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Welcome to FordPinto.com, The home of the PCCA => Pinto FAQ => Topic started by: 78pinto on February 18, 2005, 01:00:51 PM

Title: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: 78pinto on February 18, 2005, 01:00:51 PM
Engines that will fit.¬  289¬  302¬  351w¬  351c¬  429¬  ¬ 460¬  This writeup is meant as an overview for the '74-'80 models, i have not done a '71-'73 conversion so i'm not real sure what will work in those.

I'm sure you can get any engine to fit, given the time and enough money, but these are the most common ones. This article deals with the Windsor family of engines 289-302-351w¬  The Clevland and 385 series of engines (429-460) have even less parts available for the swap and in MY opinion require a great deal of custom fabrication and reconstruction ....especially with the 429-460 engines.¬  ¬ 



It's maybe about time i did this thread. I get a good number of emails, and private messages about my set up, what i used and how to do it. This thread will take me a day or three to complete so bear with me and i will finish it as i have the time, along with a how to on EFI conversion for a V8. The parts i used are just that....it does not mean you can't substitute for something along the way ....if it works...do it!¬  First off, a V8 powered Pinto is not meant to be a corner carver! It will not handle like its on rails....and would be suited for straight line acceleration (drag racing) and regular street cruising, so think about what you want your Pinto to do before you take the plunge.

Motor mounts- i used part number left-D7ZA-6B032-AA
¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  ¬  right-D72A-6038-AA

 They are from a '77 Mustang II 302, and they are pricey if you can find them at all. You also need the frame mounts from the Mustang II¬  OR you can use the Pinto 4 banger ones and modify the left one by relocating it back 1 full inch from centre of hole to centre.¬  A motor plate or engine plate can be used, however, they have no rubber mounts and will let the engine vibrations transmit through the car.

 

Title: Re: V8 conversion basics
Post by: 78pinto on February 19, 2005, 12:20:57 AM
Here are the frame horns, they were drilled out to lighten them up ???


