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Why the Ford Pinto didn’t suck

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suckThe Ford Pinto was born a low-rent, stumpy thing in Dearborn 40 years ago and grew to become one of the most infamous cars in history. The thing is that it didn't actually suck. Really.

Even after four decades, what's the first thing that comes to mind when most people think of the Ford Pinto? Ka-BLAM! The truth is the Pinto was more than that — and this is the story of how the exploding Pinto became a pre-apocalyptic narrative, how the myth was exposed, and why you should race one.

The Pinto was CEO Lee Iacocca's baby, a homegrown answer to the threat of compact-sized economy cars from Japan and Germany, the sales of which had grown significantly throughout the 1960s. Iacocca demanded the Pinto cost under $2,000, and weigh under 2,000 pounds. It was an all-hands-on-deck project, and Ford got it done in 25 months from concept to production.

Building its own small car meant Ford's buyers wouldn't have to hew to the Japanese government's size-tamping regulations; Ford would have the freedom to choose its own exterior dimensions and engine sizes based on market needs (as did Chevy with the Vega and AMC with the Gremlin). And people cold dug it.

When it was unveiled in late 1970 (ominously on September 11), US buyers noted the Pinto's pleasant shape — bringing to mind a certain tailless amphibian — and interior layout hinting at a hipster's sunken living room. Some call it one of the ugliest cars ever made, but like fans of Mischa Barton, Pinto lovers care not what others think. With its strong Kent OHV four (a distant cousin of the Lotus TwinCam), the Pinto could at least keep up with its peers, despite its drum brakes and as long as one looked past its Russian-roulette build quality.

But what of the elephant in the Pinto's room? Yes, the whole blowing-up-on-rear-end-impact thing. It all started a little more than a year after the Pinto's arrival.

 

Grimshaw v. Ford Motor Company

On May 28, 1972, Mrs. Lilly Gray and 13-year-old passenger Richard Grimshaw, set out from Anaheim, California toward Barstow in Gray's six-month-old Ford Pinto. Gray had been having trouble with the car since new, returning it to the dealer several times for stalling. After stopping in San Bernardino for gasoline, Gray got back on I-15 and accelerated to around 65 mph. Approaching traffic congestion, she moved from the left lane to the middle lane, where the car suddenly stalled and came to a stop. A 1962 Ford Galaxie, the driver unable to stop or swerve in time, rear-ended the Pinto. The Pinto's gas tank was driven forward, and punctured on the bolts of the differential housing.

As the rear wheel well sections separated from the floor pan, a full tank of fuel sprayed straight into the passenger compartment, which was engulfed in flames. Gray later died from congestive heart failure, a direct result of being nearly incinerated, while Grimshaw was burned severely and left permanently disfigured. Grimshaw and the Gray family sued Ford Motor Company (among others), and after a six-month jury trial, verdicts were returned against Ford Motor Company. Ford did not contest amount of compensatory damages awarded to Grimshaw and the Gray family, and a jury awarded the plaintiffs $125 million, which the judge in the case subsequently reduced to the low seven figures. Other crashes and other lawsuits followed.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Mother Jones and Pinto Madness

In 1977, Mark Dowie, business manager of Mother Jones magazine published an article on the Pinto's "exploding gas tanks." It's the same article in which we first heard the chilling phrase, "How much does Ford think your life is worth?" Dowie had spent days sorting through filing cabinets at the Department of Transportation, examining paperwork Ford had produced as part of a lobbying effort to defeat a federal rear-end collision standard. That's where Dowie uncovered an innocuous-looking memo entitled "Fatalities Associated with Crash-Induced Fuel Leakage and Fires."

The Car Talk blog describes why the memo proved so damning.

In it, Ford's director of auto safety estimated that equipping the Pinto with [an] $11 part would prevent 180 burn deaths, 180 serious burn injuries and 2,100 burned cars, for a total cost of $137 million. Paying out $200,000 per death, $67,000 per injury and $700 per vehicle would cost only $49.15 million.

