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Why the Ford Pinto didn’t suck

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suckThe Ford Pinto was born a low-rent, stumpy thing in Dearborn 40 years ago and grew to become one of the most infamous cars in history. The thing is that it didn't actually suck. Really.

Even after four decades, what's the first thing that comes to mind when most people think of the Ford Pinto? Ka-BLAM! The truth is the Pinto was more than that — and this is the story of how the exploding Pinto became a pre-apocalyptic narrative, how the myth was exposed, and why you should race one.

The Pinto was CEO Lee Iacocca's baby, a homegrown answer to the threat of compact-sized economy cars from Japan and Germany, the sales of which had grown significantly throughout the 1960s. Iacocca demanded the Pinto cost under $2,000, and weigh under 2,000 pounds. It was an all-hands-on-deck project, and Ford got it done in 25 months from concept to production.

Building its own small car meant Ford's buyers wouldn't have to hew to the Japanese government's size-tamping regulations; Ford would have the freedom to choose its own exterior dimensions and engine sizes based on market needs (as did Chevy with the Vega and AMC with the Gremlin). And people cold dug it.

When it was unveiled in late 1970 (ominously on September 11), US buyers noted the Pinto's pleasant shape — bringing to mind a certain tailless amphibian — and interior layout hinting at a hipster's sunken living room. Some call it one of the ugliest cars ever made, but like fans of Mischa Barton, Pinto lovers care not what others think. With its strong Kent OHV four (a distant cousin of the Lotus TwinCam), the Pinto could at least keep up with its peers, despite its drum brakes and as long as one looked past its Russian-roulette build quality.

But what of the elephant in the Pinto's room? Yes, the whole blowing-up-on-rear-end-impact thing. It all started a little more than a year after the Pinto's arrival.

 

Grimshaw v. Ford Motor Company

On May 28, 1972, Mrs. Lilly Gray and 13-year-old passenger Richard Grimshaw, set out from Anaheim, California toward Barstow in Gray's six-month-old Ford Pinto. Gray had been having trouble with the car since new, returning it to the dealer several times for stalling. After stopping in San Bernardino for gasoline, Gray got back on I-15 and accelerated to around 65 mph. Approaching traffic congestion, she moved from the left lane to the middle lane, where the car suddenly stalled and came to a stop. A 1962 Ford Galaxie, the driver unable to stop or swerve in time, rear-ended the Pinto. The Pinto's gas tank was driven forward, and punctured on the bolts of the differential housing.

As the rear wheel well sections separated from the floor pan, a full tank of fuel sprayed straight into the passenger compartment, which was engulfed in flames. Gray later died from congestive heart failure, a direct result of being nearly incinerated, while Grimshaw was burned severely and left permanently disfigured. Grimshaw and the Gray family sued Ford Motor Company (among others), and after a six-month jury trial, verdicts were returned against Ford Motor Company. Ford did not contest amount of compensatory damages awarded to Grimshaw and the Gray family, and a jury awarded the plaintiffs $125 million, which the judge in the case subsequently reduced to the low seven figures. Other crashes and other lawsuits followed.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Mother Jones and Pinto Madness

In 1977, Mark Dowie, business manager of Mother Jones magazine published an article on the Pinto's "exploding gas tanks." It's the same article in which we first heard the chilling phrase, "How much does Ford think your life is worth?" Dowie had spent days sorting through filing cabinets at the Department of Transportation, examining paperwork Ford had produced as part of a lobbying effort to defeat a federal rear-end collision standard. That's where Dowie uncovered an innocuous-looking memo entitled "Fatalities Associated with Crash-Induced Fuel Leakage and Fires."

The Car Talk blog describes why the memo proved so damning.

In it, Ford's director of auto safety estimated that equipping the Pinto with [an] $11 part would prevent 180 burn deaths, 180 serious burn injuries and 2,100 burned cars, for a total cost of $137 million. Paying out $200,000 per death, $67,000 per injury and $700 per vehicle would cost only $49.15 million.

The government would, in 1978, demand Ford recall the million or so Pintos on the road to deal with the potential for gas-tank punctures. That "smoking gun" memo would become a symbol for corporate callousness and indifference to human life, haunting Ford (and other automakers) for decades. But despite the memo's cold calculations, was Ford characterized fairly as the Kevorkian of automakers?