Title: Re: V8 conversion basics
Post by: 78pinto on February 19, 2005, 12:29:41 AM
The trans crossmember, in the picture, you are looking at the front. The holes will need some modifying to fit, also you'll likely have to turn the rubber isolator 180 degrees to fit (part that actually attaches trans crossmember to the tranny) If your conversion is using a T5 tranny it should also work with this setup. The AOD overdrive tranny is close to the same length as the C4 (there are different length tailstocks made on both, for trucks, vans ect.) but the car trannies were about the same length, BUT....the mounting pad is located about 2 inches further back on the AOD and WILL reqiure some fabrication on the crossmember. The smaller Mustang II V8 C4 bellhousing (147 tooth flex plate) will fit in the trans tunnel with little to no modifications. The larger 157 tooth bellhousing will fit but it will require the trans tunnel/ firewall to be pounded with a BFH. The even larger (Van, truck, large car) 164 tooth bellhousing will reqiure MAJOR trans tunnel/firewall reconstruction .....don't bother using it as its a PITA. The AOD is also a 164 tooth flexplate but is fairly simular to the bell size of the 157 tooth and will need to have the tunnel/firewall recalibrated a bit more ;D¬  The C5 tranny is basically the same as a C4 but the bellhousing is longer to make room for the lock up torque convertor (i'm using a built C5 but with a C4 bellhousing and C4 convertor) and will throw off mounting location on the trans crossmember. The C6 for a smallblock requires WAY to much fabrication, they are also very heavy. I would steer clear of them completely.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics
Post by: 78pinto on February 19, 2005, 01:34:38 AM
The rear end issue for a V8 car....use an 8 inch or 9 inch or even an 8.8¬  but don't even bother with the factory 6.75 incher.....don't say i didn't warn you,¬  it will expire quickly with the torque of a V8! Some¬  V6 Pintos (wagons) and all mustang II 302 models will have an 8 inch from the factory. They will handle an automatic tranny V8 (my buddy Tom's '71 runs 11's with a 351w C6 8 inch combo) but will not take 5000rpm launches with slicks and a 4 or 5 speed tranny for very long. My Pinto has a 9 inch in it, but it was shortened to fit and they are also alot heavier (weight) than a 8 inch. In the picture are Mustang II V8 frame mounts.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics
Post by: 78pinto on February 20, 2005, 02:07:19 PM
Radiator.¬  Many different rads can be used, my rad is a custom made two row aluminum that is a copy of a Mustang II unit and i added more length to it (i cut the lower support out so it extends down about 3 inches more than the original rad) I AM A FIRM BELIEVER THAT THE FACTORY UPPER RAD SUPPORT SHOULD BE LEFT INTACT.¬  Sure it's a pain in the a$$ to put the engine in and take it out.....you have to make the engine and tranny verticle to get it in, but its worth the effort to keep the fenders and front end in general from moving around while driving and at idle. Tom's '71 has had the upper rad support cut (he didn't do it) and with it bolted together, it still has alot of front end movement....es pecially while at idle. With that said, it will have to be a trial and error on rad choice, take measurements and head to the wreckers to see if you can find something¬  (i'm sure others will post a suitable rad to use when i unlock this thread) The factory Pinto rad will not do the job.....don't even bother trying it! There will be very little room between the waterpump snout and the rad (if you took my advice on NOT cutting the factory core support) so electric fan (s) are needed. I mounted mine on the outside of the rad and wired it to be a pusher. (pushes air through the rad instead of pulling it through from the inside) I also had to modify the hood latch brakets to make the fan fit between it and the rad. I am going to use front hood pins now, so i can take the hood latch and most of the bracket out.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics
Post by: 78pinto on February 20, 2005, 02:16:53 PM
fan location picture
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics
Post by: 78pinto on February 20, 2005, 02:42:55 PM
Headers.¬  This is a hot topic (no pun intended ;D) it seems when doing a conversion. Hooker makes headers for a 302 and 351w and i believe also a 351c into a Pinto, along witha few others (hedman ect.) Sometimes they can be found on ebay used. These swap headers can be pricey....so be warned.¬  Factory Mustang II V8 exhaust manifolds will also work, but are rather hard to come buy (try ebay again) My headers are Hooker Super Comps, they are a pain in the a$$ big time, they have many slip fittings on them to get them in and out more easily, but you need a couple of extra hands to hold them in place as you assemble them. Tom and i came up with a cheap alternative for headers for his car, as the price for headers was too much for him.¬  Take a set of factory or aftermarket 5 liter Mustang shorty headers, switch what side they are suppost to be mounted on and face them exiting out the FRONT. Then have a locall exhaust shop run them around the crossmember and to the back of the car, you cannot have a lowered ride hieght, but they do work and they are cheap! For a 302, no modifications are needed, with a 351w the frame rails may need to be notched for clearance near the collectors.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics
Post by: 78pinto on February 20, 2005, 02:45:49 PM
Tom's car with 351w and flipped Mustang 5 liter shorty headers.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics
Post by: 78pinto on February 20, 2005, 02:46:12 PM
other side
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics
Post by: 78pinto on February 20, 2005, 02:47:48 PM
exhuast pipes under crossmember
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics
Post by: 78pinto on February 20, 2005, 05:08:39 PM
Chassis.¬  My car has frame connectors added to it to give it some stiffness and to help reduce body twist with the slicks down at the dragstrip. I would suggest that you add them to your car also....even if your running a turbocharged 2.3!¬  They can be made from roundstock or square tube and should be attached to the front framerails and made long enough to attach to some point on the rear frame....or like mine are, attached around the front rear spring perch mount, weld them in. This is how they are attached in my Pinto. This is the front frame rail on the right hand side.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics
Post by: 78pinto on February 20, 2005, 05:12:23 PM
Here is the back of the subframe connector welded around the spring perch. The bar attached to the subframe connector is the front of my traction bars, the other end is mounted on the axle housing....the y work great....i have no wheel hop at all.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics
Post by: 78pinto on February 20, 2005, 05:26:41 PM
Here is the nine inch rear, you can see the rear of the traction bars mounted to the axle. At the front of the driveshaft, you can see the safety loop....always a good idea when using slicks....i don't want to compete in a pole vault at the dragstrip! The tub behind the axle contains the fuel cell, and my high pressure fuel pump (for EFI) and filter are mounted to the outside of it. Next year the rear suspension will be changed to a ladderbar/coilover setup, eliminating the leaf springs completely.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics
Post by: 78pinto on February 20, 2005, 05:40:15 PM
Brakes.¬  I still have the stock brakes on the front, with five lug rotors. They seem to work fine, along with the drum rears on the nine inch....they are NOT power assisted. I will eventually upgrade the fronts with the Granada 11 inch conversion, i think i'll need more stopping power with the 408 stroker motor!

