did that just to put in perspective how old are Pinto's really are. I mean in 1973 when I was 16 a 1926 car (my equivalent year) was considered a REALLY OLD CAR!  Even 1950's cars were few and far between. And knowing Dick is the Elder Statesman here..., well using him as a reference point just punctuated concept.  Sorry Dick, no harm intended.

Anyone can do the math (that doesn't lie):

Birth year + 16 = __ - 43 = __ (the equivalent car year you would have bought had you purchased a 43 year old car at 16)

Pintosopher

Quote from: dick1172762 on January 03, 2018, 04:58:45 PM
  NO WAY! 1934 was the year of the 100 mph V8 Ford which was Bonnie and Clyde most used get away car. Clyde wrote a letter to Henry Ford thanking him for such a fast car. Was also the year I first saw day light. Don't use me for a reference point as I lie a lot and a real lot when it comes to racing cars. Did I ever tell you about the time I won the Daytona 500? Well set back, get your feet off the floor, and get ready for one hell of a story.
Well, when I entered the world, Dick was a Frisky young guy with racing intentions and possibly a licensed driver ;) But I digress, Dick might be more famous than Teddy Roosevelt. and his mug should be on Mt. Rushmore ;D
Yes, it is possible to study and become a master of Pintosophy.. Not a religion , nothing less than a life quest for non conformity and rational thought. What Horse did you ride in on?

Check my Pinto Poems out...

Pintosopher

Quote from: cutelitlputtputt on January 03, 2018, 04:18:41 PM
Well, just do what I do .... I say, "Watch who you're calling old!!"
Hmm... Suspended or properly braced.. Sounds like a renewal for the frame, perhaps a few lifts and even a proper alignment for good action on the curves. Well , a flat rate should apply or should the rate be a rising one based on the age of the equipment? Old horses never go out to pasture, they just work the ranch until they become spare parts ;)
Yes, it is possible to study and become a master of Pintosophy.. Not a religion , nothing less than a life quest for non conformity and rational thought. What Horse did you ride in on?

Check my Pinto Poems out...

Pintosopher

Did I ever tell you about the time I won Pikes Peak and put the Unsers on the trailer with a Pinto? :P
Yes, it is possible to study and become a master of Pintosophy.. Not a religion , nothing less than a life quest for non conformity and rational thought. What Horse did you ride in on?

Check my Pinto Poems out...

dick1172762

Quote from: Wittsend on January 02, 2018, 09:49:29 PM
As we go about this "Car Hobby Thing" I think it is important to remember just how old a car we are dealing with.

The newest Pinto's are 38 years old.

The oldest Pinto's are 47 years old.


The newest Lima 2.3 (Ranger) is 17 years old.

The oldest Lima 2.3 is 44 years old.

The newest Turbo motor donor car (88 Turbo Coupe) is 30 years old.

The oldest, though not the most desirable the "blow through" Mustang turbo motor is 39 years old.

We often talk about parts as if they are readily available. And while some are, many have become difficult to find. If I equate a 47 year old 1971 Pinto back to when I first was eligible to drive (1973) it would have been comparable to a 1926 Ford. And if we use our good friend Dick as the person of measurement..., why we get close to a time when there were no cars! ;D

Anyway, just something to ponder.



NO WAY! 1934 was the year of the 100 mph V8 Ford which was Bonnie and Clyde most used get away car. Clyde wrote a letter to Henry Ford thanking him for such a fast car. Was also the year I first saw day light. Don't use me for a reference point as I lie a lot and a real lot when it comes to racing cars. Did I ever tell you about the time I won the Daytona 500? Well set back, get your feet off the floor, and get ready for one hell of a story.
Its better to be a has-been, than a never was.

cutelitlputtputt

Well, just do what I do .... I say, "Watch who you're calling old!!"
Anything to keep her runnin'!

Pintosopher

My A$$ is older than these cars, It should be braced with a subframe..... ;D
Yes, it is possible to study and become a master of Pintosophy.. Not a religion , nothing less than a life quest for non conformity and rational thought. What Horse did you ride in on?

Check my Pinto Poems out...

Reeves1

QuoteAnd if we use our good friend Dick as the person of measurement..., why we get close to a time when there were no cars!



LMAO  ;D

Pintosopher

Time.. Knowledge, Repetition, Renewal...
We do indeed have old vehicles, But all you must do is Google Ford Pinto OHC UK and look in wonder at the eternal lifespan of the Escort in the Mk1,2 and the overseas markets that won't let the 2.0L EAO engine disappear. Our Sheet metal isn't in repop mode (Yet!) but given time, who knows?
We'll be the new market for those builders when our passionate restorers and racers keep the fire burning! Another page in the book of time, read many times. ;)

Pintosopher, Not quite a sage, but well read and pondering a twilight and dawn breaking.. ::)
Yes, it is possible to study and become a master of Pintosophy.. Not a religion , nothing less than a life quest for non conformity and rational thought. What Horse did you ride in on?

Check my Pinto Poems out...

Wittsend

As we go about this "Car Hobby Thing" I think it is important to remember just how old a car we are dealing with.

The newest Pinto's are 38 years old.

The oldest Pinto's are 47 years old.


The newest Lima 2.3 (Ranger) is 17 years old.

The oldest Lima 2.3 is 44 years old.

The newest Turbo motor donor car (88 Turbo Coupe) is 30 years old.

The oldest, though not the most desirable the "blow through" Mustang turbo motor is 39 years old.

We often talk about parts as if they are readily available. And while some are, many have become difficult to find. If I equate a 47 year old 1971 Pinto back to when I first was eligible to drive (1973) it would have been comparable to a 1926 Ford. And if we use our good friend Dick as the person of measurement..., why we get close to a time when there were no cars! ;D

Anyway, just something to ponder.