Mini Classifieds

1976 Pinto

Date: 10/24/2017 02:00 pm
Looking for Pinto manual shifter parts
Date: 01/28/2021 03:49 pm
1976-1979 FORD PINTO BOBCAT FRONT HOOD TRIM MOLDING D4FZ-16856-A OEM EXCELLENT

Date: 09/22/2020 11:33 pm
Clutch Pedals for 75to 80 Pinto
Date: 09/21/2018 11:35 am
rear hatch back louvers

Date: 04/18/2017 12:44 pm
1971-1975 Pinto
Date: 01/09/2017 04:14 pm
1977 Left Side quarter panel
Date: 06/10/2019 04:16 pm
Looking for a few parts - TIA
Date: 02/19/2023 12:18 pm
(3) 1980 Ford Pinto Station Wagon Projects

Date: 03/15/2023 02:16 pm

Why the Ford Pinto didn’t suck

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suckThe Ford Pinto was born a low-rent, stumpy thing in Dearborn 40 years ago and grew to become one of the most infamous cars in history. The thing is that it didn't actually suck. Really.

Even after four decades, what's the first thing that comes to mind when most people think of the Ford Pinto? Ka-BLAM! The truth is the Pinto was more than that — and this is the story of how the exploding Pinto became a pre-apocalyptic narrative, how the myth was exposed, and why you should race one.

The Pinto was CEO Lee Iacocca's baby, a homegrown answer to the threat of compact-sized economy cars from Japan and Germany, the sales of which had grown significantly throughout the 1960s. Iacocca demanded the Pinto cost under $2,000, and weigh under 2,000 pounds. It was an all-hands-on-deck project, and Ford got it done in 25 months from concept to production.

Building its own small car meant Ford's buyers wouldn't have to hew to the Japanese government's size-tamping regulations; Ford would have the freedom to choose its own exterior dimensions and engine sizes based on market needs (as did Chevy with the Vega and AMC with the Gremlin). And people cold dug it.

When it was unveiled in late 1970 (ominously on September 11), US buyers noted the Pinto's pleasant shape — bringing to mind a certain tailless amphibian — and interior layout hinting at a hipster's sunken living room. Some call it one of the ugliest cars ever made, but like fans of Mischa Barton, Pinto lovers care not what others think. With its strong Kent OHV four (a distant cousin of the Lotus TwinCam), the Pinto could at least keep up with its peers, despite its drum brakes and as long as one looked past its Russian-roulette build quality.

But what of the elephant in the Pinto's room? Yes, the whole blowing-up-on-rear-end-impact thing. It all started a little more than a year after the Pinto's arrival.

 

Grimshaw v. Ford Motor Company

On May 28, 1972, Mrs. Lilly Gray and 13-year-old passenger Richard Grimshaw, set out from Anaheim, California toward Barstow in Gray's six-month-old Ford Pinto. Gray had been having trouble with the car since new, returning it to the dealer several times for stalling. After stopping in San Bernardino for gasoline, Gray got back on I-15 and accelerated to around 65 mph. Approaching traffic congestion, she moved from the left lane to the middle lane, where the car suddenly stalled and came to a stop. A 1962 Ford Galaxie, the driver unable to stop or swerve in time, rear-ended the Pinto. The Pinto's gas tank was driven forward, and punctured on the bolts of the differential housing.