Oil pan.¬  You will need a front sump pan and oil pickup tube. Chances are, it will need to be slightly modified to fit, so drop the engine in GENTLY the first time, keeping an eye on your clearances.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics
Post by: kris kincaid on February 21, 2005, 12:27:49 AM
Nice writeup. Definately one of those threads to remember!  :)
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: 78pinto on March 02, 2005, 05:00:54 AM
picture of drivers side frame mount relocation an inch back.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: MustoPentang on June 13, 2005, 06:32:13 AM
I just bought another Pinto, I own the $50.00 Pinto in the forums (Maroon with starsky and hutch stripe)
My delema
I acquired a 1988 Thunderbird with a fuel injected 5.0 and AOD tranny. What do I need to salvage from the donor car for the electronic ignition and is this swap doable. Will the AOD work in my pinto

Total cost of both cars $100.00(just for the pinto)
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: 78pinto on June 13, 2005, 08:58:41 AM
you will need the EEC (computer) and the loom with all the goodies that its attached to. Don't cut any wires. The AOD is doable...but personally i don't like them and prefer the C4 over them anyday.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: 78pinto on June 29, 2005, 10:07:25 PM
hopefully the pictures stay attached this time!
Title: Radiator Information
Post by: gearhead440 on February 10, 2006, 11:10:02 AM
I compared the MII V8 radiator and one from a Datsun 280z

1978 Mustang II
 Dimensions: 16-1/2 X 23 X 2-1/4

 Inlet header: 2-3/4 X 22-3/4 (RIGHT)

 Outlet header: 2-3/4 X 22-3/4 (LEFT)

 THREE ROW, BRASS TANKS/COPPER CORE (ALL METAL)

1978 Datsun 280z
 Dimensions: 16-1/8 X 24-1/8 X 2-1/16

 Inlet header: 2-3/16 X 24-1/16 (LEFT)

 Outlet header: 2-3/16 X 24-1/16 (RIGHT)
THREE ROW, BRASS TANKS/COPPER CORE (ALL METAL)
I also enclosed pics of the two rads for comparison.  I intend on using the Datsun 280z rad since it is incredibly similar to the MII rad and costs approximately 1/3 the price new  :amazed:.  I plan to bend a metal coat hanger into the shapes of the hose routing and take them to the parts place to find hoses that most closely match.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: 78pinto on February 10, 2006, 12:16:07 PM
good work, thats what hot rodding is all about!
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: 78jr racer on February 18, 2006, 05:16:54 PM
if you need a rad that will stand up to a v/8. the early ranger v/6 with a/c is a 3 core crossflow small enough to fit in the pinto. we use them on all our mini-stocks and the pro-street pinto we have.it has kept a 351 w. cool on a hot texas day. but it does take some fabrication skills to build a mount for it. hope this helps
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: MustoPentang on May 21, 2006, 08:46:26 PM
I own the "My $50.00 Pinto" and am contemplating installing a V8. The donor Car is a 1988 Ford Thunderbird with a 5.0
Not sure about the tranny but i do know it has OD. My question to you is can i basically swap the motor. with the exception of oil pan & Pickup and Motor Mounts Changes into the car with little or no trouble..
Parts from donor i know i need are:
EEC (Computer), and wire loom I have two style of pinto's

I need to get the Thunderbird Body out of here along with (Maybe) 1981 Ford pinto (Uknown type)Just a shell.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: stever on January 23, 2007, 04:25:57 AM
this should be up front so people know its here
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: gearhead440 on November 27, 2007, 07:55:13 AM
Bump :)
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: bob55 on November 28, 2007, 08:05:51 PM
this should be up front so people know its here

Moderator, any chance to pin this to the top of the Pinto FAQ section?   :fastcar:

Thanks!

