Mini Classifieds

parting out 1975 & 80 pintos
Date: 10/31/2018 12:00 pm
Various Pinto Parts 1971 - 1973

Date: 10/01/2020 02:00 pm
Front Body parts needed
Date: 02/09/2018 06:09 pm
1978 bobcat 4speed shifter
Date: 11/02/2023 09:51 pm
Looking for leaf spring insulators
Date: 04/04/2020 09:38 am
1971-74 Various Pinto Parts
Date: 01/18/2020 03:44 pm
I need a 1976 hood
Date: 12/19/2016 06:02 pm
Looking for Pinto manual shifter parts
Date: 01/28/2021 03:49 pm
4:11 gears for 6.75 Make offer...NEED GONE

Date: 08/01/2018 01:27 pm

Why the Ford Pinto didn’t suck

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suckThe Ford Pinto was born a low-rent, stumpy thing in Dearborn 40 years ago and grew to become one of the most infamous cars in history. The thing is that it didn't actually suck. Really.

Even after four decades, what's the first thing that comes to mind when most people think of the Ford Pinto? Ka-BLAM! The truth is the Pinto was more than that — and this is the story of how the exploding Pinto became a pre-apocalyptic narrative, how the myth was exposed, and why you should race one.

The Pinto was CEO Lee Iacocca's baby, a homegrown answer to the threat of compact-sized economy cars from Japan and Germany, the sales of which had grown significantly throughout the 1960s. Iacocca demanded the Pinto cost under $2,000, and weigh under 2,000 pounds. It was an all-hands-on-deck project, and Ford got it done in 25 months from concept to production.

Building its own small car meant Ford's buyers wouldn't have to hew to the Japanese government's size-tamping regulations; Ford would have the freedom to choose its own exterior dimensions and engine sizes based on market needs (as did Chevy with the Vega and AMC with the Gremlin). And people cold dug it.

When it was unveiled in late 1970 (ominously on September 11), US buyers noted the Pinto's pleasant shape — bringing to mind a certain tailless amphibian — and interior layout hinting at a hipster's sunken living room. Some call it one of the ugliest cars ever made, but like fans of Mischa Barton, Pinto lovers care not what others think. With its strong Kent OHV four (a distant cousin of the Lotus TwinCam), the Pinto could at least keep up with its peers, despite its drum brakes and as long as one looked past its Russian-roulette build quality.

But what of the elephant in the Pinto's room? Yes, the whole blowing-up-on-rear-end-impact thing. It all started a little more than a year after the Pinto's arrival.

 

Grimshaw v. Ford Motor Company

On May 28, 1972, Mrs. Lilly Gray and 13-year-old passenger Richard Grimshaw, set out from Anaheim, California toward Barstow in Gray's six-month-old Ford Pinto. Gray had been having trouble with the car since new, returning it to the dealer several times for stalling. After stopping in San Bernardino for gasoline, Gray got back on I-15 and accelerated to around 65 mph. Approaching traffic congestion, she moved from the left lane to the middle lane, where the car suddenly stalled and came to a stop. A 1962 Ford Galaxie, the driver unable to stop or swerve in time, rear-ended the Pinto. The Pinto's gas tank was driven forward, and punctured on the bolts of the differential housing.

As the rear wheel well sections separated from the floor pan, a full tank of fuel sprayed straight into the passenger compartment, which was engulfed in flames. Gray later died from congestive heart failure, a direct result of being nearly incinerated, while Grimshaw was burned severely and left permanently disfigured. Grimshaw and the Gray family sued Ford Motor Company (among others), and after a six-month jury trial, verdicts were returned against Ford Motor Company. Ford did not contest amount of compensatory damages awarded to Grimshaw and the Gray family, and a jury awarded the plaintiffs $125 million, which the judge in the case subsequently reduced to the low seven figures. Other crashes and other lawsuits followed.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Mother Jones and Pinto Madness

In 1977, Mark Dowie, business manager of Mother Jones magazine published an article on the Pinto's "exploding gas tanks." It's the same article in which we first heard the chilling phrase, "How much does Ford think your life is worth?" Dowie had spent days sorting through filing cabinets at the Department of Transportation, examining paperwork Ford had produced as part of a lobbying effort to defeat a federal rear-end collision standard. That's where Dowie uncovered an innocuous-looking memo entitled "Fatalities Associated with Crash-Induced Fuel Leakage and Fires."