Perhaps not. In 1991, A Rutgers Law Journal report [PDF] showed the total number of Pinto fires, out of 2 million cars and 10 years of production, stalled at 27. It was no more than any other vehicle, averaged out, and certainly not the thousand or more suggested by Mother Jones.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

The big rebuttal, and vindication?

But what of the so-called "smoking gun" memo Dowie had unearthed? Surely Ford, and Lee Iacocca himself, were part of a ruthless establishment who didn't care if its customers lived or died, right? Well, not really. Remember that the memo was a lobbying document whose audience was intended to be the NHTSA. The memo didn't refer to Pintos, or even Ford products, specifically, but American cars in general. It also considered rollovers not rear-end collisions. And that chilling assignment of value to a human life? Indeed, it was federal regulators who often considered that startling concept in their own deliberations. The value figure used in Ford's memo was the same one regulators had themselves set forth.

In fact, measured by occupant fatalities per million cars in use during 1975 and 1976, the Pinto's safety record compared favorably to other subcompacts like the AMC Gremlin, Chevy Vega, Toyota Corolla and VW Beetle.

And what of Mother Jones' Dowie? As the Car Talk blog points out, Dowie now calls the Pinto, "a fabulous vehicle that got great gas mileage," if not for that one flaw: The legendary "$11 part."

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Pinto Racing Doesn't Suck

Back in 1974, Car and Driver magazine created a Pinto for racing, an exercise to prove brains and common sense were more important than an unlimited budget and superstar power. As Patrick Bedard wrote in the March, 1975 issue of Car and Driver, "It's a great car to drive, this Pinto," referring to the racer the magazine prepared for the Goodrich Radial Challenge, an IMSA-sanctioned road racing series for small sedans.

Why'd they pick a Pinto over, say, a BMW 2002 or AMC Gremlin? Current owner of the prepped Pinto, Fox Motorsports says it was a matter of comparing the car's frontal area, weight, piston displacement, handling, wheel width, and horsepower to other cars of the day that would meet the entry criteria. (Racers like Jerry Walsh had by then already been fielding Pintos in IMSA's "Baby Grand" class.)

Bedard, along with Ron Nash and company procured a 30,000-mile 1972 Pinto two-door to transform. In addition to safety, chassis and differential mods, the team traded a 200-pound IMSA weight penalty for the power gain of Ford's 2.3-liter engine, which Bedard said "tipped the scales" in the Pinto's favor. But according to Bedard, it sounds like the real advantage was in the turns, thanks to some add-ons from Mssrs. Koni and Bilstein.

"The Pinto's advantage was cornering ability," Bedard wrote. "I don't think there was another car in the B. F. Goodrich series that was quicker through the turns on a dry track. The steering is light and quick, and the suspension is direct and predictable in a way that street cars never can be. It never darts over bumps, the axle is perfectly controlled and the suspension doesn't bottom."

Need more proof of the Pinto's lack of suck? Check out the SCCA Washington, DC region's spec-Pinto series.

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My Somewhat Begrudging Apology To Ford Pinto

ford-pinto.jpg

I never thought I’d offer an apology to the Ford Pinto, but I guess I owe it one.

I had a Pinto in the 1970s. Actually, my wife bought it a few months before we got married. The car became sort of a wedding dowry. So did the remaining 80% of the outstanding auto loan.

During a relatively brief ownership, the Pinto’s repair costs exceeded the original price of the car. It wasn’t a question of if it would fail, but when. And where. Sometimes, it simply wouldn’t start in the driveway. Other times, it would conk out at a busy intersection.

It ranks as the worst car I ever had. That was back when some auto makers made quality something like Job 100, certainly not Job 1.

Despite my bad Pinto experience, I suppose an apology is in order because of a recent blog I wrote. It centered on Toyota’s sudden-acceleration problems. But in discussing those, I invoked the memory of exploding Pintos, perpetuating an inaccuracy.

The widespread allegation was that, due to a design flaw, Pinto fuel tanks could readily blow up in rear-end collisions, setting the car and its occupants afire.

People started calling the Pinto “the barbecue that seats four.” And the lawsuits spread like wild fire.

Responding to my blog, a Ford (“I would very much prefer to keep my name out of print”) manager contacted me to set the record straight.

He says exploding Pintos were a myth that an investigation debunked nearly 20 years ago. He cites Gary Schwartz’ 1991 Rutgers Law Review paper that cut through the wild claims and examined what really happened.