Bob55
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: RSM on June 13, 2009, 07:21:48 PM
This will make my 347 swap into my 1980 wagon a whole easier. It's nice to see pics of the finished product, plus the info is a bonus!!  Thanks
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: V8_forlife on March 08, 2014, 11:47:07 AM
Can I use just the torque link bars that attach to the heads to support the motor without any kind of engine mounts.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: RSM on March 09, 2014, 11:04:45 PM
It's been almost 5 years since I comment on this post lol.Yes you can use the plates and mount them to the heads and frame. 2 things, if you solid mount the engine you need to solid mount the transmission. That's fine if it's a drag car but a daily driver....not a good deal. There are several ways of making engine mounts work. You can use the Mustang II mounts if you can find any, use an engine plate or fab some mounts with isolators. Advanced Adapters sell a few different styles of engine mounts that would be easy to use.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: RSM on March 09, 2014, 11:06:03 PM
If you want to look at those go to Advanced Adapters and the part # is 713002
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: Rob3865 on March 15, 2014, 11:27:14 PM
Trans Dapt makes a very nice universal crossmember with small block mounts for about 150 bucks total for both.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: V8_forlife on March 16, 2014, 09:38:25 AM
Thanks an yea it would be a DD.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: V8_forlife on March 16, 2014, 01:48:19 PM
would this oil pan work. ( http://www.jegs.com/i/Milodon/697/31125/10002/-1 )
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: beaner on March 16, 2014, 01:53:34 PM
would this oil pan work. ( http://www.jegs.com/i/Milodon/697/31125/10002/-1 (http://www.jegs.com/i/Milodon/697/31125/10002/-1) )
no rear sump you need front sump
brad :)
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: V8_forlife on March 16, 2014, 02:22:10 PM
So this should work then ( http://www.jegs.com/i/Proform/778/66187/10002/-1 ) an its going on a 87 mustang motor.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: beaner on March 16, 2014, 03:03:31 PM
that looks better ;)
 
brad :)
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: V8_forlife on March 16, 2014, 05:17:37 PM
Well i'm starting my swap as soon as I get my new floor pans put in which will be a while :-\ But I already have a lot of the stuff I need like the motor and trans mount which are on the way now. My only problem is im trying to keep my sway bar without having to cut the oil pan due to the fact I do not know how to weld yet. So any info on a oil pan I can use would be amazing. thanks in advance
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: entropy on March 16, 2014, 10:51:12 PM
Well i'm starting my swap as soon as I get my new floor pans put in which will be a while :-\ But I already have a lot of the stuff I need like the motor and trans mount which are on the way now. My only problem is im trying to keep my sway bar without having to cut the oil pan due to the fact I do not know how to weld yet. So any info on a oil pan I can use would be amazing. thanks in advance

Honestly...I wouldn't bother trying to save the sway bar.  Let's face it...V8 Pintos aren't exactly going to tear up an autocross course...3/4 of the engine is in front of the axle centerline.  V8 Pintos are for scaring yourself at the dragstrip and beating wholesale butt stoplight to stoplight on the street....and neither of those activities require a sway bar.  And the oil pan mods to make one fit...particul arly if you're not an ace welder are a can-o-worms you'll want to avoid opening.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: Reeves1 on March 17, 2014, 05:05:25 AM
I'll look up the part number for the Milodon pan needed for a V8 swap later.... needed for clearing the rack.

Found it:

