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Why the Ford Pinto didn’t suck

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suckThe Ford Pinto was born a low-rent, stumpy thing in Dearborn 40 years ago and grew to become one of the most infamous cars in history. The thing is that it didn't actually suck. Really.

Even after four decades, what's the first thing that comes to mind when most people think of the Ford Pinto? Ka-BLAM! The truth is the Pinto was more than that — and this is the story of how the exploding Pinto became a pre-apocalyptic narrative, how the myth was exposed, and why you should race one.

The Pinto was CEO Lee Iacocca's baby, a homegrown answer to the threat of compact-sized economy cars from Japan and Germany, the sales of which had grown significantly throughout the 1960s. Iacocca demanded the Pinto cost under $2,000, and weigh under 2,000 pounds. It was an all-hands-on-deck project, and Ford got it done in 25 months from concept to production.

Building its own small car meant Ford's buyers wouldn't have to hew to the Japanese government's size-tamping regulations; Ford would have the freedom to choose its own exterior dimensions and engine sizes based on market needs (as did Chevy with the Vega and AMC with the Gremlin). And people cold dug it.

When it was unveiled in late 1970 (ominously on September 11), US buyers noted the Pinto's pleasant shape — bringing to mind a certain tailless amphibian — and interior layout hinting at a hipster's sunken living room. Some call it one of the ugliest cars ever made, but like fans of Mischa Barton, Pinto lovers care not what others think. With its strong Kent OHV four (a distant cousin of the Lotus TwinCam), the Pinto could at least keep up with its peers, despite its drum brakes and as long as one looked past its Russian-roulette build quality.

But what of the elephant in the Pinto's room? Yes, the whole blowing-up-on-rear-end-impact thing. It all started a little more than a year after the Pinto's arrival.

 

Grimshaw v. Ford Motor Company

On May 28, 1972, Mrs. Lilly Gray and 13-year-old passenger Richard Grimshaw, set out from Anaheim, California toward Barstow in Gray's six-month-old Ford Pinto. Gray had been having trouble with the car since new, returning it to the dealer several times for stalling. After stopping in San Bernardino for gasoline, Gray got back on I-15 and accelerated to around 65 mph. Approaching traffic congestion, she moved from the left lane to the middle lane, where the car suddenly stalled and came to a stop. A 1962 Ford Galaxie, the driver unable to stop or swerve in time, rear-ended the Pinto. The Pinto's gas tank was driven forward, and punctured on the bolts of the differential housing.

As the rear wheel well sections separated from the floor pan, a full tank of fuel sprayed straight into the passenger compartment, which was engulfed in flames. Gray later died from congestive heart failure, a direct result of being nearly incinerated, while Grimshaw was burned severely and left permanently disfigured. Grimshaw and the Gray family sued Ford Motor Company (among others), and after a six-month jury trial, verdicts were returned against Ford Motor Company. Ford did not contest amount of compensatory damages awarded to Grimshaw and the Gray family, and a jury awarded the plaintiffs $125 million, which the judge in the case subsequently reduced to the low seven figures. Other crashes and other lawsuits followed.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Mother Jones and Pinto Madness

In 1977, Mark Dowie, business manager of Mother Jones magazine published an article on the Pinto's "exploding gas tanks." It's the same article in which we first heard the chilling phrase, "How much does Ford think your life is worth?" Dowie had spent days sorting through filing cabinets at the Department of Transportation, examining paperwork Ford had produced as part of a lobbying effort to defeat a federal rear-end collision standard. That's where Dowie uncovered an innocuous-looking memo entitled "Fatalities Associated with Crash-Induced Fuel Leakage and Fires."

The Car Talk blog describes why the memo proved so damning.

In it, Ford's director of auto safety estimated that equipping the Pinto with [an] $11 part would prevent 180 burn deaths, 180 serious burn injuries and 2,100 burned cars, for a total cost of $137 million. Paying out $200,000 per death, $67,000 per injury and $700 per vehicle would cost only $49.15 million.