The Car Talk blog describes why the memo proved so damning.

In it, Ford's director of auto safety estimated that equipping the Pinto with [an] $11 part would prevent 180 burn deaths, 180 serious burn injuries and 2,100 burned cars, for a total cost of $137 million. Paying out $200,000 per death, $67,000 per injury and $700 per vehicle would cost only $49.15 million.

The government would, in 1978, demand Ford recall the million or so Pintos on the road to deal with the potential for gas-tank punctures. That "smoking gun" memo would become a symbol for corporate callousness and indifference to human life, haunting Ford (and other automakers) for decades. But despite the memo's cold calculations, was Ford characterized fairly as the Kevorkian of automakers?

Perhaps not. In 1991, A Rutgers Law Journal report [PDF] showed the total number of Pinto fires, out of 2 million cars and 10 years of production, stalled at 27. It was no more than any other vehicle, averaged out, and certainly not the thousand or more suggested by Mother Jones.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

The big rebuttal, and vindication?

But what of the so-called "smoking gun" memo Dowie had unearthed? Surely Ford, and Lee Iacocca himself, were part of a ruthless establishment who didn't care if its customers lived or died, right? Well, not really. Remember that the memo was a lobbying document whose audience was intended to be the NHTSA. The memo didn't refer to Pintos, or even Ford products, specifically, but American cars in general. It also considered rollovers not rear-end collisions. And that chilling assignment of value to a human life? Indeed, it was federal regulators who often considered that startling concept in their own deliberations. The value figure used in Ford's memo was the same one regulators had themselves set forth.

In fact, measured by occupant fatalities per million cars in use during 1975 and 1976, the Pinto's safety record compared favorably to other subcompacts like the AMC Gremlin, Chevy Vega, Toyota Corolla and VW Beetle.

And what of Mother Jones' Dowie? As the Car Talk blog points out, Dowie now calls the Pinto, "a fabulous vehicle that got great gas mileage," if not for that one flaw: The legendary "$11 part."

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Pinto Racing Doesn't Suck

Back in 1974, Car and Driver magazine created a Pinto for racing, an exercise to prove brains and common sense were more important than an unlimited budget and superstar power. As Patrick Bedard wrote in the March, 1975 issue of Car and Driver, "It's a great car to drive, this Pinto," referring to the racer the magazine prepared for the Goodrich Radial Challenge, an IMSA-sanctioned road racing series for small sedans.

Why'd they pick a Pinto over, say, a BMW 2002 or AMC Gremlin? Current owner of the prepped Pinto, Fox Motorsports says it was a matter of comparing the car's frontal area, weight, piston displacement, handling, wheel width, and horsepower to other cars of the day that would meet the entry criteria. (Racers like Jerry Walsh had by then already been fielding Pintos in IMSA's "Baby Grand" class.)

Bedard, along with Ron Nash and company procured a 30,000-mile 1972 Pinto two-door to transform. In addition to safety, chassis and differential mods, the team traded a 200-pound IMSA weight penalty for the power gain of Ford's 2.3-liter engine, which Bedard said "tipped the scales" in the Pinto's favor. But according to Bedard, it sounds like the real advantage was in the turns, thanks to some add-ons from Mssrs. Koni and Bilstein.

"The Pinto's advantage was cornering ability," Bedard wrote. "I don't think there was another car in the B. F. Goodrich series that was quicker through the turns on a dry track. The steering is light and quick, and the suspension is direct and predictable in a way that street cars never can be. It never darts over bumps, the axle is perfectly controlled and the suspension doesn't bottom."

Need more proof of the Pinto's lack of suck? Check out the SCCA Washington, DC region's spec-Pinto series.

Members
Stats
  • Total Posts: 139,575
  • Total Topics: 16,267
  • Online today: 1,137
  • Online ever: 2,670 (May 09, 2025, 01:57:20 AM)
Users Online
  • Users: 0
  • Guests: 781
  • Total: 781
F&I...more

My Somewhat Begrudging Apology To Ford Pinto

ford-pinto.jpg

I never thought I’d offer an apology to the Ford Pinto, but I guess I owe it one.