http://www.milodon.com/oil-pans/street-oil-pans-ford73.asp
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: V8_forlife on March 18, 2014, 02:39:20 PM
Does anyone have pictures of the efi harness and main harness after everything was put in the car?
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: V8_forlife on April 02, 2014, 04:17:17 PM
ok so I got a 1978 mustang ghia ii 302 motor an 4 speed and a 1987 mustang 5.0 h.0 motor should be set. came with almost perfect motor mounts and the motor has been rebuild. is there any other stuff I should need to take the efi motor an put it in the pinto.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: Bill LBSR on August 12, 2014, 02:10:17 PM
This thread has helped a lot with my 302 Pinto swap. I actually found and bought a set of new Hooker 6161 V8 Swap headers and they have the directions. I tried posting them on this thread but the files are too large. If any one needs the directions I would be happy to email them.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: V8 Pynto on February 16, 2015, 03:28:22 PM
So, where the steel motor mounts are concerned regarding a V-8 swap can you use the V-6 ones or strictly the 4 cyl ones?
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: Rob3865 on August 30, 2017, 10:11:23 PM
So, I am curious about the Fox Mustang headers flipped forward. I see the car has a 351W. Does anyone know if the headers will fit with a 302 without modifications to the fender wells? It looks like they might. Thanks.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: Rob3865 on September 07, 2017, 05:12:47 PM
I guess either nobody knows or wants to share their info. I guess I will find out for myself when I do the install....... and keep it to myself.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: dick1172762 on September 08, 2017, 10:10:35 AM
I've only seen one person on our site that ran the headers forward and you already know about that one. Your on your own about this and if you keep the answer to your self, so be it. Members on here try to help out other members, but if we members do not know what your asking for, what would you expect us to tell you. Rudeness on here will never help you find answers to any question. Sorry but that's the way it is.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: Wittsend on September 08, 2017, 04:15:32 PM
40 years ago I had a friend that ran a 289 in a Pinto. He ran stock cast manifolds forwards (and possibly upwards ???). I think he then ran the the pipe under the cross member. I'll check and see if he remembers.

UPDATE: My friend responded that he had Herbert Meek headers (so I was wrong about them being cast..., maybe very early on they were). He said they went forward, then back under the cross member (which he felt was a real problem). He also referenced this sites member "Reeves1" at the Boss 302 Registry site http://www.boss302.com/smf/index.php?topic=72785.0 with some header image (they may be redundant here) see reply #9 for the Meek Headers.

As to "keeping it to myself" I agree with Dick.  It comes across as rather assumptive to think people know the desired information and are deliberately keeping it from you.  This site has very low activity. V-8 Pinto's are a very small number of those here and forward mounted exhaust is pretty much a near zero experience.  To deliberately withhold information based on assumption has the appearance as retaliatory and goes against your own desire for an answer (should anyone actually be able to provide it).   It would be in the best interest of the greater Pinto Community to reconsider your position.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: dick1172762 on September 09, 2017, 10:48:34 AM
Looks like this guy really does not like us. On March 20 /2017 he posted the following ( Then I will build my pig myself, my way and share nothing here. Thanks and adios ) Every question he is asked can be found by doing a search on here. I guess he didn't like the answers.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: Wittsend on September 09, 2017, 04:14:12 PM
And, what a contrast to those who freely give here.  Recently there was a similar issue - Someone seemed a bit bothered, as if where was the dedicated, carry everything "Pinto Parts Store"?  About the closest we ever had to that was the late Fred Morgan digging parts out of his stockpile of cars.  Great guy. We swapped early for late pedals at Knotts on nothing more than each of our trusted words to show up at the event.

The other thing is this is a pretty mellow site.  I'm on some car forums that can become quite the "Bickerfest."  I've seen people here disagree, but still be civil.
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: Reeves1 on September 09, 2017, 07:50:28 PM
I guess either nobody knows or wants to share their info. I guess I will find out for myself when I do the install....... and keep it to myself.


Weird post...... you under some kind of stress ?
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: dga57 on September 09, 2017, 08:04:42 PM


The other thing is this is a pretty mellow site.  I'm on some car forums that can become quite the "Bickerfest."  I've seen people here disagree, but still be civil.

I agree 100%.  I take a lot of pride in being a small part of a car site that functions as peaceably as this one.  I've belonged to a few that were just awful.  The worst one I ever joined was the RROC, where the incessant bickering finally led me to sell my Rolls-Royce and cancel my membership; it just wasn't worth the stress.  To add insult to injury, I paid in excess of $100 per year just to belong!  I am glad to be out of it and those folks can fight one another to the death for all I care.

Dwayne :)
Title: Re: V8 conversion basics for '74 & up Pinto
Post by: dick1172762 on September 11, 2017, 03:53:29 PM
As for the question about the headers routed forward, who would want to run the exhaust pipes under the cross member? Every Pinto I have owned (16) had scrape marks all across the bottom of the cross member. Many times the pan too. And you want to run your exhaust under the cross member? Why not run the exhaust straight  up like a derby car. And think how cool that would be on a cruse night.