As the rear wheel well sections separated from the floor pan, a full tank of fuel sprayed straight into the passenger compartment, which was engulfed in flames. Gray later died from congestive heart failure, a direct result of being nearly incinerated, while Grimshaw was burned severely and left permanently disfigured. Grimshaw and the Gray family sued Ford Motor Company (among others), and after a six-month jury trial, verdicts were returned against Ford Motor Company. Ford did not contest amount of compensatory damages awarded to Grimshaw and the Gray family, and a jury awarded the plaintiffs $125 million, which the judge in the case subsequently reduced to the low seven figures. Other crashes and other lawsuits followed.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Mother Jones and Pinto Madness

In 1977, Mark Dowie, business manager of Mother Jones magazine published an article on the Pinto's "exploding gas tanks." It's the same article in which we first heard the chilling phrase, "How much does Ford think your life is worth?" Dowie had spent days sorting through filing cabinets at the Department of Transportation, examining paperwork Ford had produced as part of a lobbying effort to defeat a federal rear-end collision standard. That's where Dowie uncovered an innocuous-looking memo entitled "Fatalities Associated with Crash-Induced Fuel Leakage and Fires."

The Car Talk blog describes why the memo proved so damning.

In it, Ford's director of auto safety estimated that equipping the Pinto with [an] $11 part would prevent 180 burn deaths, 180 serious burn injuries and 2,100 burned cars, for a total cost of $137 million. Paying out $200,000 per death, $67,000 per injury and $700 per vehicle would cost only $49.15 million.

The government would, in 1978, demand Ford recall the million or so Pintos on the road to deal with the potential for gas-tank punctures. That "smoking gun" memo would become a symbol for corporate callousness and indifference to human life, haunting Ford (and other automakers) for decades. But despite the memo's cold calculations, was Ford characterized fairly as the Kevorkian of automakers?

Perhaps not. In 1991, A Rutgers Law Journal report [PDF] showed the total number of Pinto fires, out of 2 million cars and 10 years of production, stalled at 27. It was no more than any other vehicle, averaged out, and certainly not the thousand or more suggested by Mother Jones.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

The big rebuttal, and vindication?

But what of the so-called "smoking gun" memo Dowie had unearthed? Surely Ford, and Lee Iacocca himself, were part of a ruthless establishment who didn't care if its customers lived or died, right? Well, not really. Remember that the memo was a lobbying document whose audience was intended to be the NHTSA. The memo didn't refer to Pintos, or even Ford products, specifically, but American cars in general. It also considered rollovers not rear-end collisions. And that chilling assignment of value to a human life? Indeed, it was federal regulators who often considered that startling concept in their own deliberations. The value figure used in Ford's memo was the same one regulators had themselves set forth.

In fact, measured by occupant fatalities per million cars in use during 1975 and 1976, the Pinto's safety record compared favorably to other subcompacts like the AMC Gremlin, Chevy Vega, Toyota Corolla and VW Beetle.

And what of Mother Jones' Dowie? As the Car Talk blog points out, Dowie now calls the Pinto, "a fabulous vehicle that got great gas mileage," if not for that one flaw: The legendary "$11 part."

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Pinto Racing Doesn't Suck

Back in 1974, Car and Driver magazine created a Pinto for racing, an exercise to prove brains and common sense were more important than an unlimited budget and superstar power. As Patrick Bedard wrote in the March, 1975 issue of Car and Driver, "It's a great car to drive, this Pinto," referring to the racer the magazine prepared for the Goodrich Radial Challenge, an IMSA-sanctioned road racing series for small sedans.

Why'd they pick a Pinto over, say, a BMW 2002 or AMC Gremlin? Current owner of the prepped Pinto, Fox Motorsports says it was a matter of comparing the car's frontal area, weight, piston displacement, handling, wheel width, and horsepower to other cars of the day that would meet the entry criteria. (Racers like Jerry Walsh had by then already been fielding Pintos in IMSA's "Baby Grand" class.)

Bedard, along with Ron Nash and company procured a 30,000-mile 1972 Pinto two-door to transform. In addition to safety, chassis and differential mods, the team traded a 200-pound IMSA weight penalty for the power gain of Ford's 2.3-liter engine, which Bedard said "tipped the scales" in the Pinto's favor. But according to Bedard, it sounds like the real advantage was in the turns, thanks to some add-ons from Mssrs. Koni and Bilstein.