Schwartz methodically determined the actual number of Pinto rear-end explosion deaths was not in the thousands, as commonly thought, but 27.

In 1975-76, the Pinto averaged 310 fatalities a year. But the similar-size Toyota Corolla averaged 313, the VW Beetle 374 and the Datsun 1200/210 came in at 405.

Yes, there were cases such as a Pinto exploding while parked on the shoulder of the road and hit from behind by a speeding pickup truck. But fiery rear-end collisions comprised only 0.6% of all fatalities back then, and the Pinto had a lower death rate in that category than the average compact or subcompact, Schwartz said after crunching the numbers. Nor was there anything about the Pinto’s rear-end design that made it particularly unsafe.

Not content to portray the Pinto as an incendiary device, ABC’s 20/20 decided to really heat things up in a 1978 broadcast containing “startling new developments.” ABC breathlessly reported that, not just Pintos, but fullsize Fords could blow up if hit from behind.

20/20 thereupon aired a video, shot by UCLA researchers, showing a Ford sedan getting rear-ended and bursting into flames. A couple of problems with that video:

One, it was shot 10 years earlier.

Two, the UCLA researchers had openly said in a published report that they intentionally rigged the vehicle with an explosive.

That’s because the test was to determine how a crash fire affected the car’s interior, not to show how easily Fords became fire balls. They said they had to use an accelerant because crash blazes on their own are so rare. They had tried to induce a vehicle fire in a crash without using an igniter, but failed.

ABC failed to mention any of that when correspondent Sylvia Chase reported on “Ford’s secret rear-end crash tests.”

We could forgive ABC for that botched reporting job. After all, it was 32 years ago. But a few weeks ago, ABC, in another one of its rigged auto exposes, showed video of a Toyota apparently accelerating on its own.

Turns out, the “runaway” vehicle had help from an associate professor. He built a gizmo with an on-off switch to provide acceleration on demand. Well, at least ABC didn’t show the Toyota slamming into a wall and bursting into flames.

In my blog, I also mentioned that Ford’s woes got worse in the 1970s with the supposed uncovering of an internal memo by a Ford attorney who allegedly calculated it would cost less to pay off wrongful-death suits than to redesign the Pinto.

It became known as the “Ford Pinto memo,” a smoking gun. But Schwartz looked into that, too. He reported the memo did not pertain to Pintos or any Ford products. Instead, it had to do with American vehicles in general.

It dealt with rollovers, not rear-end crashes. It did not address tort liability at all, let alone advocate it as a cheaper alternative to a redesign. It put a value to human life because federal regulators themselves did so.

The memo was meant for regulators’ eyes only. But it was off to the races after Mother Jones magazine got a hold of a copy and reported what wasn’t the case.

The exploding-Pinto myth lives on, largely because more Americans watch 20/20 than read the Rutgers Law Review. One wonders what people will recollect in 2040 about Toyota’s sudden accelerations, which more and more look like driver error and, in some cases, driver shams.

So I guess I owe the Pinto an apology. But it’s half-hearted, because my Pinto gave me much grief, even though, as the Ford manager notes, “it was a cheap car, built long ago and lots of things have changed, almost all for the better.”

Here goes: If I said anything that offended you, Pinto, I’m sorry. And thanks for not blowing up on me.

71 Pinto project, need help!!

Started by tintmaster, February 05, 2012, 01:35:25 PM

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tintmaster

Ya, thought of that. Thinking of getting a stronger case for the spool and 33 spline axles for the track. Then use the case for a 31 spline posi and new axles.

There are so many posi units, trying to figure which 1 to get. Looking at the Detroit Trutrac from Moser. I don't want clutches that can burn up or slip.

Thanks Robert for the info.
C. Eugene Brown

racer99

Dont cut your current axles,keep the axles and the center section all together as
a set.New axles will be 300.00 or so and you can pick up a 9 in center section
cheap enough.
Trust me on this,there will come a time you will get a wild hair and wish you had
kept the takeout stuff all together.

tintmaster

Yeah I know. Will probably get new axles with 31 spline. I don't know if my axles can be re-cut or not. 1 axle it 17" long and the other is 11" long.
C. Eugene Brown

tintmaster

Yeah, my 4 door 90 olds cutlass gets 15 MPG, so 12 wouldn't be to bad. Forgot to mention, the converter will be around 2800-3000 stall.