The government would, in 1978, demand Ford recall the million or so Pintos on the road to deal with the potential for gas-tank punctures. That "smoking gun" memo would become a symbol for corporate callousness and indifference to human life, haunting Ford (and other automakers) for decades. But despite the memo's cold calculations, was Ford characterized fairly as the Kevorkian of automakers?

Perhaps not. In 1991, A Rutgers Law Journal report [PDF] showed the total number of Pinto fires, out of 2 million cars and 10 years of production, stalled at 27. It was no more than any other vehicle, averaged out, and certainly not the thousand or more suggested by Mother Jones.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

The big rebuttal, and vindication?

But what of the so-called "smoking gun" memo Dowie had unearthed? Surely Ford, and Lee Iacocca himself, were part of a ruthless establishment who didn't care if its customers lived or died, right? Well, not really. Remember that the memo was a lobbying document whose audience was intended to be the NHTSA. The memo didn't refer to Pintos, or even Ford products, specifically, but American cars in general. It also considered rollovers not rear-end collisions. And that chilling assignment of value to a human life? Indeed, it was federal regulators who often considered that startling concept in their own deliberations. The value figure used in Ford's memo was the same one regulators had themselves set forth.

In fact, measured by occupant fatalities per million cars in use during 1975 and 1976, the Pinto's safety record compared favorably to other subcompacts like the AMC Gremlin, Chevy Vega, Toyota Corolla and VW Beetle.

And what of Mother Jones' Dowie? As the Car Talk blog points out, Dowie now calls the Pinto, "a fabulous vehicle that got great gas mileage," if not for that one flaw: The legendary "$11 part."

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Pinto Racing Doesn't Suck

Back in 1974, Car and Driver magazine created a Pinto for racing, an exercise to prove brains and common sense were more important than an unlimited budget and superstar power. As Patrick Bedard wrote in the March, 1975 issue of Car and Driver, "It's a great car to drive, this Pinto," referring to the racer the magazine prepared for the Goodrich Radial Challenge, an IMSA-sanctioned road racing series for small sedans.

Why'd they pick a Pinto over, say, a BMW 2002 or AMC Gremlin? Current owner of the prepped Pinto, Fox Motorsports says it was a matter of comparing the car's frontal area, weight, piston displacement, handling, wheel width, and horsepower to other cars of the day that would meet the entry criteria. (Racers like Jerry Walsh had by then already been fielding Pintos in IMSA's "Baby Grand" class.)

Bedard, along with Ron Nash and company procured a 30,000-mile 1972 Pinto two-door to transform. In addition to safety, chassis and differential mods, the team traded a 200-pound IMSA weight penalty for the power gain of Ford's 2.3-liter engine, which Bedard said "tipped the scales" in the Pinto's favor. But according to Bedard, it sounds like the real advantage was in the turns, thanks to some add-ons from Mssrs. Koni and Bilstein.

"The Pinto's advantage was cornering ability," Bedard wrote. "I don't think there was another car in the B. F. Goodrich series that was quicker through the turns on a dry track. The steering is light and quick, and the suspension is direct and predictable in a way that street cars never can be. It never darts over bumps, the axle is perfectly controlled and the suspension doesn't bottom."

Need more proof of the Pinto's lack of suck? Check out the SCCA Washington, DC region's spec-Pinto series.

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My Somewhat Begrudging Apology To Ford Pinto

ford-pinto.jpg

I never thought I’d offer an apology to the Ford Pinto, but I guess I owe it one.

I had a Pinto in the 1970s. Actually, my wife bought it a few months before we got married. The car became sort of a wedding dowry. So did the remaining 80% of the outstanding auto loan.

During a relatively brief ownership, the Pinto’s repair costs exceeded the original price of the car. It wasn’t a question of if it would fail, but when. And where. Sometimes, it simply wouldn’t start in the driveway. Other times, it would conk out at a busy intersection.

It ranks as the worst car I ever had. That was back when some auto makers made quality something like Job 100, certainly not Job 1.