"The Pinto's advantage was cornering ability," Bedard wrote. "I don't think there was another car in the B. F. Goodrich series that was quicker through the turns on a dry track. The steering is light and quick, and the suspension is direct and predictable in a way that street cars never can be. It never darts over bumps, the axle is perfectly controlled and the suspension doesn't bottom."

Need more proof of the Pinto's lack of suck? Check out the SCCA Washington, DC region's spec-Pinto series.

Members
Stats
  • Total Posts: 139,575
  • Total Topics: 16,267
  • Online today: 1,292
  • Online ever: 2,670 (May 09, 2025, 01:57:20 AM)
Users Online
  • Users: 0
  • Guests: 444
  • Total: 444
F&I...more

My Somewhat Begrudging Apology To Ford Pinto

ford-pinto.jpg

I never thought I’d offer an apology to the Ford Pinto, but I guess I owe it one.

I had a Pinto in the 1970s. Actually, my wife bought it a few months before we got married. The car became sort of a wedding dowry. So did the remaining 80% of the outstanding auto loan.

During a relatively brief ownership, the Pinto’s repair costs exceeded the original price of the car. It wasn’t a question of if it would fail, but when. And where. Sometimes, it simply wouldn’t start in the driveway. Other times, it would conk out at a busy intersection.

It ranks as the worst car I ever had. That was back when some auto makers made quality something like Job 100, certainly not Job 1.

Despite my bad Pinto experience, I suppose an apology is in order because of a recent blog I wrote. It centered on Toyota’s sudden-acceleration problems. But in discussing those, I invoked the memory of exploding Pintos, perpetuating an inaccuracy.

The widespread allegation was that, due to a design flaw, Pinto fuel tanks could readily blow up in rear-end collisions, setting the car and its occupants afire.

People started calling the Pinto “the barbecue that seats four.” And the lawsuits spread like wild fire.

Responding to my blog, a Ford (“I would very much prefer to keep my name out of print”) manager contacted me to set the record straight.

He says exploding Pintos were a myth that an investigation debunked nearly 20 years ago. He cites Gary Schwartz’ 1991 Rutgers Law Review paper that cut through the wild claims and examined what really happened.

Schwartz methodically determined the actual number of Pinto rear-end explosion deaths was not in the thousands, as commonly thought, but 27.

In 1975-76, the Pinto averaged 310 fatalities a year. But the similar-size Toyota Corolla averaged 313, the VW Beetle 374 and the Datsun 1200/210 came in at 405.

Yes, there were cases such as a Pinto exploding while parked on the shoulder of the road and hit from behind by a speeding pickup truck. But fiery rear-end collisions comprised only 0.6% of all fatalities back then, and the Pinto had a lower death rate in that category than the average compact or subcompact, Schwartz said after crunching the numbers. Nor was there anything about the Pinto’s rear-end design that made it particularly unsafe.

Not content to portray the Pinto as an incendiary device, ABC’s 20/20 decided to really heat things up in a 1978 broadcast containing “startling new developments.” ABC breathlessly reported that, not just Pintos, but fullsize Fords could blow up if hit from behind.

20/20 thereupon aired a video, shot by UCLA researchers, showing a Ford sedan getting rear-ended and bursting into flames. A couple of problems with that video:

One, it was shot 10 years earlier.

Two, the UCLA researchers had openly said in a published report that they intentionally rigged the vehicle with an explosive.

That’s because the test was to determine how a crash fire affected the car’s interior, not to show how easily Fords became fire balls. They said they had to use an accelerant because crash blazes on their own are so rare. They had tried to induce a vehicle fire in a crash without using an igniter, but failed.

ABC failed to mention any of that when correspondent Sylvia Chase reported on “Ford’s secret rear-end crash tests.”

We could forgive ABC for that botched reporting job. After all, it was 32 years ago. But a few weeks ago, ABC, in another one of its rigged auto exposes, showed video of a Toyota apparently accelerating on its own.

Turns out, the “runaway” vehicle had help from an associate professor. He built a gizmo with an on-off switch to provide acceleration on demand. Well, at least ABC didn’t show the Toyota slamming into a wall and bursting into flames.

In my blog, I also mentioned that Ford’s woes got worse in the 1970s with the supposed uncovering of an internal memo by a Ford attorney who allegedly calculated it would cost less to pay off wrongful-death suits than to redesign the Pinto.

It became known as the “Ford Pinto memo,” a smoking gun. But Schwartz looked into that, too. He reported the memo did not pertain to Pintos or any Ford products. Instead, it had to do with American vehicles in general.

It dealt with rollovers, not rear-end crashes. It did not address tort liability at all, let alone advocate it as a cheaper alternative to a redesign. It put a value to human life because federal regulators themselves did so.

The memo was meant for regulators’ eyes only. But it was off to the races after Mother Jones magazine got a hold of a copy and reported what wasn’t the case.

The exploding-Pinto myth lives on, largely because more Americans watch 20/20 than read the Rutgers Law Review. One wonders what people will recollect in 2040 about Toyota’s sudden accelerations, which more and more look like driver error and, in some cases, driver shams.

So I guess I owe the Pinto an apology. But it’s half-hearted, because my Pinto gave me much grief, even though, as the Ford manager notes, “it was a cheap car, built long ago and lots of things have changed, almost all for the better.”

Here goes: If I said anything that offended you, Pinto, I’m sorry. And thanks for not blowing up on me.

My new station wagon! Suggesstions?

Started by cc_racer, March 20, 2005, 02:04:11 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

imhoppy

  OK kiddys  I just finished taking off the fake wood trim and the decal. I tried every thing ! 16 grit paper clogged up ,3-m remover,goof off,goo gone,oops,aceatone,thinner ALL TYPES,heat gun, Torch "only for a second" Used my sand blaster which makes one hell of a mess! The little hefer didnt like sand all over the yard. FINALLY tried jasco premuim paint remover,It softend up the vinyl then i scraped off the vinyl a little at a time with a putty knife.This left the glue still on the car and i was able to get it off  with 36 grit paper "GO SLOW" the metal will heat up and it "WILL WARP" .Then i hit it with 100 grit then finally, 180 grit. Filled in the holes with my mig before 100 grit sanding .Slapped on some bondo sand again. Used good 2 part glazing putty sand again,Sprayed on urethan filler,primer sand again.Then finally sprayed the stock color.sand color,sprayed clear.   WHEW!


     The moral of the story is try to salvage the trim and replace the vinyl PAIN IN THE BUTT

    P.S This is the reason i got on this website in the first place couldnt figure how to get it off.Now im hooked See ya  Mike

Poison Pinto

CC, Since you plan on repainting it anyway, you could just sandblast the car to strip the paneling and paint together.
I left my Pinto in front of my house last night. This morning there were two more left with it.

77turbopinto

My car is a 77, the engine is from an 86 t/c. I used the upper intake, valve cover, and t/b from a 87/88 t/c because they are lower due to the i/c. I took the engine mount brackets that bolt to the engine, and slotted the holes. Not that simple for some of the holes due to the shape of the brackets. For the big problem one, I used a lug nut. Ground it down to fit, welded it in, and it is a spacer. You will understand when you look at yours. The other holes were covered with washers welded in the new locations and the rest of the old holes filled with weld and ground flush on the engine side. What made this very easy for me was using a spare block to bolt them to while the welding was done. 5/16" is about all you can get out of those with "ease". I guess something could be done with the ones that bolt to the body too. The next step was cutting the "floor" off the tranny mount(the part that the mount sits on), cut 5/16" off, and rewelded it. Yes, it will warp even if it is in a jig. My floor jack and the front diff. on my K10 did the trick. The starter and the rack are the two things that will keep you from going further down. I have a manual rack, they are smaller, so I don't know if there is room for the power one. Yes, you can get the starter in and out. This also brings the exhaust closer to the frame because of it's angle. I flatened the pipe just a little near the flange, no problem. I used an a/c underdash box, so the blower is not an issue. Once all that is done, I removed some meat off the t/b mount flange, & upper intake where they come together, as well as that blob on the top of the intake. This seems to have the engine centered very well, and I have had no problems. The last thing was putting a 45* elbow for the vac., and had to grind that too. I have pics posted in this section in "carbbed turbo" and also in the general talk in "new member here". Seems like alot, but I did alot of figuring before I even started, and it all worked smooth. You can do this, or you can get a cut, and rotated upper (never had one, so I don't know if even they will fit), but the power steering pump can be an issue.

