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Why the Ford Pinto didn’t suck

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suckThe Ford Pinto was born a low-rent, stumpy thing in Dearborn 40 years ago and grew to become one of the most infamous cars in history. The thing is that it didn't actually suck. Really.

Even after four decades, what's the first thing that comes to mind when most people think of the Ford Pinto? Ka-BLAM! The truth is the Pinto was more than that — and this is the story of how the exploding Pinto became a pre-apocalyptic narrative, how the myth was exposed, and why you should race one.

The Pinto was CEO Lee Iacocca's baby, a homegrown answer to the threat of compact-sized economy cars from Japan and Germany, the sales of which had grown significantly throughout the 1960s. Iacocca demanded the Pinto cost under $2,000, and weigh under 2,000 pounds. It was an all-hands-on-deck project, and Ford got it done in 25 months from concept to production.

Building its own small car meant Ford's buyers wouldn't have to hew to the Japanese government's size-tamping regulations; Ford would have the freedom to choose its own exterior dimensions and engine sizes based on market needs (as did Chevy with the Vega and AMC with the Gremlin). And people cold dug it.

When it was unveiled in late 1970 (ominously on September 11), US buyers noted the Pinto's pleasant shape — bringing to mind a certain tailless amphibian — and interior layout hinting at a hipster's sunken living room. Some call it one of the ugliest cars ever made, but like fans of Mischa Barton, Pinto lovers care not what others think. With its strong Kent OHV four (a distant cousin of the Lotus TwinCam), the Pinto could at least keep up with its peers, despite its drum brakes and as long as one looked past its Russian-roulette build quality.

But what of the elephant in the Pinto's room? Yes, the whole blowing-up-on-rear-end-impact thing. It all started a little more than a year after the Pinto's arrival.

 

Grimshaw v. Ford Motor Company

On May 28, 1972, Mrs. Lilly Gray and 13-year-old passenger Richard Grimshaw, set out from Anaheim, California toward Barstow in Gray's six-month-old Ford Pinto. Gray had been having trouble with the car since new, returning it to the dealer several times for stalling. After stopping in San Bernardino for gasoline, Gray got back on I-15 and accelerated to around 65 mph. Approaching traffic congestion, she moved from the left lane to the middle lane, where the car suddenly stalled and came to a stop. A 1962 Ford Galaxie, the driver unable to stop or swerve in time, rear-ended the Pinto. The Pinto's gas tank was driven forward, and punctured on the bolts of the differential housing.

As the rear wheel well sections separated from the floor pan, a full tank of fuel sprayed straight into the passenger compartment, which was engulfed in flames. Gray later died from congestive heart failure, a direct result of being nearly incinerated, while Grimshaw was burned severely and left permanently disfigured. Grimshaw and the Gray family sued Ford Motor Company (among others), and after a six-month jury trial, verdicts were returned against Ford Motor Company. Ford did not contest amount of compensatory damages awarded to Grimshaw and the Gray family, and a jury awarded the plaintiffs $125 million, which the judge in the case subsequently reduced to the low seven figures. Other crashes and other lawsuits followed.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Mother Jones and Pinto Madness

In 1977, Mark Dowie, business manager of Mother Jones magazine published an article on the Pinto's "exploding gas tanks." It's the same article in which we first heard the chilling phrase, "How much does Ford think your life is worth?" Dowie had spent days sorting through filing cabinets at the Department of Transportation, examining paperwork Ford had produced as part of a lobbying effort to defeat a federal rear-end collision standard. That's where Dowie uncovered an innocuous-looking memo entitled "Fatalities Associated with Crash-Induced Fuel Leakage and Fires."

The Car Talk blog describes why the memo proved so damning.

In it, Ford's director of auto safety estimated that equipping the Pinto with [an] $11 part would prevent 180 burn deaths, 180 serious burn injuries and 2,100 burned cars, for a total cost of $137 million. Paying out $200,000 per death, $67,000 per injury and $700 per vehicle would cost only $49.15 million.

The government would, in 1978, demand Ford recall the million or so Pintos on the road to deal with the potential for gas-tank punctures. That "smoking gun" memo would become a symbol for corporate callousness and indifference to human life, haunting Ford (and other automakers) for decades. But despite the memo's cold calculations, was Ford characterized fairly as the Kevorkian of automakers?