The government would, in 1978, demand Ford recall the million or so Pintos on the road to deal with the potential for gas-tank punctures. That "smoking gun" memo would become a symbol for corporate callousness and indifference to human life, haunting Ford (and other automakers) for decades. But despite the memo's cold calculations, was Ford characterized fairly as the Kevorkian of automakers?

Perhaps not. In 1991, A Rutgers Law Journal report [PDF] showed the total number of Pinto fires, out of 2 million cars and 10 years of production, stalled at 27. It was no more than any other vehicle, averaged out, and certainly not the thousand or more suggested by Mother Jones.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

The big rebuttal, and vindication?

But what of the so-called "smoking gun" memo Dowie had unearthed? Surely Ford, and Lee Iacocca himself, were part of a ruthless establishment who didn't care if its customers lived or died, right? Well, not really. Remember that the memo was a lobbying document whose audience was intended to be the NHTSA. The memo didn't refer to Pintos, or even Ford products, specifically, but American cars in general. It also considered rollovers not rear-end collisions. And that chilling assignment of value to a human life? Indeed, it was federal regulators who often considered that startling concept in their own deliberations. The value figure used in Ford's memo was the same one regulators had themselves set forth.

In fact, measured by occupant fatalities per million cars in use during 1975 and 1976, the Pinto's safety record compared favorably to other subcompacts like the AMC Gremlin, Chevy Vega, Toyota Corolla and VW Beetle.

And what of Mother Jones' Dowie? As the Car Talk blog points out, Dowie now calls the Pinto, "a fabulous vehicle that got great gas mileage," if not for that one flaw: The legendary "$11 part."

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Pinto Racing Doesn't Suck

Back in 1974, Car and Driver magazine created a Pinto for racing, an exercise to prove brains and common sense were more important than an unlimited budget and superstar power. As Patrick Bedard wrote in the March, 1975 issue of Car and Driver, "It's a great car to drive, this Pinto," referring to the racer the magazine prepared for the Goodrich Radial Challenge, an IMSA-sanctioned road racing series for small sedans.

Why'd they pick a Pinto over, say, a BMW 2002 or AMC Gremlin? Current owner of the prepped Pinto, Fox Motorsports says it was a matter of comparing the car's frontal area, weight, piston displacement, handling, wheel width, and horsepower to other cars of the day that would meet the entry criteria. (Racers like Jerry Walsh had by then already been fielding Pintos in IMSA's "Baby Grand" class.)

Bedard, along with Ron Nash and company procured a 30,000-mile 1972 Pinto two-door to transform. In addition to safety, chassis and differential mods, the team traded a 200-pound IMSA weight penalty for the power gain of Ford's 2.3-liter engine, which Bedard said "tipped the scales" in the Pinto's favor. But according to Bedard, it sounds like the real advantage was in the turns, thanks to some add-ons from Mssrs. Koni and Bilstein.

"The Pinto's advantage was cornering ability," Bedard wrote. "I don't think there was another car in the B. F. Goodrich series that was quicker through the turns on a dry track. The steering is light and quick, and the suspension is direct and predictable in a way that street cars never can be. It never darts over bumps, the axle is perfectly controlled and the suspension doesn't bottom."

Need more proof of the Pinto's lack of suck? Check out the SCCA Washington, DC region's spec-Pinto series.

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My Somewhat Begrudging Apology To Ford Pinto

ford-pinto.jpg

I never thought I’d offer an apology to the Ford Pinto, but I guess I owe it one.

I had a Pinto in the 1970s. Actually, my wife bought it a few months before we got married. The car became sort of a wedding dowry. So did the remaining 80% of the outstanding auto loan.

During a relatively brief ownership, the Pinto’s repair costs exceeded the original price of the car. It wasn’t a question of if it would fail, but when. And where. Sometimes, it simply wouldn’t start in the driveway. Other times, it would conk out at a busy intersection.

It ranks as the worst car I ever had. That was back when some auto makers made quality something like Job 100, certainly not Job 1.

Despite my bad Pinto experience, I suppose an apology is in order because of a recent blog I wrote. It centered on Toyota’s sudden-acceleration problems. But in discussing those, I invoked the memory of exploding Pintos, perpetuating an inaccuracy.

The widespread allegation was that, due to a design flaw, Pinto fuel tanks could readily blow up in rear-end collisions, setting the car and its occupants afire.