I had a Pinto in the 1970s. Actually, my wife bought it a few months before we got married. The car became sort of a wedding dowry. So did the remaining 80% of the outstanding auto loan.

During a relatively brief ownership, the Pinto’s repair costs exceeded the original price of the car. It wasn’t a question of if it would fail, but when. And where. Sometimes, it simply wouldn’t start in the driveway. Other times, it would conk out at a busy intersection.

It ranks as the worst car I ever had. That was back when some auto makers made quality something like Job 100, certainly not Job 1.

Despite my bad Pinto experience, I suppose an apology is in order because of a recent blog I wrote. It centered on Toyota’s sudden-acceleration problems. But in discussing those, I invoked the memory of exploding Pintos, perpetuating an inaccuracy.

The widespread allegation was that, due to a design flaw, Pinto fuel tanks could readily blow up in rear-end collisions, setting the car and its occupants afire.

People started calling the Pinto “the barbecue that seats four.” And the lawsuits spread like wild fire.

Responding to my blog, a Ford (“I would very much prefer to keep my name out of print”) manager contacted me to set the record straight.

He says exploding Pintos were a myth that an investigation debunked nearly 20 years ago. He cites Gary Schwartz’ 1991 Rutgers Law Review paper that cut through the wild claims and examined what really happened.

Schwartz methodically determined the actual number of Pinto rear-end explosion deaths was not in the thousands, as commonly thought, but 27.

In 1975-76, the Pinto averaged 310 fatalities a year. But the similar-size Toyota Corolla averaged 313, the VW Beetle 374 and the Datsun 1200/210 came in at 405.

Yes, there were cases such as a Pinto exploding while parked on the shoulder of the road and hit from behind by a speeding pickup truck. But fiery rear-end collisions comprised only 0.6% of all fatalities back then, and the Pinto had a lower death rate in that category than the average compact or subcompact, Schwartz said after crunching the numbers. Nor was there anything about the Pinto’s rear-end design that made it particularly unsafe.

Not content to portray the Pinto as an incendiary device, ABC’s 20/20 decided to really heat things up in a 1978 broadcast containing “startling new developments.” ABC breathlessly reported that, not just Pintos, but fullsize Fords could blow up if hit from behind.

20/20 thereupon aired a video, shot by UCLA researchers, showing a Ford sedan getting rear-ended and bursting into flames. A couple of problems with that video:

One, it was shot 10 years earlier.

Two, the UCLA researchers had openly said in a published report that they intentionally rigged the vehicle with an explosive.

That’s because the test was to determine how a crash fire affected the car’s interior, not to show how easily Fords became fire balls. They said they had to use an accelerant because crash blazes on their own are so rare. They had tried to induce a vehicle fire in a crash without using an igniter, but failed.

ABC failed to mention any of that when correspondent Sylvia Chase reported on “Ford’s secret rear-end crash tests.”

We could forgive ABC for that botched reporting job. After all, it was 32 years ago. But a few weeks ago, ABC, in another one of its rigged auto exposes, showed video of a Toyota apparently accelerating on its own.

Turns out, the “runaway” vehicle had help from an associate professor. He built a gizmo with an on-off switch to provide acceleration on demand. Well, at least ABC didn’t show the Toyota slamming into a wall and bursting into flames.

In my blog, I also mentioned that Ford’s woes got worse in the 1970s with the supposed uncovering of an internal memo by a Ford attorney who allegedly calculated it would cost less to pay off wrongful-death suits than to redesign the Pinto.

It became known as the “Ford Pinto memo,” a smoking gun. But Schwartz looked into that, too. He reported the memo did not pertain to Pintos or any Ford products. Instead, it had to do with American vehicles in general.

It dealt with rollovers, not rear-end crashes. It did not address tort liability at all, let alone advocate it as a cheaper alternative to a redesign. It put a value to human life because federal regulators themselves did so.

The memo was meant for regulators’ eyes only. But it was off to the races after Mother Jones magazine got a hold of a copy and reported what wasn’t the case.