Perhaps not. In 1991, A Rutgers Law Journal report [PDF] showed the total number of Pinto fires, out of 2 million cars and 10 years of production, stalled at 27. It was no more than any other vehicle, averaged out, and certainly not the thousand or more suggested by Mother Jones.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

The big rebuttal, and vindication?

But what of the so-called "smoking gun" memo Dowie had unearthed? Surely Ford, and Lee Iacocca himself, were part of a ruthless establishment who didn't care if its customers lived or died, right? Well, not really. Remember that the memo was a lobbying document whose audience was intended to be the NHTSA. The memo didn't refer to Pintos, or even Ford products, specifically, but American cars in general. It also considered rollovers not rear-end collisions. And that chilling assignment of value to a human life? Indeed, it was federal regulators who often considered that startling concept in their own deliberations. The value figure used in Ford's memo was the same one regulators had themselves set forth.

In fact, measured by occupant fatalities per million cars in use during 1975 and 1976, the Pinto's safety record compared favorably to other subcompacts like the AMC Gremlin, Chevy Vega, Toyota Corolla and VW Beetle.

And what of Mother Jones' Dowie? As the Car Talk blog points out, Dowie now calls the Pinto, "a fabulous vehicle that got great gas mileage," if not for that one flaw: The legendary "$11 part."

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Pinto Racing Doesn't Suck

Back in 1974, Car and Driver magazine created a Pinto for racing, an exercise to prove brains and common sense were more important than an unlimited budget and superstar power. As Patrick Bedard wrote in the March, 1975 issue of Car and Driver, "It's a great car to drive, this Pinto," referring to the racer the magazine prepared for the Goodrich Radial Challenge, an IMSA-sanctioned road racing series for small sedans.

Why'd they pick a Pinto over, say, a BMW 2002 or AMC Gremlin? Current owner of the prepped Pinto, Fox Motorsports says it was a matter of comparing the car's frontal area, weight, piston displacement, handling, wheel width, and horsepower to other cars of the day that would meet the entry criteria. (Racers like Jerry Walsh had by then already been fielding Pintos in IMSA's "Baby Grand" class.)

Bedard, along with Ron Nash and company procured a 30,000-mile 1972 Pinto two-door to transform. In addition to safety, chassis and differential mods, the team traded a 200-pound IMSA weight penalty for the power gain of Ford's 2.3-liter engine, which Bedard said "tipped the scales" in the Pinto's favor. But according to Bedard, it sounds like the real advantage was in the turns, thanks to some add-ons from Mssrs. Koni and Bilstein.

"The Pinto's advantage was cornering ability," Bedard wrote. "I don't think there was another car in the B. F. Goodrich series that was quicker through the turns on a dry track. The steering is light and quick, and the suspension is direct and predictable in a way that street cars never can be. It never darts over bumps, the axle is perfectly controlled and the suspension doesn't bottom."

Need more proof of the Pinto's lack of suck? Check out the SCCA Washington, DC region's spec-Pinto series.

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My Somewhat Begrudging Apology To Ford Pinto

ford-pinto.jpg

I never thought I’d offer an apology to the Ford Pinto, but I guess I owe it one.

I had a Pinto in the 1970s. Actually, my wife bought it a few months before we got married. The car became sort of a wedding dowry. So did the remaining 80% of the outstanding auto loan.

During a relatively brief ownership, the Pinto’s repair costs exceeded the original price of the car. It wasn’t a question of if it would fail, but when. And where. Sometimes, it simply wouldn’t start in the driveway. Other times, it would conk out at a busy intersection.

It ranks as the worst car I ever had. That was back when some auto makers made quality something like Job 100, certainly not Job 1.

Despite my bad Pinto experience, I suppose an apology is in order because of a recent blog I wrote. It centered on Toyota’s sudden-acceleration problems. But in discussing those, I invoked the memory of exploding Pintos, perpetuating an inaccuracy.

The widespread allegation was that, due to a design flaw, Pinto fuel tanks could readily blow up in rear-end collisions, setting the car and its occupants afire.

People started calling the Pinto “the barbecue that seats four.” And the lawsuits spread like wild fire.

Responding to my blog, a Ford (“I would very much prefer to keep my name out of print”) manager contacted me to set the record straight.

He says exploding Pintos were a myth that an investigation debunked nearly 20 years ago. He cites Gary Schwartz’ 1991 Rutgers Law Review paper that cut through the wild claims and examined what really happened.