Despite my bad Pinto experience, I suppose an apology is in order because of a recent blog I wrote. It centered on Toyota’s sudden-acceleration problems. But in discussing those, I invoked the memory of exploding Pintos, perpetuating an inaccuracy.

The widespread allegation was that, due to a design flaw, Pinto fuel tanks could readily blow up in rear-end collisions, setting the car and its occupants afire.

People started calling the Pinto “the barbecue that seats four.” And the lawsuits spread like wild fire.

Responding to my blog, a Ford (“I would very much prefer to keep my name out of print”) manager contacted me to set the record straight.

He says exploding Pintos were a myth that an investigation debunked nearly 20 years ago. He cites Gary Schwartz’ 1991 Rutgers Law Review paper that cut through the wild claims and examined what really happened.

Schwartz methodically determined the actual number of Pinto rear-end explosion deaths was not in the thousands, as commonly thought, but 27.

In 1975-76, the Pinto averaged 310 fatalities a year. But the similar-size Toyota Corolla averaged 313, the VW Beetle 374 and the Datsun 1200/210 came in at 405.

Yes, there were cases such as a Pinto exploding while parked on the shoulder of the road and hit from behind by a speeding pickup truck. But fiery rear-end collisions comprised only 0.6% of all fatalities back then, and the Pinto had a lower death rate in that category than the average compact or subcompact, Schwartz said after crunching the numbers. Nor was there anything about the Pinto’s rear-end design that made it particularly unsafe.

Not content to portray the Pinto as an incendiary device, ABC’s 20/20 decided to really heat things up in a 1978 broadcast containing “startling new developments.” ABC breathlessly reported that, not just Pintos, but fullsize Fords could blow up if hit from behind.

20/20 thereupon aired a video, shot by UCLA researchers, showing a Ford sedan getting rear-ended and bursting into flames. A couple of problems with that video:

One, it was shot 10 years earlier.

Two, the UCLA researchers had openly said in a published report that they intentionally rigged the vehicle with an explosive.

That’s because the test was to determine how a crash fire affected the car’s interior, not to show how easily Fords became fire balls. They said they had to use an accelerant because crash blazes on their own are so rare. They had tried to induce a vehicle fire in a crash without using an igniter, but failed.

ABC failed to mention any of that when correspondent Sylvia Chase reported on “Ford’s secret rear-end crash tests.”

We could forgive ABC for that botched reporting job. After all, it was 32 years ago. But a few weeks ago, ABC, in another one of its rigged auto exposes, showed video of a Toyota apparently accelerating on its own.

Turns out, the “runaway” vehicle had help from an associate professor. He built a gizmo with an on-off switch to provide acceleration on demand. Well, at least ABC didn’t show the Toyota slamming into a wall and bursting into flames.

In my blog, I also mentioned that Ford’s woes got worse in the 1970s with the supposed uncovering of an internal memo by a Ford attorney who allegedly calculated it would cost less to pay off wrongful-death suits than to redesign the Pinto.

It became known as the “Ford Pinto memo,” a smoking gun. But Schwartz looked into that, too. He reported the memo did not pertain to Pintos or any Ford products. Instead, it had to do with American vehicles in general.

It dealt with rollovers, not rear-end crashes. It did not address tort liability at all, let alone advocate it as a cheaper alternative to a redesign. It put a value to human life because federal regulators themselves did so.

The memo was meant for regulators’ eyes only. But it was off to the races after Mother Jones magazine got a hold of a copy and reported what wasn’t the case.

The exploding-Pinto myth lives on, largely because more Americans watch 20/20 than read the Rutgers Law Review. One wonders what people will recollect in 2040 about Toyota’s sudden accelerations, which more and more look like driver error and, in some cases, driver shams.

So I guess I owe the Pinto an apology. But it’s half-hearted, because my Pinto gave me much grief, even though, as the Ford manager notes, “it was a cheap car, built long ago and lots of things have changed, almost all for the better.”

Here goes: If I said anything that offended you, Pinto, I’m sorry. And thanks for not blowing up on me.

Found some motivation (finally)

Started by discolives78, October 10, 2008, 09:15:30 PM

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dave1987

WOOHOO! Glad to see you back in the game chuck! :D

Glad to see there's minimal rust on the car. I just hope the wagon I just bought isn't bad...

Good to hear things are going well for you. Lucky you, you don't have to drive in snow!
1978 Ford Pinto Sedan - Family owned since new

Remembering Jeff Fitcher with every drive in my 78 Sedan.

I am a Pinto Surgeon. Fixing problems and giving Pintos a chance to live again is more than a hobby, it's a passion!

discolives78

Hey guys!

Well I haven't gotten here in a while, thought I'd catch you up...

I've been driving again these last couple weeks. Health is so-so (which is actually very good relatively), and life just keeps going, day after day.

I had to replace my steering rag joint last weekend (too bad I didn't have the camera handy!). the old one shattered in 4 pieces (I turned right and it "clunked" and then the wheel had a lot of play in it! Thank goodness I didn't lose control of her and break up on re-entry ( :laugh:). The only pain was cutting the rivets on the yoke (thank goodness for portable band saws!).

Other than that, no news is good news...

I'm off to catch up on my reading...

Take care friends!
Chuck :afro:


A virtual version of my last Pinto. Was Registered Ride #111. Missed every day.

smallfryefarm

Disco great job man. Thats the only way to do it taker down to the bone and fix it.  ;)
Smallfryefarms Horsepower Ranch

larjohnson

WOW!!!!!! I don't know that I could take my Pinto apart like that.  I'm afraid my local mechanic would be replacing my door hinge for me....lol :D  Your Pinto is nothing short of fantastic....I love it...keep up the good work.
Larry :police:
Had a 1971 trunk model in High School, wanted another for old times sake, just purchased another in Washington State, very nice restore project.  I also own an all original 1972 Ford Pinto Runabout, one owner, always garaged, with 33,000 actual miles.  Life is SWEET!!!!

Carolina Boy

Wow!!!!! I am impressed and amazed at the quality of your work. Now I have some motorvation. Keep up the good work. Hey those bumper guards look great, too. :look:
If life gives you a lemon, squeeze it in your moonshine and buy a Pinto.

dholvrsn

Quote from: discolives78 on October 14, 2009, 07:35:20 PM
Ok, I'm all stoked right now!  ;D

First, the eight-track:


Get down and boogie! :afro:

Hey, you need tunes to listen too while fiddling with your Pinto!

Quote from: discolives78 on October 14, 2009, 07:35:20 PM
Ok, I'm all stoked right now!  ;D

First, the eight-track:

Only thing is the tuner needle is sluggish going up the dial (but not down) and I can't seem to get any AM stations.

I'd try some careful spraying of Tuner Cleaner, aka: Contact Cleaner, on the tuner mechanism and AM/FM switch.

DGH
'80 MPG Pony, '80-'92
'79 porthole wagon, '06-on
'80 trunk model. '17-on
-----
'98 Dodge Ram 1500
'95 Buick Riviera
'63 Studebaker Champ
'57 Studebaker Silver Hawk
'51 Studebaker Commander Starlight
'47 Studebaker Champion
'41 Studebaker Commander Land Cruiser

discolives78

So, since I'm not really going anywhere anyway:



I figured I'd have some time to take her apart and replace the bottom hinge on my driver door



no rust thru! just a little surface rust to clean up



I left the door on and closed and removed the bottom hinge without loosening the top hinge.




new one on the left and old one on the right. the old one was missing the big spring that holds the door open on a hill




back together, but will it blend?

Got some work done in the engine bay too, pics next weekend

:afro:


A virtual version of my last Pinto. Was Registered Ride #111. Missed every day.

discolives78

Ok, I'm all stoked right now!  ;D

First, the eight-track:



It's from a 78 Olds Delta 88. I like it because you can't tell it's an 8 track, unless



there's a cartridge in it. I also like it because unlike most of Ford's 8 tracks, it's 4 channel, meaning 4 speakers, not two. The 8 track works great and the FM and preset buttons all work. Only thing is the tuner needle is sluggish going up the dial (but not down) and I can't seem to get any AM stations. The Mustang decal is hiding the GM-Delco insignia (wouldn't really want to show that off would I?)

Stay tuned, more coming! :D


A virtual version of my last Pinto. Was Registered Ride #111. Missed every day.

larjohnson

Chuck:  Just looking at your pix of your Pinto...WOW!!!! I love it.  It looks really good, bet she's a real head turner.  Fantastic Pinto you have there...good luck!!!!! Larry :police:
Had a 1971 trunk model in High School, wanted another for old times sake, just purchased another in Washington State, very nice restore project.  I also own an all original 1972 Ford Pinto Runabout, one owner, always garaged, with 33,000 actual miles.  Life is SWEET!!!!

dga57

Tough break on the refi - something else is bound to work out though.  Thrilled to hear the wagon is back on the road.  I know you've missed driving it!

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

blupinto

I hear you both, Chuck and Jim! I was driving my wagon today after not having ANY Pinto to drive for a month or more and realized what I missed. They are so fun to drive! To think I was intimidated with the thought of driving a stick shift...

Chuck, hang in there. Things are tough all over. I got the news today that the refi person who assured me she could refinance my mortgage told me if I only had $200 more in my paycheck... thanks Arnold Governator.  :devil: >:( :showback:

Hang tough Chuck! Good luck in the great gauge cluster adventure Jim!  ;)
One can never have too many Pintos!

hellfirejim

Quote from: discolives78 on September 12, 2009, 09:33:25 PM
Grounded again... :(

Don't want to get too graphic, but basically she's parked again. Money wasn't there for registration, and State Farm dropped me because of my aforementioned credit problems thanks to my medical situation.

I've been popping in as often as I can, but a few weeks now into not driving, I've only managed to get up here a couple times. Competition is fierce for the computer too, there's usually one person in line in front of me, and one waiting, so time to type just isn't there lately.

I did manage to find a cool AM/FM/8 track 4 speaker stereo in a 78 Olds at the u-pull, it's cleaned and in the car, but I didn't get a chance to take a pic though.

I haven't given up, and I'll still lurk in the shadows around here! :devil:

Chuck :afro:

Hang in there chuck, you can do this.  We all get set backs now and then but just know we are all pulling for you.

I know about the withdrawal symtoms, I pulled my instrument cluster down to replace some dash lights and the white plastic piece just fell apart.  I am waiting for the arrival of my new instrument cluster [Thanks Bill] but I nhaven't been able to drive the car for about 2 weeks and it is driving me crazy... I need my pinto therapy... :lol:

jim
It's a good day to be alive!
PCCA Pinto Number #385


douglasskemp

Hopefully things will start turning up better for you soon brother.  Keep the faith!  Maybe in a short while I can meet you and others on this site at a SouthWestern meet sometime.  ;D
--Doug
The Pinto I had I gave to my brother. The car was originally my mom's, (78 red Pinto sedan with a 2.3 and a 4spd.) I am originally from Tucson, AZ but moved to Oxnard CA :D
I'm looking for a Pinto wagon with an automatic.

discolives78

Grounded again... :(

Don't want to get too graphic, but basically she's parked again. Money wasn't there for registration, and State Farm dropped me because of my aforementioned credit problems thanks to my medical situation.

I've been popping in as often as I can, but a few weeks now into not driving, I've only managed to get up here a couple times. Competition is fierce for the computer too, there's usually one person in line in front of me, and one waiting, so time to type just isn't there lately.

I did manage to find a cool AM/FM/8 track 4 speaker stereo in a 78 Olds at the u-pull, it's cleaned and in the car, but I didn't get a chance to take a pic though.

I haven't given up, and I'll still lurk in the shadows around here! :devil:

Chuck :afro:


A virtual version of my last Pinto. Was Registered Ride #111. Missed every day.

dga57

Well, THAT certainly spruced things up :surprised:    Looks great!

Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

blupinto

Very nice Chuck. Tasteful and patriotic.  ;D
One can never have too many Pintos!

75bobcatv6

that chuck is sweet! looks great.

dholvrsn

Almost makes me nostalgic for the Bicentennial. :afro:
'80 MPG Pony, '80-'92
'79 porthole wagon, '06-on
'80 trunk model. '17-on
-----
'98 Dodge Ram 1500
'95 Buick Riviera
'63 Studebaker Champ
'57 Studebaker Silver Hawk
'51 Studebaker Commander Starlight
'47 Studebaker Champion
'41 Studebaker Commander Land Cruiser

pintogirl

Wow!!! Looks great Chuck!!!

Can't wait to see the rest!!!
Kim
www.pintobuyersanonymous.com

I have come to realize that I am powerless to cuteness of a rusty old Pinto.

Sacramento CA

discolives78

And the saga continues...

I felt the overwhelming need for change, and since I'm keeping the car, I'm just going to change her. I always wanted something a little more attention-getting. The last straw was my therapist seeing the car a few weeks ago (by accident, he was walking across the lot as I was pulling in). He said with my personality and strange taste in clothes and music, he was a little surprised that I drove such a boring plain white Pinto. Here's my solution to that:



I painted the bottom dark metallic blue and striped it in red and blue, mimicking the factory 2 tone offering, but with a little more "pop". I figured patriotism never really goes out of style, and I'm proud of it being American and lasting this long, so that's the theme. I added self-adhesive chrome trim along the "belt line" (ding-line ;D :lol:) while I was here.








And fiddled with pinstripes around other 'features', like the antenna and gas cap.



This is what happens when Chuck has too much free time! ;D

It's a work in progress, I still have to finish the back and around the taillights, so stay tuned!

Chuck :afro:


A virtual version of my last Pinto. Was Registered Ride #111. Missed every day.

dave1987

Glad to hear she's up and kickin' again! I'm curious what you did as far as re-routing vacuum hoses. I have some hesitation when I initially take off from a dead stop. The only cure I have found to fix it so far is to adjust the carb rich.
1978 Ford Pinto Sedan - Family owned since new

Remembering Jeff Fitcher with every drive in my 78 Sedan.

I am a Pinto Surgeon. Fixing problems and giving Pintos a chance to live again is more than a hobby, it's a passion!

discolives78

Thanks guys.

Today I took off the EGR valve and removed the top. Cleaned out the passages, made sure the plunger and diaphram are working, and got it back together. I set the cam timing while we (me and my brother) were doing the timing belt. The ignition timing is spot on, and after re-routing a few vacuum hoses, it's got a heck-of-alot more pull on the take-off! ;D The hesitation is completely gone too! :fastcar:

It's still backfiring, but it's been narrowed down to the large crack right next to the exhaust bracket above the axle >:( couldn't be in a worse place. I think the muffler is plugged up too. (keep in mind it's the original exhaust! :D). So it's getting new exhaust hopefully around the beginning of the month. The car runs so smooth now that it's much easier for me to drive. I think I placed the blame on myself (and not the car) for the car being out of tune.  :embarrassed:

Chuck :afro:


A virtual version of my last Pinto. Was Registered Ride #111. Missed every day.

75bobcatv6

hey chuck, glad to hear it. and glad to hear you are doing a might bit better. keep us posted.

hellfirejim

Glad to hear you are up and about.   Remember there is always something to smile about.  Keep on truckin!!!!!
It's a good day to be alive!
PCCA Pinto Number #385


discolives78

Hey, everybody!

The car didn't sell, so I'm going to be a man of my word and keep it. I have been driving it almost every day this week, and that's made me feel a little better. I have to turn down the radio and concentrate on shifting until I hit cruising speeds, but that's ok. Maybe if I install a tach I'd feel better.

I made a new back shelf from some leftover "Masonite" and painted it black, looks great, and at a fraction of the $40 for a replacement!

I got knobs on the stereo, but I'm still looking for an 8-track (preferably 4 channel, or Quadraphonic). There's time to do that though, I have a radio for now.

I installed a new timing belt. I lost my USB cable for my camera, so no pics for now.

My neuroloy appointment went well. There don't seem to be any problems like Parkinson's, etc. He said that my anxiety was obviously high while I was there and that could be causing most of my problems. I called my Psychiatrist yesterday, and she called in to the pharmacy another bottle of Vistaril, so I'm taking 4 a day instead of 2, but same dosage.

My confidence is up, and I'm getting out of the house some, let us hope that continues.

Wishing all of you the best day possible! :)

Chuck :afro:


A virtual version of my last Pinto. Was Registered Ride #111. Missed every day.

dga57

Chuck,
Your comments about "no feedback" buyers on eBay are very true but, believe it or not, my very first purchase on eBay was $3500 for a 1979 Lincoln Continental Collector's Series in 2005!  I did, however, make contact with the seller and we exchanged emails and spoke several times on the phone leading up to the auction's end.  He had the "Buy it Now" set at $4500 but I met reserve at $3500 and ended up winning the car.  I'm sure he had reservations about me at the beginning but it worked out to be a smooth transaction.  My feedback score is now 160+ and that includes four additional auto purchases, one being my '72 Pinto.  So... some "no feedbacks" are okay, but they should go the extra mile to convince you of that, and then follow through with their purchases.
Dwayne :smile:
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

discolives78

I don't want to 'put anyone out' in order to help me out! :embarassed:

Please, don't misunderstand! I set the price high enough that it shouldn't end up as a 'derby' car, but low enough that someone would have the money to do modifications and repairs that they would like. I am driving right now, and I plan to insist that the neurologist look into the matter such that I will be able to drive my car regularly, and with confidence. Like I said, if the e-bay thing doesn't pan out (it has less than 2 days now), then I'm keeping it. I'm sure this car means more to me because of it's story and history than it will to almost anyone else. I also feel comfortable with this car, in particular, because I know it's history of foibles and repairs. I trust this car! :)

My financial situation is looking up (very recently), and if it continues to be a problem I will get a second car and use this one as I planned from the beginning, as my 'weekend toy'.


I do appreciate all of the support I've found here at the Pinto Club! We have great people here! :)

Chuck :afro:


A virtual version of my last Pinto. Was Registered Ride #111. Missed every day.

75bobcatv6

if i could i would just buy it from you tell you to use the money to do the swaps lol.. but my plans for the money im saving are set for the 76 fred has. and a new computer for myself cause mine is dying.. its 8 years old now

discolives78

All good talking points, my friends! :)

The decision to block 'no feedback' participants in the auction was made due to a person with no feedback choosing 'buy it now', not paying the required deposit, no longer being a 'registered' e-bayer after he 'completed' the transaction, etc. My feedback started at zero, but there are plenty of small items you can buy on e-bay to start out your score without feedback. My feedback is 31 (all from transactions less than $30) and ALL positive! A large purchase, such as a car, or more than $500 or so, do take more consideration! I also have seen people 'reserve the right to end the auction early'.

As far as modifying the car:

Mechanical modificatiions take special considerations that cosmetic parts don't necessarily require. Like I said before, it's not just a matter of trans and bell housing. There is also the radiator, pedal assembly, shifter, drive shaft, and possibly carburettor. Then the rack, pulleys, and pump to change to p/s, and master cylinder and booster to go to power brakes. It does add up to time, parts and $$$. I won't modify the basic mechanics myself, but if someone were to purchase the car, I wouldn't say anything or do anything to hinder that effort. Upon transfer, it's the new owner's baby...(s)he is free to change anything (s)he likes, as I have been. I've understood this concept all along. I did, at one point consider a v-8 swap, I even had the motor and tranny!

Chuck :afro:


A virtual version of my last Pinto. Was Registered Ride #111. Missed every day.

71pintoracer

Chuck, not sure about ending early but if you don't meet the reserve you don't have to sell and you can re list within a 60 day period free.
If you don't have time to do it right, when will you have time to do it over?