I am expecting 400 HP on the motor. Will start out with just 100 shot to get used to it. But only at the track, and not till the motor is broke in.

I will be having Holzman Race Cars making custom fender headers. I have had that planned from the beginning. I want the exhaust to run on the outside of frame and turn out in front of rear tires. Thinking of using oval tubing (http://www.spintechmufflers.com/oval-round-tubing/oval-tubing/cat_41.html?ccUser=9qjas6961dit38smi4tngf4i86 or  http://www.burnsstainless.com/304ovalsstubing.aspx) to tuck up a little closer to body. Definitely using Flowmaster 1 chamber racing muffler! Had them on my '74 GTO and love the sound. Nice little rumble just cruising around, but when you mash the throttle, all hell breaks loose.
C. Eugene Brown

racer99

Good luck finding a 33 spline carrier.
Most are 28 or 31,might have to get some axles also.

71hotrodpinto

Wow yahooo!
That sounds like a fun build!
Heard good and bad ( like everything these days on the internet) about DSS. Mostly good. They really cant guarantee that your particular setup they sell you will live with 650hp, but 450 should be no problem. Remember its about the tune, balance, and RPM your planning on running as to how much HP these blocks can handle.

SO i guess you kinda gave up on the Gas Mileage idea? LOL.  I did too! I cant imagine your going to pull more than 12mpg with a perfectly tuned 750.
Make it what i should be,(IMO) a FUN car!


YOU are going to need some good headers for the car now! Id lean towards the Hooker super comp fender-well style. They are a hassle, but for horse power id give them the nod.
Good luck and keep us informed!
Robert










95' 302,Forged Pistons,Polished rods
B303,1.7 Rockers,beehives
'68 port/polish heads                   
Coated Must II headers
Edelbrock Airgap
Holley570,Msd dist,CraneHI6
Mil

tintmaster

Ok, an update of whats going to happen.

I am going with a DSS 302 Level 10 block, 331 stroker kit to start with. I will be going slow, as I am broke as a joke. Then they have a new set of heads, forgot which 1's he said. But he just dyno'd  the 331 with a 750 Holley at 447HP! It will have all ARP bolts and studs, main cap girdle and windage tray to keep the mains from "WALKING" as it is referred to. DSS has 302 motor with this setup running over 650HP!!!! They are great guys, and will help you out. Even when I don't know a lot about a Ford motor. My 1st build.

Then for the trans, I have a buddy here in town that is a Ford nut and owns a transmission shop. He is going to build me an AOD. Going to have a converter custom made by Chance Transmissions to handle the 200HP shot of NOS!!!

Still trying to figure out what gear to go with in the pumpkin. Getting rid of the fool spool and 5.56 gears.
C. Eugene Brown

Srt

You guys have valid points. I'm still listening...
the only substitute for cubic inches is BOOST!!!

slowride

Quote from: Srt on February 10, 2012, 03:05:08 AM

The anti-swaybar is engineered to limit weight transfer from side to side throughout the entire range of vertical motion.

I think that the upper limit of vertical suspension travel on a Pinto will be reached before the anti-sway bar inhibits any detrimental effects on weight transfer, front-to-rear (in straight line racing) and traction.

IMHO.
To understand why removing/disconnecting the bar works, you need to look at how the suspension actually works. Lower control arms don't move up and down, they pivot in an arc. At the extremes of travel, this creates a bind in the bar links that limit the natural movement. While it may not SEEM like much, this is the point where maximum weight distribution is achieved. Just an additional inch or two of travel can help plant the tires harder.

fast64ranchero

Sorry, but your wrong, you'll never see a drag car with a sway bar on the front, even the factoy understands this, look at a new Jeep, you can get them with factory sway bar disconnects, for Better suspension travel and articulation.  the cure is to either not run one, or disconnect one side at the track, allowing full travel.

Quote from: Srt on February 10, 2012, 03:05:08 AM

The anti-swaybar is engineered to limit weight transfer from side to side throughout the entire range of vertical motion.

I think that the upper limit of vertical suspension travel on a Pinto will be reached before the anti-sway bar inhibits any detrimental effects on weight transfer, front-to-rear (in straight line racing) and traction.

IMHO.
71 Pro-Street pinto 2.3T powered
72 Treasure Valley Special 26K miles pinto
72 old V-8 parts Pinto
73 pinto, the nice one...

Srt

Quote from: 71hotrodpinto on February 09, 2012, 09:09:52 PM
because it limits the front suspension travel. The car launches, the front end starts to extend transferring the weight to the rear thus adding traction, then the sway bar runs out of 'travel' and limits the suspension extension. That suddenly adds weight to the front end and then effectively "yanks" the car back down.
This is assuming that you have any traction to begin with. A street tire car such like mine would probably blow the tires off without even trying to lift the car to the limits.
However  time and time again its been proven to help lower ET's on most all vehicles

The anti-swaybar is engineered to limit weight transfer from side to side throughout the entire range of vertical motion.

I think that the upper limit of vertical suspension travel on a Pinto will be reached before the anti-sway bar inhibits any detrimental effects on weight transfer, front-to-rear (in straight line racing) and traction.

IMHO.
the only substitute for cubic inches is BOOST!!!

71hotrodpinto

Quote from: Srt on February 09, 2012, 12:36:51 AM

why would it kill weight transfer?
because it limits the front suspension travel. The car launches, the front end starts to extend transferring the weight to the rear thus adding traction, then the sway bar runs out of 'travel' and limits the suspension extension. That suddenly adds weight to the front end and then effectively "yanks" the car back down.
This is assuming that you have any traction to begin with. A street tire car such like mine would probably blow the tires off without even trying to lift the car to the limits.
However  time and time again its been proven to help lower ET's on most all vehicles   


95' 302,Forged Pistons,Polished rods
B303,1.7 Rockers,beehives
'68 port/polish heads                   
Coated Must II headers
Edelbrock Airgap
Holley570,Msd dist,CraneHI6
Mil

Srt

Quote from: fast64ranchero on February 08, 2012, 08:41:27 AM
... and the sway bar will help on the street but kill weight transfer on the track...

why would it kill weight transfer?
the only substitute for cubic inches is BOOST!!!

71hotrodpinto

5 lug drums? well i could be redrilled stock ones? I mean if someone was going to put on new brakes so that they could change the lug pattern why would anyone keep drums?
Could you take some clean pics of your front suspension?
Sorry bout the idea of the 3.8 going in the trash. It sounded cool. Its just that any engine swap in these cars is a big tado! The 302/351  and the 2.3 turbo are the easiest and what most everyone does. Ford swaps that is. Unless you completely tube frame the thing, then anything is easy at that point.


As far as 302/351 id go stroker 302 block 331. The engine will always be lighter than the 351 by about 50lbs.
In a front heavy car like ours that means alot. However, if your really serious about HP then yah the 351 will hold more power and you can then stroke to 408 easily. 600+hp anyone?

[/size]HP ratings are RPM and tune related especially with Nitrous . Also how long do you plan to hold it at 6500 making 550HP? If your like most of us probably not long. The engine build and tune is actually more important. The fact is YES the 302 stock  block WILL split if really pushed into the 550 hp range for too long and too often. However there are plenty of people "out on the net"  "that say" their 5.0 pushes 500 to the wheels on a turbo/supercharger/nitrous whatever and has never had a problem Or has done it for "over 150 passes before it split"

[/size]
So IMO id stay wit the smaller because its lighter and you can "move up" later if you really decide that its not enough!

[/size]


95' 302,Forged Pistons,Polished rods
B303,1.7 Rockers,beehives
'68 port/polish heads                   
Coated Must II headers
Edelbrock Airgap
Holley570,Msd dist,CraneHI6
Mil

71HANTO

Quote from: tintmaster on February 08, 2012, 05:10:26 PM
Well, decided to do either a 302 or 351W. Someone told me that a 302 block won't go passed 500 horses. I want to do the 302 just cause its easier. Making custom over frame headers, as inner fender wells are all cut up from the 351C in it before I got it. Still going to use nitrous when needed. Was thinking of redoing tunnel anyway. So I think I will go with the AOD. Does anyone know if you can put a C4 bell housing on it? Or is the bell housing about the same size, just trans is bigger?

The bell bolt pattern for a 302, 351W, and 351C are the same (the 351M is not). The C4 was used on the 302 so it should work but I'm not sure of the sizes of the input shafts for the trans (needs more research). I like the 351W best of the 3 because it is not much more to rebuild than the 302 and has many "stroker" kits to choose from. Plus stock it makes 100 ft Lbs more than the 302 for the same given cam shaft. I put a small block C6 from a 72 351C behind my 69 Mustang 351W. A well built stock stroke 351W should put out around 550HP on the bottle...

71HANTO
"Life is a series of close ones...'til the last one"...cfpjr

tintmaster

Also was wondering if the Mustang ll suspension will work to switch to disc brakes. The car already has 5 lug drums on front. Not sure what they came from. Any way of being able to ID the front drums? Maybe I can find the disc for it.
C. Eugene Brown

tintmaster

Well, decided to do either a 302 or 351W. Someone told me that a 302 block won't go passed 500 horses. I want to do the 302 just cause its easier. Making custom over frame headers, as inner fender wells are all cut up from the 351C in it before I got it. Still going to use nitrous when needed. Was thinking of redoing tunnel anyway. So I think I will go with the AOD. Does anyone know if you can put a C4 bell housing on it? Or is the bell housing about the same size, just trans is bigger?
C. Eugene Brown

fast64ranchero

Nice looking car! as said above I'd steer clear of the C-4 for daily driving at those speeds, unless your ready to run a Freeway Friendly gear, which will kill your 1/4 ET's, the AOD will require Firewall mods to clear the bellhousing, I'm building a A4LD for my 72 right now, it smaller and should fit without firewall mods (I hope) the A4LD is basicaly the same trans as was used all the way up to 2010 in the Mustang GT's (5R55) with overdrive and convertor lock up.   when you figure out what tranny your going to use, you'll beable to figure out a street/strip gear, and the sway bar will help on the street but kill weight transfer on the track...
Your really going to have your work cut out for you to get 400hp out of a N/A 3.8,  300 ya, 400 not so easy, even at 300 crank hp, a small shot of giggle juice will make it run in the 10's if set up right.
Walt
71 Pro-Street pinto 2.3T powered
72 Treasure Valley Special 26K miles pinto
72 old V-8 parts Pinto
73 pinto, the nice one...

71hotrodpinto

Be careful, the sad thing is that the 71pinto front end is different in every way from the 74 and up (which is what all aftermarket street rod stuff is based on) except the shock. Every piece is slightly different. The spindles are shorter in height, the bushings are different dia, the control arms have a smaller mounting pattern and are shorter etc etc. The list goes on.
Us 71 owners are pretty much left out in the cold on most everything except the shocks and the wilwood style brake setups (5 lug only!)
Ive heard that some have pulled out the entire front crossmember from a later model and then its game on. Man thats a lot of work though! its almost easier to put a 71 style front end on a 74! LOL but i must digress..


95' 302,Forged Pistons,Polished rods
B303,1.7 Rockers,beehives
'68 port/polish heads                   
Coated Must II headers
Edelbrock Airgap
Holley570,Msd dist,CraneHI6
Mil

JohnW

www.speedwaymotors.com has got various brand and price tubular control arms that they claim will work on stock MII/Pinto front ends as well as coilover kits like this. There's one for $350 that I'm probably going to get down the road: http://www.speedwaymotors.com/Carrera-Mustang-II-Bolt-On-Coil-Over-Kit,182.html
-

71hotrodpinto

Ok i hear yah with the clutching issue.
Well the AOD is a standard Automatic no electronics.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_AOD_transmission


Alot of good info there.


Know that the bell is huge and your going to have packaging problems. Your going to have to rebuild the whole trans tunnle. Or maybe cutting out a tunnel from a car that came with this trans and then welding it in place of the small Pinto tunnel.( Which would probably be easier.)


The easiest way of all ($$$) is do the C4 and then attach a Gear Vendors Overdrive to the back. Unless you have a buddy that wants to unload a good one for nothing, then your talking around $3500 by the time your done... But its the ultimate. Easy fit, great highway gears and great pulling gears for fun!
Truth be known though, youll never re-coupe the cost in gas mileage! But it is nicer than watching and hearing your engine pulling 3200 rpms for 50 miles just trying to keep up with traffic! LOL



95' 302,Forged Pistons,Polished rods
B303,1.7 Rockers,beehives
'68 port/polish heads                   
Coated Must II headers
Edelbrock Airgap
Holley570,Msd dist,CraneHI6
Mil

tintmaster

I don't want a manual trans, because I have hip problems. So I will do an overdrive unit then. Any suggestions? I want 1 that is not compter controlled.
C. Eugene Brown

71hotrodpinto

So i also had a thought about the transmission choice.
Id stay away from the C4 for gas mileage issue.
You need overdrive IMO. at 70 to 75 your going to be using some rpm on the engine with a C4  and that will kill gas mileage. Best to put a T5 in it if you can.
Im thinking Thunderbird but im not sure that the 3.8 ever had one behind it. Hopfully someone else will chime in.

Or maybey an AOD 4 speed if you dont mind alot of work. That trans is big compared to the C4

Just some food for thought!


95' 302,Forged Pistons,Polished rods
B303,1.7 Rockers,beehives
'68 port/polish heads                   
Coated Must II headers
Edelbrock Airgap
Holley570,Msd dist,CraneHI6
Mil

71hotrodpinto

Quote from: tintmaster on February 05, 2012, 01:43:11 PM
Also how can I update the front suspension so it will handle better? I have looked for tubular control arms, but no luck. I want to be able to go around a corner without all the body roll. I know it won't be a SCCA carver, but somethings got to be better!

You dont need tubular control arms. Just rebuild the current arms with all new stuff. Search ebay. The upper ball joints are the same for all the years but the lowers are specific to the 71-72/73 years.

Poly strut bushings. They only make them for 74 and up but they fit mine perfectly.

I used new mustang II springs cut 2.5 coils (carefull! They do settle a bit after cutting!) and Koni shocks. KYB gas-a-just is also a great alternative.

A better solution is to check out QA1 and their Mustang II coil over setups. They were reported to be awesome by the Late Great Jeff ( AKA 78Pinto) BOLT IN ,and also adjustable.

As already said get a swaybar setup on it. Unless it was setup for one from the factory, your pretty much going to have to work at that one.  Tracking down all the related hardware for a stock 71-72 setup is very difficult. Also becarefull on the pan interferance at the front if you get an aftermarket one.

Lastly get rid of the front runners. I know they are cool, in fact i was tempted myself but on a highway at 75 MPH if you have to dart to the left or right because of some butt that pulls out in front of you or you have to stop, you NEED some rubber under there. Get as wide as 205 60 15 or the like.

I was shocked at how well mine handled after the V8 conversion. Granted im not autocrossing the thing but a normal corner on the way to work was like "turn right,  done... What??"
Good luck on the 3.8 and i hope to hear of it later!
Robert




95' 302,Forged Pistons,Polished rods
B303,1.7 Rockers,beehives
'68 port/polish heads                   
Coated Must II headers
Edelbrock Airgap
Holley570,Msd dist,CraneHI6
Mil

tintmaster

I will still race it, but I want it to be a sort of Pro Street. Hoping to run in the 10's on motor, and still get good gas mileage! :P
C. Eugene Brown

Reeves1

Set up for a drag car.....sure you want to change it ?

beaner

you can use a small block bell

brad :)

Cookieboystoys

Quote from: tintmaster on February 05, 2012, 01:43:11 PM
Also how can I update the front suspension so it will handle better?

sway bar
It's all about the Pintos! Baby!

tintmaster

Also how can I update the front suspension so it will handle better? I have looked for tubular control arms, but no luck. I want to be able to go around a corner without all the body roll. I know it won't be a SCCA carver, but somethings got to be better!
C. Eugene Brown

tintmaster


I am putting a 3.8 from a '96 mustang in my 71 Pinto. I will be stroking it, leaving EFI and bottle feeding it! This will be my daily driver.


I want to use a C4 trans. I will be using a 29" tall x 12" wide tire on 10" Telstar wheels out back. It has a 9" rear narrowed, (33 spline axles, full spool, 5:56 gears), which I plan on changing gears and spool. I want to drive this car everyday and get decent gas mileage, yet still make peoples jaw drop! Estimated H.P. will be around 400 on motor, then 150 shot of funny juice, if needed!


My question is what bell housing do I use, stall converter, rear gear ratio, and posi unit? Also, I will need a custom gas tank made because of the cage. It has a 5 gallon in it, which won't be enough. I can measure the dimensions, does anyone know where I can get a Stainless gas tank made?


I will be driving it to work on the highway 30 miles 1 way with a 75 MPH speed limit by the way.


The car is how I bought it. I have a lot to do to get it ready, but I'm up to the challenge! And will be loosing the big snorkel on hood. Going to get a cowl hood, maybe 4"!
C. Eugene Brown