Schwartz methodically determined the actual number of Pinto rear-end explosion deaths was not in the thousands, as commonly thought, but 27.

In 1975-76, the Pinto averaged 310 fatalities a year. But the similar-size Toyota Corolla averaged 313, the VW Beetle 374 and the Datsun 1200/210 came in at 405.

Yes, there were cases such as a Pinto exploding while parked on the shoulder of the road and hit from behind by a speeding pickup truck. But fiery rear-end collisions comprised only 0.6% of all fatalities back then, and the Pinto had a lower death rate in that category than the average compact or subcompact, Schwartz said after crunching the numbers. Nor was there anything about the Pinto’s rear-end design that made it particularly unsafe.

Not content to portray the Pinto as an incendiary device, ABC’s 20/20 decided to really heat things up in a 1978 broadcast containing “startling new developments.” ABC breathlessly reported that, not just Pintos, but fullsize Fords could blow up if hit from behind.

20/20 thereupon aired a video, shot by UCLA researchers, showing a Ford sedan getting rear-ended and bursting into flames. A couple of problems with that video:

One, it was shot 10 years earlier.

Two, the UCLA researchers had openly said in a published report that they intentionally rigged the vehicle with an explosive.

That’s because the test was to determine how a crash fire affected the car’s interior, not to show how easily Fords became fire balls. They said they had to use an accelerant because crash blazes on their own are so rare. They had tried to induce a vehicle fire in a crash without using an igniter, but failed.

ABC failed to mention any of that when correspondent Sylvia Chase reported on “Ford’s secret rear-end crash tests.”

We could forgive ABC for that botched reporting job. After all, it was 32 years ago. But a few weeks ago, ABC, in another one of its rigged auto exposes, showed video of a Toyota apparently accelerating on its own.

Turns out, the “runaway” vehicle had help from an associate professor. He built a gizmo with an on-off switch to provide acceleration on demand. Well, at least ABC didn’t show the Toyota slamming into a wall and bursting into flames.

In my blog, I also mentioned that Ford’s woes got worse in the 1970s with the supposed uncovering of an internal memo by a Ford attorney who allegedly calculated it would cost less to pay off wrongful-death suits than to redesign the Pinto.

It became known as the “Ford Pinto memo,” a smoking gun. But Schwartz looked into that, too. He reported the memo did not pertain to Pintos or any Ford products. Instead, it had to do with American vehicles in general.

It dealt with rollovers, not rear-end crashes. It did not address tort liability at all, let alone advocate it as a cheaper alternative to a redesign. It put a value to human life because federal regulators themselves did so.

The memo was meant for regulators’ eyes only. But it was off to the races after Mother Jones magazine got a hold of a copy and reported what wasn’t the case.

The exploding-Pinto myth lives on, largely because more Americans watch 20/20 than read the Rutgers Law Review. One wonders what people will recollect in 2040 about Toyota’s sudden accelerations, which more and more look like driver error and, in some cases, driver shams.

So I guess I owe the Pinto an apology. But it’s half-hearted, because my Pinto gave me much grief, even though, as the Ford manager notes, “it was a cheap car, built long ago and lots of things have changed, almost all for the better.”

Here goes: If I said anything that offended you, Pinto, I’m sorry. And thanks for not blowing up on me.

Car stalling

Started by r4pinto, June 11, 2006, 06:32:15 PM

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goodolboydws

In re. your carb. with "gas coming out of the top":

The ONLY way that this can be happening is if the fuel inlet valve (i.e. needle and seat)is not working properly to stop the flow of fuel into the carb.

Most common causes are:
crud getting stuck blocking the needle from fully seating

a float that is set wrong, or one that is too heavy (usually from having a hole and containing fuel)

a worn resiliant needle valve tip, allowing fuel to continually flow past it, instead of being able to stop it when the float rises.

This fuel-over-flowing-the-carb problem is a relatively simple and cheap thing to fix/ replace if necessary and adjust properly, as long as you have the correct float level setting specification for that parrtiucular carb, vehicle and model year, as the specification changes regularly.

P.S. With the Ranger being a doner for that other carb, the odds are fairly strong that the primary and secondary jets are too large for your Pinto as the Ranger is a heavier vehicle, if so, and you don't change them, your fuel mileage will probably be disappointing as it will continually be running on the rich side with no increase in performance.

P.P.S. You might want to track down a LARGER size paper inline fuel filter, one used for a fuel injected Ford, to use in place the standard Pinto fuel filter.