The exploding-Pinto myth lives on, largely because more Americans watch 20/20 than read the Rutgers Law Review. One wonders what people will recollect in 2040 about Toyota’s sudden accelerations, which more and more look like driver error and, in some cases, driver shams.

So I guess I owe the Pinto an apology. But it’s half-hearted, because my Pinto gave me much grief, even though, as the Ford manager notes, “it was a cheap car, built long ago and lots of things have changed, almost all for the better.”

Here goes: If I said anything that offended you, Pinto, I’m sorry. And thanks for not blowing up on me.

Why Did You Buy/Obtain Your First Pinto

Started by Mason66, July 27, 2005, 06:12:45 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Pintony

Hey Terry,
NICE STORY!!!! ;D
The question was.... WHY did you buy your Pinto??? ;D ;D ;D
From Pintony

P.S.
See you tomorrow at the all Ford show in St. louie!


Tercin

Janety2k
I had my Pinto hauled from California to Missouri by Reliable Carriers(The Orange Trucks) They were quick and competitive pricing. The best part was they were enclosed, my Pinto arrived in perfect condition, and never saw the elements while in transit.
The only Pinto I have
73 Sports Accent
Rust free California Car

Janety2k

I bought my Pinto, an orange 1972 sedan, in 1975 on a trip to Knoxville, Tennessee.  I saw it on the lot, drove it, and fell in love!  I traded in my 1969 Chevrolet Impala (affectionately known as the "Burgandy Bomber") and took my "Pregnant Pumpkin" home!

Loved that car!  Surprisingly, it was great in snow!  Seems the weight of the car and the short wheel base, made it an excellent winter car.  I put snow tires (regular, not studded) on it and I could go anywhere, even in all but the most extreme Buffalo winters.

I just bought a 1974 Pinto hatchback wiht 42,000 original miles!  It is absolutely imaculate inside.  All original.  Even the original seats are in perfect shape.  Can't wait to get my hands on it.  Unfortunately, it is in Erie, Pennsylvania, and I am in Davenport, Iowa.  Gotta figure out a way to get there and get it back here.

CONSFIRE

I BOUGHT MY FIRST CAR (PINTO) IN 1974 TO GET ME BACK AND FORTH TO COLLEGE. I BOUGHT IT FROM MY MOM'S UNCLE, MY DAD DROVE IT HOME, I HAD TO WORK. I STILL HAVE IT IN MY GARAGE AT HOME IN A MILLION PIECES WAITING TO GET A SMALL BLOCK AN ALL THE GOODIES THAT GO WITH IT. RIGHT NOW I'M DRIVING A '71 PINTO THAT LOOKS LIKE IT CAME OFF THE SHOW ROOM FLOOR. LOVE GETTING ALL THE COMMENTS FROM PEOPLE THAT USED TO OWN ONE JUST LIKE IT. THANKS FOR READING MY REPLY, HAVE A PINTO DAY.     CONSFIRE

Tercin

I bought a 73 from a guy my dad worked with. It was a sports accent model,yellow vinyl top with white paint. The top was wasted so i stripped it off and had the whole car painted white. I drove it for a couple of years until I had tranny problems. I bought a new 82 Nissan Sentra and had it until my first wife got it in a divorce settlement. As far as the Pinto it was sold to a guy named Doug Taylor who took it to N Carolina. I think he was the same guy that went on to Nascar fame. Not sure about that though. I recently bought my 73 sports accent model only this one is White with a green vinyl top. I made the mistake of selling my first one. That won't happen again.
The only Pinto I have
73 Sports Accent
Rust free California Car

Sonatabob

Picture it...Fairfax, Virginia...April, 1971.  I was a young man of 20 driving a 1961 Corvair Monza which was my first car -a high school graduation gift from my folks.  When the Pinto and Vega were introduced that Spring, I approached Dad with the idea of my buying a new car to replace the aging Corvair.  We did all the research on both and although I liked the Vega GT with the hatchback, Dad was a Ford man (and was securing the loan through his credit union) so I went with the Pinto.  Nothing on the lot matched my taste so I had it special ordered in the dark green metallic with saddle-vinyl interior.  The options were the 2000 cc engine, am radio, racing mirrors and raised white letter tires.  The delivery time was 3 weeks.  As the expected date drew near, I would drive by Ted Britt Ford every afternoon after my college classes hoping that I would see it.  Then one afternoon it was there and they had parked it on the service road just in front of the showroom.  It was so striking in that gleaming metallic paint with those raised white letter Goodyear Polyglas tires!  I pulled in and got a close look.  Exactly as ordered and the sticker was $2,405...I will always remember that!  I rushed home, called Dad at work and told him the car was in so that we could go take delivery as soon as he got home. 