People started calling the Pinto “the barbecue that seats four.” And the lawsuits spread like wild fire.

Responding to my blog, a Ford (“I would very much prefer to keep my name out of print”) manager contacted me to set the record straight.

He says exploding Pintos were a myth that an investigation debunked nearly 20 years ago. He cites Gary Schwartz’ 1991 Rutgers Law Review paper that cut through the wild claims and examined what really happened.

Schwartz methodically determined the actual number of Pinto rear-end explosion deaths was not in the thousands, as commonly thought, but 27.

In 1975-76, the Pinto averaged 310 fatalities a year. But the similar-size Toyota Corolla averaged 313, the VW Beetle 374 and the Datsun 1200/210 came in at 405.

Yes, there were cases such as a Pinto exploding while parked on the shoulder of the road and hit from behind by a speeding pickup truck. But fiery rear-end collisions comprised only 0.6% of all fatalities back then, and the Pinto had a lower death rate in that category than the average compact or subcompact, Schwartz said after crunching the numbers. Nor was there anything about the Pinto’s rear-end design that made it particularly unsafe.

Not content to portray the Pinto as an incendiary device, ABC’s 20/20 decided to really heat things up in a 1978 broadcast containing “startling new developments.” ABC breathlessly reported that, not just Pintos, but fullsize Fords could blow up if hit from behind.

20/20 thereupon aired a video, shot by UCLA researchers, showing a Ford sedan getting rear-ended and bursting into flames. A couple of problems with that video:

One, it was shot 10 years earlier.

Two, the UCLA researchers had openly said in a published report that they intentionally rigged the vehicle with an explosive.

That’s because the test was to determine how a crash fire affected the car’s interior, not to show how easily Fords became fire balls. They said they had to use an accelerant because crash blazes on their own are so rare. They had tried to induce a vehicle fire in a crash without using an igniter, but failed.

ABC failed to mention any of that when correspondent Sylvia Chase reported on “Ford’s secret rear-end crash tests.”

We could forgive ABC for that botched reporting job. After all, it was 32 years ago. But a few weeks ago, ABC, in another one of its rigged auto exposes, showed video of a Toyota apparently accelerating on its own.

Turns out, the “runaway” vehicle had help from an associate professor. He built a gizmo with an on-off switch to provide acceleration on demand. Well, at least ABC didn’t show the Toyota slamming into a wall and bursting into flames.

In my blog, I also mentioned that Ford’s woes got worse in the 1970s with the supposed uncovering of an internal memo by a Ford attorney who allegedly calculated it would cost less to pay off wrongful-death suits than to redesign the Pinto.

It became known as the “Ford Pinto memo,” a smoking gun. But Schwartz looked into that, too. He reported the memo did not pertain to Pintos or any Ford products. Instead, it had to do with American vehicles in general.

It dealt with rollovers, not rear-end crashes. It did not address tort liability at all, let alone advocate it as a cheaper alternative to a redesign. It put a value to human life because federal regulators themselves did so.

The memo was meant for regulators’ eyes only. But it was off to the races after Mother Jones magazine got a hold of a copy and reported what wasn’t the case.

The exploding-Pinto myth lives on, largely because more Americans watch 20/20 than read the Rutgers Law Review. One wonders what people will recollect in 2040 about Toyota’s sudden accelerations, which more and more look like driver error and, in some cases, driver shams.

So I guess I owe the Pinto an apology. But it’s half-hearted, because my Pinto gave me much grief, even though, as the Ford manager notes, “it was a cheap car, built long ago and lots of things have changed, almost all for the better.”

Here goes: If I said anything that offended you, Pinto, I’m sorry. And thanks for not blowing up on me.

My New 78 Pinto

Started by Cookieboy, November 11, 2007, 02:50:14 PM

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Cookieboystoys

Quote from: chrisf1219 on November 21, 2007, 10:27:46 AM
hi cookieboy i looked at your 78 and you have the same bumpers as my 77 wagon.itll look good on your as well. have you seen the neg batt termainals with the green knob to turn off the juice. i have one on my wagon and it works well to keep the battery up. just a thought  chris

Yes Chris 77 and 78 use the same bumpers, I wanna see your's with the lower spoiler you added. I looked at the Aerostars on Ebay and think I know which one you used... I would just like to see pictures of it mounted.

I just checked w/the auto parts store and they have the turn off switch for batteries you mentioned.... cool, may need to get one  ;D

Update!!! Started the Interior Restore/Fix Up

click here --> http://www.fordpinto.com/smf/index.php/topic,9182
It's all about the Pintos! Baby!

chrisf1219

hi cookieboy i looked at your 78 and you have the same bumpers as my 77 wagon.itll look good on your as well. have you seen the neg batt termainals with the green knob to turn off the juice. i have one on my wagon and it works well to keep the battery up. just a thought  chris
77 wagon auto 2.3  wagons are the best and who knew I like flames on a pinto!!!!

Cookieboystoys

Quote from: SeanP on November 20, 2007, 11:17:38 PM
I noticed your timing belt cover is missing too.  My 78 is also missing it's cover.  Are they prone to fall off, break off, get lost, get stolen or what? 

It was plastic and falling apart.... crumbling would be a better description. I think I have an extra metal one around here someplace...
It's all about the Pintos! Baby!

SeanP

Very nice looking 78.  I noticed your timing belt cover is missing too.  My 78 is also missing it's cover.  Are they prone to fall off, break off, get lost, get stolen or what?  Kind of low priority on the parts list anyway.  Oh yeah, Pintos may be money pits but like someone told my wife: "at least he's spending time and money on his car and not some blond bimbo."  No offense to any blonds or bimbos.   
Biloxi, MS
1978 brown Pinto Pony trunk
facebook.com/thatbrownpinto

77turbopinto

Thanks to all U.S. Military members past & present.

Cookieboystoys

Well I took it for it first big ride... Whooop!! Eeeeee!!

A little intown driving and even got it out on the highway a bit. Seemed to do OK, I just wish it wasn't getting colder and chance of snow for the next couple days. Don't really want to drive it if it's snowing and messy...
It's all about the Pintos! Baby!

Cookieboystoys

High Horse... all I know at this point is 5-7 days and it's dead and the battery is less than a year old. We have been unusually warm for this time of the year, temps haven't dropped below 20 yet  ???   ;D

I might look into it this week but have a bunch of other stuff I have to do so it may wait. I'll just add it to the list of other small items I need to do to it come spring...
It's all about the Pintos! Baby!

High_Horse

CookieBoy,
    Some vehicles draw a little bit of juice when the ignition is off so a test light that comes on is not uncommon. Some batteries are packed with lead cells and last a good seven years some batteries are lean on cells  and last 1.5 years. Generally a lean cell battery will go bad when it starts to get cold out like Oct. Nov.....Like clock work. I would place a volt olm meter across the terminals and see if it has a shorted cell or charge it up for a little while and see if it dischargers rapidly...(1 to 2 volts in 10-15 minutes).
Phils Toys,
        The kids I can handle. ;D

                                                                                                                                            High_Horse
Started with a Bobcat wagon. Then a Cruising wagon. Now a Chocolate brown 77 wagon. I will enjoy this car for a long time. I'm in. High_Horse

phils toys

Quote from: High_Horse on November 18, 2007, 07:14:47 PM
After expressing my intrest in a 100 MPH speedo. Phils Toys wasted no time sending  me a spare 110 set-up to see if I could use it. Well, It went right in.
.
A big Thanx Phils Toys!!!!

                                                                                                                               High_Horse

        

                                                                 
you are welcome . Glad i could help.
Phils toys.
PS  wait till  you  get the bill  Christmas is coming and i have 5 children  and a wife to buy for...........     :hypno:   :surprised:   :hangover:
2006, 07,08 ,10 Carlisle 3rd stock pinto 4 years same place
2007 PCCA East Regional Best Wagon
2008 CAHS Prom Coolest Ride
2011,2014 pinto stampede

Cookieboystoys

Quote from: High_Horse on November 18, 2007, 07:14:47 PM
After expressing my intrest in a 100 MPH speedo. Phils Toys wasted no time sending  me a spare 110 set-up to see if I could use it. Well, It went right in.
                                                                                                                               High_Horse
way to go... the wagon deserves a 110mph speedo. what with the v8 and all  ;D

and hats off to Phils Toys for helping' out a fellow in need

I think I'm ready to put insurance on the 78 and start driving it... fixed a few things and all is well and ready. Ignition is fixed and working, fixed an upper heater line, mounted the door pull, fixed the passenger window crank, swapped tires with the 77 wagon, replaced the neg. battery cable and mounted a new battery, flushed the radiator... twice, and filled with fresh antifreeze 30 below+, found all the parts to my mustang II center console and mounted for fit, checked all the lights... gads I'm pooped...

I also charged up the battery on my van... seems I have a draw on the battery someplace and it's killing the battery. I disconnected the neg. battery cable and put a test light between the neg battery cable and the neg post on the battery... lit right up. I didn't have time to troubleshoot so I just left the neg cable loose... it's parked for the winter anyhow.

Only thing I didn't get done was new door hinge pins... that's a job for another day.

It's all about the Pintos! Baby!

High_Horse

After expressing my intrest in a 100 MPH speedo. Phils Toys wasted no time sending  me a spare 110 set-up to see if I could use it. Well, It went right in.
I was going to use the matched set of face gauges but I could not because the center dial caps were different but I was able to just snap the one off the fuel side and change it with mine. The one on the speedo is fixed with the speedo dial and would have required considerable surgery. The numbers on the 110 unit and matching fuel guage are D42F-17265 and D42F-9306. The numbers from my stock 77 85 MPH units are D7EF-17265 and D52F-9306.
Also, just for general info...when I did my v8 conversion I kept the same white speedo drive gear ( the one that fits into the trans) in the c4 that it came with...and my speedo has been reading 5 mph higher then how fast I was going...and the spread got progressively higher the faster I went. Well, I finally got around to putting the purple gear back in that was in my c3 behind the v6 and the speed is now reading accurately.
A big Thanx Phils Toys!!!!

                                                                                                                               High_Horse

         

                                                                 
Started with a Bobcat wagon. Then a Cruising wagon. Now a Chocolate brown 77 wagon. I will enjoy this car for a long time. I'm in. High_Horse

r4pinto

I can tell you from experience that the switch is slotted where it mounts to the steering column & can be adjusted. The 78 I used to have had a massive water leak & water leaked into the ignitioin switch in the dead of winter. It was locked solid from the ice. Anyways, I bought a new switch & installed it & had to move it around to get the position right. What I did was turn the key to the "on position & also made sure the switch was in the on position. I then put the ignition rod in the switch & finally installed the switch on the column. When I did that I was able to get it positioned right so I could start the car & have no problems.
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

Cookieboystoys

Quote from: 77turbopinto on November 12, 2007, 12:14:10 PM
Forgot to mention the staring issue.

The way the switch works is that it will cut over to different 'ignition power' circut when the switch is turned to 'start'. It is fully seperate, and when the key returns to the 'run' postition it goes to the normal 'on/run' circut.

I would swap the igintion switch (electrical) with a know good one; it is located on the top of the steering column down near the firewall.

Bill

Hey Bill, I stopped at the auto parts store today and one of the guys there said the switch is adjustable? they showed me a picture of the part and the 2 screw holes look to allow for adjustment... and suggested I just try to adjust it... The seller did say the steering column had been changed so could it be possible to adjust the switch and it may fix the problem? what do you think?
It's all about the Pintos! Baby!

r4pinto

My 77 is 85. The 78 I used to have, someone put in an early year (71- 73 prolly), so I'm not too sure what it was but almost 100% sure it would be 85 as well.
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

r4pinto

Quote from: 77turbopinto on November 13, 2007, 08:44:41 AM
Matt,

  I agree with CB. They are all money-pits to some degree.

You would not believe what I needed to do to get Connie's car just to be able to drive it: steering rack, tie rod ends, wheel bearing, steering colomn, rag joint, 1 q-glass, rear axle, tires, leaf springs, u-joint, rear main seal, radiator, FULL exhaust, brakes, brake lines, brake hoses, lots of carb. work, tranny cooler line, and maybe a few more things.

Then there was the body/interior: replace both doors, fix the dents and holes in the q-panels, fix the dents in the fenders and hood, FIND parts to replace + replace the wheel lip moldings, grille, and side trim, FIND interior parts+cloth+vinyl.......

Just keep working on yours and learning. If you get another it might have less, more or different issues, but are gaining knowledge (and having fun??).

Bill

Yeah, I know what you're saying Bill. My first Pinto was in much, much worse shape than this one. The only thing it did better than the 77 is it drove home. Electrical problems, major rust, blown engine, shot interior, missing sunroof panel, busted speedo. Not fun to drive at all. If anything else when I get frustrated with it I always have my turbo Dodge Omni I can go back to. Yeah I enjoy working on it & it's always a big learning experience. Not to mention how it's pictured in my head compared to how it is makes me work even harder to get the car where I want it to be. Although right now I would just be happy to be able to drive it & get the looks. lol
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

phils toys

76 bobcat 100mph
phils toys

i just looked and my spare is from a 74 is 100 mph as well
tried to add pic   but  site will not let me.
2006, 07,08 ,10 Carlisle 3rd stock pinto 4 years same place
2007 PCCA East Regional Best Wagon
2008 CAHS Prom Coolest Ride
2011,2014 pinto stampede

Cookieboystoys

would be interesting if we could verify if it a 1975 speedo... or from what year just for informational purposes.

So people! we need help from owners of 75 and 76 Pinto's...  need you to look and check your speedo's and report back if it's not to much of a problem what you have... 110mph, 100mph or 85mph

Thanks  ;D
It's all about the Pintos! Baby!

douglasskemp

71-74 came with 110MPH speedos also (two different numbering styles)...it went down to 100 in 75 i think, and then 85 after that.
The Pinto I had I gave to my brother. The car was originally my mom's, (78 red Pinto sedan with a 2.3 and a 4spd.) I am originally from Tucson, AZ but moved to Oxnard CA :D
I'm looking for a Pinto wagon with an automatic.

High_Horse

CookieBoy,
      This is FordPinto.com....Home of the Pinto experts....aaand Ford experts. When I fall into my next Pinto,You can bet your bottom dollar that I will lay that car on the table just as you did to be critiqued,,,,,, that is all the fun and that is what makes us all experts. I might not elaborate though, I might say "Look what I found".
I learned something today.......I learned that Pinto's came with 100 MPH speedos and I sure would like one of those. I'll bet I have the right speedo for your car sitting in the next room and I'll bet it has whatever milage you want on it and I'll bet it has 50 bucks hidden in it somewhere.

                                                                                                                                              Elaborate_Horse

 
Started with a Bobcat wagon. Then a Cruising wagon. Now a Chocolate brown 77 wagon. I will enjoy this car for a long time. I'm in. High_Horse

77turbopinto

Matt,

  I agree with CB. They are all money-pits to some degree.

You would not believe what I needed to do to get Connie's car just to be able to drive it: steering rack, tie rod ends, wheel bearing, steering colomn, rag joint, 1 q-glass, rear axle, tires, leaf springs, u-joint, rear main seal, radiator, FULL exhaust, brakes, brake lines, brake hoses, lots of carb. work, tranny cooler line, and maybe a few more things.

Then there was the body/interior: replace both doors, fix the dents and holes in the q-panels, fix the dents in the fenders and hood, FIND parts to replace + replace the wheel lip moldings, grille, and side trim, FIND interior parts+cloth+vinyl.......

Just keep working on yours and learning. If you get another it might have less, more or different issues, but are gaining knowledge (and having fun??).

Bill
Thanks to all U.S. Military members past & present.

Cookieboystoys

Quote from: r4pinto on November 13, 2007, 01:54:43 AM
If only I had found one in that good of shape, but noooo. I had to get a project mobile that had to be towed home, cuz of a bad tranny.

Hey Matt, unless you look long and spend the big money and get really lucky it's hard to get a "perfect" car. After all Pinto's are 27 years old and older. I can see appox $350+ just for the gaskets that need replacing - door, hatch, windshield, beltline that I can spend and I haven't even driven it 2 miles yet. It's a nice start and the price wasn't to bad for what I got so I'm happy. In the end it will depend on the mechanical condition and how many repairs I will end up doing before I can call it a great deal.

After all I'm replacing the 1980 beater I bought last winter and did put a bunch of time and money into with this one in hopes of a better driver. So I do know how you feel...

Quote from: Pintony on November 13, 2007, 02:04:19 AM
Looking at the dash photo I think I see sand blasting marks???
Is there sand in this car???
From Pintony

I think what you see is the overspray from the Macco paint job 2 months ago... the door gaskets are so bad you can see daylight and when it was sprayed a bit leaked through and little white dots on the dash pad... no sand I can see... lot's of overspray though...  ;D
It's all about the Pintos! Baby!

Pintony

Looking at the dash photo I think I see sand blasting marks???
Is there sand in this car???
From Pintony

r4pinto

Until seeing the picture of yours I didn't even know they ever had sunshades back there. Nice touch. really cleans it up back there. If only I had found one in that good of shape, but noooo. I had to get a project mobile that had to be towed home, cuz of a bad tranny.
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

Cookieboystoys

Quote from: losin sux on November 12, 2007, 11:03:33 PM
I notice you also have rear sun shade option, cool beans.  I have often wondered how many of our little ponies actually had that option.  Nice score!

I thought it was kind of cool too  ;D
It's all about the Pintos! Baby!

losin sux

I notice you also have rear sun shade option, cool beans.  I have often wondered how many of our little ponies actually had that option.  Nice score!
77 HB 2.3 C3 3.40

Cookieboystoys

Thanks Bill, kind of what I thought too...

BTW all.... I updated the page/link above and now only 24 pics and updated the look to match my personal web site. I still need to update my site to show the link but that's a bit-o-work and just don't have the time right now...

Thanks for looking  ;D
It's all about the Pintos! Baby!

77turbopinto

Forgot to mention the staring issue.

The way the switch works is that it will cut over to different 'ignition power' circut when the switch is turned to 'start'. It is fully seperate, and when the key returns to the 'run' postition it goes to the normal 'on/run' circut.

I would swap the igintion switch (electrical) with a know good one; it is located on the top of the steering column down near the firewall.

Bill
Thanks to all U.S. Military members past & present.

Cookieboystoys

well.... just had a nice long conversation with the seller about some of the questions I had... Super! nice guy and was very willing to answer questions. He did do a bunch of work to the car to get it back on the road after sitting for many, many years. I can tell just from looking at the car he did put a little "love" into the little Pinto. He is convinced that it was a low milage car and purchased it from the original owner who couldn't drive anymore and that's why it sat for all those years He didn't have any idea about the speedo change and I'm satisfied with his answer to the question. I suppose it's always possible the original speedo gave out on the original owner many, many years ago and was swapped out during it's early life.. he did tell me that he would try to get me the phone # of the original owner and said if I wanted to call and ask them he's sure she would be willing to answer any questions I would have.

If I get the phone # for the original owner I may call just to see if the question can be cleared up... but let's face it... doesn't really matter. It is kind of curious as Tony said... 100mph is kind of odd

I also hope to get some pictures of the car before the paint and body work was done. It used to be a light blue with black vinyl top and some body molding. I can tell there used to be wheel lip molding on the car that isn't there any more. Will be nice to have just for history purposes.
It's all about the Pintos! Baby!

Pintony

I do not think I have ever seen a Pinto with a 100mph guage..
The early Pinto had 110mph
Maybe someone changed the motor and swapped in the 100 to reflect the miles on the engine not the car???
From Pintony

Cookieboystoys

Thanks Bill, I noticed the lack of padding too and the door pull. I need to go out to where the 80 and 78 wagon are stored and check the extra junk doors I have for some mounting clips as I only have one of the 3 I will need.

The console I'm not to worried about.. I have a center console (between the seats and forward) from a Mustang II I've been trying to find a home for and to use it I need to remove the Pinto one.

and Thanks r4pinto... not to bad for a driver... I'm happy so far  ;)
It's all about the Pintos! Baby!