Something that is generally NOT known is that almost all of the fuel injection fuel filters have a finer filtering media to stop smaller stuff that can make it through a standard filter for a carbureted engine. If you think that you're having fun now, consider how much bigger and more expensive to fix problem that the same size crud getting stuck inside fuel injectors and F.I. fuel pressure regulators could be causing.

earthquake

I still have a good carb,$25.00 plus shipping.Even the hunk o junk its on runs good with it.




















73 sedan parts car,80 crusin wagon conversion,76 F 250 460 SCJ,74 Ranchero 4x4,88 mustang lx convertable,and the readheaded step child 86 uhhh Chevy 4x4(Sorry guys it was cheap)

r4pinto

The car runs now. I got a carb from Pick N Pull from an 87 Ranger. It stalled a lot at idle but rigged up the idle motor & now the car runs. Dunno if I'd trust it to drive far, but it does run.
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

r4pinto

Quote from: 77turbopinto on June 13, 2006, 02:33:49 PM
I got a rebiuld carb. from NAPA one time and the car ran worse. It was rebuilt wrong; Got another one from them and it was fine. Maybe you can look for a rebuilt one.

Chances are that it is just a small chunk of poo doing it to you. I have found that Honda carb. cleaner is the BEST, it has Methaline Chloride in it (paint remover). You will be AMMAZED at how good it works.

The gaskets can only take so much, you might need new one. I found that coating them with Chap-stic keeps them nice for carb. TWEEKING.

Bill

Yeah, I plan on getting a reman for it. Until I can afford one I'm just gonna go ahead & get a used one so I can get the car running. I don't even care if it's the right carb for the car as long as it bolts up & the car runs well enough to drive the qtr mile to the storage unit.
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

grgic

Chap-stic
Hmmmmm
thanks for the tip
Joe

77turbopinto

I got a rebiuld carb. from NAPA one time and the car ran worse. It was rebuilt wrong; Got another one from them and it was fine. Maybe you can look for a rebuilt one.

Chances are that it is just a small chunk of poo doing it to you. I have found that Honda carb. cleaner is the BEST, it has Methaline Chloride in it (paint remover). You will be AMMAZED at how good it works.

The gaskets can only take so much, you might need new one. I found that coating them with Chap-stic keeps them nice for carb. TWEEKING.

Bill
Thanks to all U.S. Military members past & present.

r4pinto

Got the carb back together & started the car. IT started but was rough (always rough though) then died. Stried top retart it only to have it stumble & die. Looked under the hood & there's fuel everywhere. Looked like it was coming out the top of the carb? I'm just gonna replace this carb since something aint right with it. It was the original on the car & the previous owner just informed me they had carb problems before. Something tells me there's just something terribly wrong with that carb, especially since there's no logical explination for the problems I'm having.
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

renton481

The same thing happened with my car when I replaced the PCV.  I'd yanked the hose from the PCV to the base of the carb loose by accident, and my car did just the same as you describe -- turns over, starts, runs for maybe half a second, immediately dies.

It would run a bit longer if I kept pumping the accelerator pump.

When I put the hose back on the fitting I secured it with a small hose clamp.

While you're checking the other stuff out I'd at least check the vac hoses.

r4pinto

I tell ya you guys are great & are right. I do need to be more patient. But it's hard for me since I planned on gassing up my Dodge Omni GLHT for the first time in 2 years & replace the cv axle on it. The problem is it's in front of the Pinto at the bottom of the driveway. I guess that's frustrating me more than anything.

Especially since the GLH had  a small engine fire & I got it all fixed up but cant do anything with another dead car behind it.
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

BlueGoldPinto

Yes, that very well could have been your problem. I hope that there is not more where that crap came from though
My theory on the Gas Tank of the Ford Pinto:
If it ain't fixed, don't break it!! :)