We didn't even eat dinner and went right over to the dealer.  He signed the papers, handed over the check and they handed me the keys.  I was surprised when they also handed me the special silver "Pinto" key although it could not be cut as a key but only used as decoration on the keyring.  I got in, started it up and drove off the lot feeling like a millionaire!  The shifter was tight -a far cry from the Monza!  -and the power from the engine I couldn't believe!  I can't remember what time I got home that night but I remember not being able to go inside to sleep!
I drove it to classes at George Mason College (not yet a university then) until my graduation that summer.  I had the first Pinto on campus, and while others eventually showed up they were all the basic 1600cc models and none had the racing mirrors or RWL tires!

I took great care of that car over the next 3 years and added a custom console/armrest from a company called Saddleback in California.  It fit and matched perfectly and became the mounting place for my foglamp switch.  I mounted my round foglamps behind the grille for a unique although low-functional look!  I also added an aluminum mesh grille  on the taillamp panel which was available then from an aftermarket company.

I also added a tach on the steering column and 2 3-gauge clusters below the dash...I had oil pressure, vacuum, voltmeter- and can't remember the other 3 but they looked great at night with all the illumination.  Eventually I added an 8-track mounted on the floor below the dash and 2 speakers on the rear package deck. 

Over the years I took many trips in that car, and a memorable one to the newly-opened DisneyWorld in Orlando.  On a stretch of road somewhere in Georgia at 4am the Pinto reached 110mph...and behaved very well!
The only trouble I got into with the car was a 360-spin on a wet road after turning too suddenly.  No traction from that light rear end or those greasy Polyglas tires!

Eventually the Mercury Capri caught my eye and I traded for a 1974 2000cc bright red with sunroof and 4-speed.  That began my long string of cars over the years that's brought me to my 55th year and a silver Sonata LX which is a wonderful, comfortable ride.  I often wonder what a ride in my old Pinto would feel like now!

Several years after I traded my Pinto for that Capri, I acutally saw my old car in a shopping center parking lot.  The gauges and console were still there but the paint was fading and the RWL tires had been replaced with conventional blackwalls.  It was a little sad to see it aging but all the memories of when it was shiny and my first new car came rushing back.  Still today whenever I see that rare Pinto on the road I think of my glory days.  Some may joke and laugh about the Pinto and some of its negative legacies, but to me it will always be my first new car...and you always remember that.

Thanks for this site and congratulations to all of you who remember or have discovered the Pinto and are taking care of it just as it deserves!

Bipper

I bought my first Pinto, a 72 hatchback, in 1974.  When I was in high school, my girlfriends dad bought a new 73 sedan, white with orange interior.  That was the Pinto that got me hooked.  My first Pinto went away about 79 but I have always had a Pinto of some sort ever since that first one.  Now I have 4 Pintos, 1 Pangra and no time. 
71 Sedan, stock
72 Pangra
73 Runabout, 2L turbo propane

r4pinto

Bought my first Pinto in about september of last year for $300. I looked at a 1977 sedan but couldn't get it home so I bought a 78 runabout that I was able to dive home. Worst cash I ever spent, as the frame was severely rusted & the sub frame was seperating from the rest of the car... Now I got the 77 sedan that I originally looked at.
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

78pinto

bought my FIRST pinto ('76 Olympic Edition coupe) off my cousin (first owner) in 1984
** Jeff (78Pinto) is Missing from us but will always be a part of our community- We miss you Jeff **

Mason66

For me, I was 16 years old and it was given to me by my parents.  A 1972 sedan brown, well parts of it, with the old 1600 overhead valve engine.  It was 11 years old and not running so i had to work on it. Basically i had the car because it was almost free.

Why did you buy/obtain your first?