Bill
Thanks to all U.S. Military members past & present.

SVOwagon

How did you get everything to drop 5/16"?   
80 2.3 EFI Turbo Pinto Squire Wagon
91 Mustang LX 5.0 (93 Cobra clone project)
82 Mustang GT (built 460)
89 Mustang LX coupe (built 302)
83 Ranger
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2167062

77turbopinto

Cool car. With very little modifcation you can get the hood to close, I did. Might not work with power steering. I dropped the engine and tranny about 5/16", and did a little grinding to the intake/t.b., fits like a glove.

Bill
Thanks to all U.S. Military members past & present.

SVOwagon

80 2.3 EFI Turbo Pinto Squire Wagon
91 Mustang LX 5.0 (93 Cobra clone project)
82 Mustang GT (built 460)
89 Mustang LX coupe (built 302)
83 Ranger
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2167062

SVOwagon

Well, looks like after I switched my internet, they shut down my site. Here are a couple pics. It has a 2.3l EFI turbo engine from an 88 Thunderbird turbo coupe.
80 2.3 EFI Turbo Pinto Squire Wagon
91 Mustang LX 5.0 (93 Cobra clone project)
82 Mustang GT (built 460)
89 Mustang LX coupe (built 302)
83 Ranger
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2167062

SVOwagon

I like my wood "paneling" look ;D   Then again, I am going for that sleeper look. My car looks 100% stock inside and out, untill you open the hood ::)  Check out my site for more details.
80 2.3 EFI Turbo Pinto Squire Wagon
91 Mustang LX 5.0 (93 Cobra clone project)
82 Mustang GT (built 460)
89 Mustang LX coupe (built 302)
83 Ranger
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2167062

billnall

Welcome CC,
As for the gas gauge check the ohms at the tank unit with a full tank then use about a half tank and check the ohms again if you get the same reading the float could be full of gas, if you get different readings then the sending unit is probable OK. If not you can pull the sending unit out without dropping the tank on a stationwagon, I did it on my SW. The float, sock filter and o'ring are replacable if they are bad. If this is not the problem, let us know and we can tell you the next step to check. As for the woodgrain you may have to sand it off.
part#s for sending unit parts if you need them.
float= COAZ-9202-B, O'RING= COAF-9276-A, if the tube size is 5/16" sock= D1FZ-9A011-A, if tube size is 3/8" sock=
D1AZ-9A011-A, these part numbers are available at the local FORD dealer.
Ford Parts Man
Bill

77turbopinto

I would check the wiring before pulling the sending unit out, could be just a bad connection/ground. I know on my cars, 77/78, the sending unit is on the bottom, won't it come out without dropping the tank?

Be careful with sanding that stuff off, if you heat the metal, it will warp. Same with removing the holes with a welder. If you just scuff th decals, some paint remover should be able to work it's way into it(and thru). Do you have all the trim? If so, have you thought about putting it back on with new woodgrain? That stuff is fairly easy to apply, and if your trim is ok, or just needs to be painted, that might be easier than fixing the holes(correctly).

As far as your mileage, 18 was very good for 1974.

If your car came with a/c, there is not much room for a radio in the stock location.

Bill
Thanks to all U.S. Military members past & present.

losin sux

CC, welcome to the site!  You will need to drop your tank, drain the gas, remove the float assembly and then work that sucker bill.  It is prolly rusted stuck, as was mine.  You will want to look at the screen on the pickup tube as well.  BTW my guage has been working for several months since "exercising" it.
77 HB 2.3 C3 3.40

case_26

Alright i got you for the system, i just installed 2 this weekend and have a pretty good idea for a good one. Id start with a Pioneer deck about 50Wx4 hook that up to two pioneer 400W 6-way 6x9's and some 120W 4-way 6's. try and find a precision competition 4 channel amp (preferably w/ highpass/lowpass filter options) to hook up the compnenets to. and since its a station wagon, id go with 2 600W 12's and at least a 1200W 2 channel amp. then HAVE SOME FUN!

wagonmaster

Hello and welcome to the site!! I'm on of the older "farts" here, being fifty-seven, but I have owned six Pintos over the years and all were wagons. Always did like the wagons better than the sedans/hatchbacks! Three were '77 Cruising Wagons, one '77 Squire, one '79 Panel Delivery, and one '80 Squire. I still own the last three. I've owned the '77 for twelve years. The '80 is my daily driver and is a 4cyl/4spd, but I will be selling this when I have the '77 running again. I am currently building a 2.8L V6 to replace the bad one. I want to get it running again because it is the best driving of all the Pintos I have owned. I will also be attempting to do what you are doing and that is to remove all the Squire trim, fill in the holes, remove the studs, and then repaint with the original color (white). The '79 Panel Delivery is my project vehicle. It will end up being what is called a restomod today. I've collected a lot of NOS parts for it and it will get completely rebuilt from front to back. Good luck with your wagon!! Treated well it will serve you for many years!
Brien - wagonmaster
'85 LTD LX
'85 LTD Squire wagon

cc_racer

I just bought a 74 Pinto Squire Station Wagon and of course I love it.  It only has 87,000 miles on it and seems to run excellently.  My whole family thinks it is hilarious that a 24 year old girl with no kids would love a station wagon so much, but I digress.....

First off, the gas gauge doesn't work.  After two tanks of gas, this is what I have found:  The first tank was all town driving and after doing the math I found out I was getting only 17 mpg!  The second tank was all freeway driving and after doing the math I found out I was getting only 18 mpg!  This is after I replaced the air cleaner, oil, oil filter, fuel filter, spark plugs, wires, distributor cap, rotor and points.  My dad also adjusted my choke and timing.  I will be looking into my float level next.  I am also thinking about installing an electronic ignition unit.  Any advice or suggesstions?

Second, even though I love my wagon, I hate the 'wood' paneling!  After removing all of the trim, which left big holes (they really didn't want you taking that stuff off did they?), I am trying to remove the wood sticker and I having a tough time.  First I tried a blow drier to heat it up, but that only enabled me to peel enough off to really make it look ugly.  I have tried WD-40, goo-gone, professional adheasive remover, and nail polish remover, all to no avail.  Any suggestions?  My goal is to get the paneling off, fill in the holes left by the trim and repaint what I have to the original color, medium brown ginger.  Maybe I should just sand the sticker off and repaint the whole thing? 

Oh yeah, I thought this was pretty funny.  To temporarily cover up the holes and make it look presentable I got big flower stickers, put them on magnents, and cut them out.  They cover up the holes, stay on at 70 + mph and can be removed easily!  lol! 

Anyway, I also plan on puttin in a stereo system (right now only original AM radio!) and tinting all of the back windows.  Everyone tells me that I should keep it all original, but I want to keep this car for the rest of my life, I dont care about resale value, so why shouldn't I personalize it any way I want to? 

As I mentioned before any advice or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.  Also, please tell me about your station wagons and what you have done to spiff them up!  My email is cc_racer@hotmail.com

Thanks!