BlueGoldPinto

A carb is just a stationary thing, it can be cleaned and reused. Replacing the carb is totally up to you, if it were me, I would keep cleaning it, or probably drop my tank and do a fuel system rebuild, blow out my lines, clean my tank and filters, and do a fuel pump check. 77turbopinto has a good idea. Hook that thing up to a gas can and see what kind of pressure your getting. And if after all that, your car is still running like crap, I would replace the carb. Do you have a local junkyard? If you could find one off of a ranger or something it might be cheaper to do it that way, or mabye someone on this site could help you out. But the important thing is, like 77turbopinto said, is not to get frustrated with it. Life goes on, you will figure it out. If you don't make that next car show, you'll make the next one. Its all a big learning experiance, and when you finally figure it out, you can have a feeling of accomplishment. Thats what working on your car yourself is all about, and it makes owning the car all the more special to you. Besides that, if something ever does go wrong again, at least you know what you did to remedy the problem the last time, and will have a good idea of where to start, and you can also help others in the same situation. You'll get her fixed, don't worry about that. Just take care of yourself!
My theory on the Gas Tank of the Ford Pinto:
If it ain't fixed, don't break it!! :)

r4pinto

Got that one piece cleaned out. I soaked it in parts cleaner for a few hours then sprayed it with carb cleaner. Noticed I still couldnt blow through it so I got some window screen & cut one wire off it, & cleared out the debris. I can now blow through it. I'm gonna put the carb back together tomorrow on my lunch break& we'll see what goes on from there.

That part could have caused my whole problem couldnt it?
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

r4pinto

The first time I had the problem I pulled the carb apart. It fixed the problem for all of a block. I pulled the carb apart on the car today & found very little fuel in the bowl & the little "v" shaped piece that screws in under the bowl cover that sprays fuel in the air horn to be plugged. when I move the accelerator linkage I can see fuel coming up through where the check balls are but it was more of a gurgling as opposed to a steady flow.  I'm thinking the carb is junk beyond rebuilding, but I'm not too sure.

If there's anything that can be done, somebody please let me know.
What else should I check out?
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

77turbopinto

As I mentioned in the other thread, keep the car. There is so much involved with the EFI swap it would be much cheaper just to get a new carb. (IF that is the problem).

I would bet that it is just a simple problem. Keep looking and don't get frustrated.

Was there any junk in the filter?

Is your choke working properly?

Do you have a vac. leak?

Is the engine ground strap connected?

Is the ignition timing correct?

Is the gas tank vent plugged?

Will the car run with an aux. gas tank?  (like a gas can directly hooked to the carb.)

Did you check the fuel pump for flow and pressure? You said you changed it before and the new one went bad (I think). If so, SOMETHING has caused it to fail. The most likely suspect is rust from the tank. Not to say you need to drop the tank, but the stainer is made to keep the larger chuncks from the lines.

Did you ever drop or look in the tank? You might be able to drain the tank and remove the sending unit/fuel pick-up without dropping the tank.

Did you pull apart the carb.?

Bill


Thanks to all U.S. Military members past & present.

r4pinto

well, the car was full before I headed out to Carlisle & also full on the way back. Harley & me had just filled up I think about 50 miles or so when it died on me. It was acting up  on me right before the fuel stop when Harley made a rest stop & I took off my passenger side wiper. I shut the car off to get a screwdriver out of the trunk & the car didnt want to start after that. Got it going, but problems got worse after that. Got fuel & it didnt want to start at the gas station.

I thought about vapor lock, but it was pretty cool out today when I couldnt get it to stay running. I am just so confused right now. I'll do what you suggest & take the carb apart again & see what I find. I wish I had another carb to put on it to see what happens, but I don't. I so wish this car was fuel injected since I know those cars perfectly. I might just think about taking  a tbi setup & putting it on the car.
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

BlueGoldPinto

Oh boy, not again, eh? What happened to it's running great? Hmmm... when she started acting up again, did you take the carb apart again? See how much more junk is in there from the last time you cleaned it out? (I remember when doing our 57 it took several trials of taking the top off the carb to clean it out....) just a suggestion..  How about fuel pickup? was your car particualrly full of gas before it started acting up on the way home from Carlisle? Do you know if your tanks been taken out before, if so, someone might have changed the fuel pick-up line, and gotten it too high.
Could anyone here expand on vapor-lock?might that be an issue?
My theory on the Gas Tank of the Ford Pinto:
If it ain't fixed, don't break it!! :)

r4pinto

Ok, I think I got a particular continuation of my problem that is easily explained.

I pump the gas twice & turn the key. The car starts & then dies. I pump the gas again & the car starts & dies again. The fuel flow from the pump is good, but for some reason the car stalls. I'm figuring this to be my main problem, but don't know what to look at.  I previously replaced the pump & filter & wa recently able to drive the car a little ways then the car would act up, but now the first problem has crept up.

Ideas???

Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress