So here's what I've got. I'm working getting my kit car idling properly. I ordered a holley 5200 for a 1974. Wanting to convert it to an electric choke, I ordered a choke thermostat from a VW place for a weber DFEV.
Now the stupid questions.
1. Should I actually be able to see the thermostat move when power is applied? Because it doesn't. I threw it in the refridgerator to make sure I wasn't crazy, and it moved, which is good. After that, I hooked it up to power, but the coil did not return to its previous positon very quickly.
2. Should the coil get warm to the touch? I was under the impression that, under power, an electric choke would open all the way within 2 minutes, so it would have to get warmer than the surrounding air. It stays pretty cool to the touch.
3. How do I index it? I figured I would just let it heat up and then install it so that the throttle blades were open all the way, and then when it cooled down, it would close them. Obviously that's not working.
4. The curb idle screw is for normal idle speed and the fast idle screw is for when the choke is opening? yes or no.
The coils on the water version and the electric are both wound the same way, so that shouldn't be a problem. The thermostat I have looks exactly like the advance auto parts picture of the electric choke from a 1980. I can't imagine the thermostat coil is bad, it's brand new, but I know how that can be. Thanks for any help.
-James
1. I do not know if you can watch the coil move, but it does not move much, maybe 3/8 of an inch (on the eye hole where the spring connects to the choke cam) when assembled. From my personal experiance, the choke does not cool down quickly at all. If I drive the car from one side a parking lot to the other and turn the car off, then reset the choke with the gas pedal, it doesn't not reset when starting the car again. I usually have to wait 15-25 minutes for it to cool off.
2. I would assume the coil would get warm, at the least. Probably not burning hot because the housing is plastic and it would melt. The housing on my stock choke does not have burn or black marks around the coil at all.
3. I do not let the choke heat up at all. I deal with it cold and when I have to set the choke I assemble it cold, then adjust the throttle blades according to my adjustments sheet.
4. The curb idle should be adjusted when the car is fully warmed up. With the aid of a tachometer or other device to monitor engine speed. I use a Sears engine analyzer from the early 80's that my dad never used after purchasing.
If there's anything I missed, and probably did, Pintony will be more than happy to correct it. ;)
This is actually the exact same one I use to tune my car!
http://southjersey.craigslist.org/pts/578518768.html
Not bad of a price for how amazingly helpful it is!
That coupled with this timing light (which my dad still has and uses)
http://cgi.ebay.com/SEARS-TIMING-LIGHT-MODEL-2159_W0QQitemZ220200685215QQihZ012QQcategoryZ42291QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQ_trksidZp1638.m118.l1247QQcmdZViewItem
and you are set.
Thanks Dave.
Maybe I should clarify #1 a little bit. When I hooked it up to power after putting the choke in the refridgerator, it did not go back to where it was before it was cooled down.
For number 3, do you mean that you rotate the choke to set the throttle blades, or is there some other way of doing it?
For #1 - Metal expands and contracts when heated and cooled, which is how the electric choke works. When it heats to a certain extent, it can expand greatly, to a point where it will not contract back to it's original shape after being cooled. Did you power the spring outside of its housing?
For #3 - Yes, you rotate the choke until the specified throttle blade setting is reached, which is measured using a drill bit. Pulling out my carburetor papers, it says the choke pull down should be set to 1/4" for a Holley 5200 on a 1978 vehicle, however it does not go any further back than 78. The pull down is measured by putting the drill bit between the throttle blade and the inner barrel on the lower end of the blade, then tightening or loosening the choke until the blade is snug against the bit, and the bit is still straight, vertically.
I will do some research and attempt to find the pull down setting for a 74.
Yes, i did, but it didn't move at all.
I'm guessing that it is now permanently stuck in that position and at that size now. I do not see why it would effect the performance of the choke though. It would still expand and contact, even if it's spring arch is slightly larger now. What really matters is the pull down setting.
Why would it be stuck at any size?
As far as I can tell, It hasn't moved while under power, wheter it was on the carb or off. It would have had to have moved in the first place in order to get stuck there.
I have a Chilton's Pinto manual that says to check the pulldown with a 15/64 in. drill bit. I'll try that, but I still think the electric choke should be able to pull itself open if the car isn't running. Which it isn't by the way. I have yet to get it to run for more than 2 minutes.
Hello jimdaug,
Mount the choke as it is supposed to be on the carb leaving the 3 screws loose so you can rotate the housing.
Holding the throttle wide open rotate the choke housing back and fourth. The choke plate should move.
rotate the housing untill the choke plate just closes and snug the 3 screws.
Apply power to the unit make sure you have a good ground wire located on the carb. Remember that the engine is mounted in rubber mounts and the carb is mounted on a fiber gasket. Make the grounding process easy of the system to work.
Hold the throttle wide open again just after applying power. The choke plate should move.
It will not move if the throttle is not held wide open as the stepped tab is pushing against the adjusting screw.
From Pintony
Here is how to find a nice PDF file for instructions to the electric choke.
Click here!! And type 45-223 in the search box
http://www.holley.com/TechService/Instructions.asp
From Pintony
Pintony comes to the rescue again! :D
Quote from: dave1987 on February 29, 2008, 01:39:25 PM
Pintony comes to the rescue again! :D
Thanks Dave,
Yes and I still only got 52 feedback....
Feeling darned un-appreciated right now...
From Pintony
Thanks Pintony. That makes sense about the tab pushing against the adjusting screw. It seems to be grounded ok, but another wire won't hurt. I'll give all of that a try and see what happens. Thanks again.
PS. I'll bump your feed back if someone can tell me where to do it.
EDIT:*********
OK, so the pull down was out of adjustment, I fixed that. I hooked my little jump box up so that the carb was grounded to it, and ran a jumper from the + cable to the choke. It had good ground and power and still didn't move. I guess I'm going to have to try getting a new one tomorrow and see if that works :(.
Sounds like a good idea. Keep us updated.
Autozone didn't have any in stock, so I decided to order the Holley 45-258, which is the replacement thermostat for the holley 45-223 conversion kit. Is there any reason that this one won't work?
Also, I should mention that I haven't been hooking up the ceramic heater, becase the one on the new carb has a little raised plasitc part (to ground out at a certain temperature I think) that was interfering with the choke lever and causing it to drag. So I put the one from the old carb in as a spacer, but it doesn't show a ground when I test it with my test light. How much does that heater do, I'm under the impression it only helps open the choke faster?
OK, so time for an update I think. The Holley 45-28 didn't fit. Too big.
If you didn't know, the weather in Texas has been hot and cold, so it's perfect for figuring out whether my choke is working. I got the original choke to work by making some room on the ceramic heater with a dremel.
However, it's not working exactly like I expected. If I understand what I've researched so far, the choke is supposed to snap the choke plates shut when it's cold and you tap the throttle. In order for that to happen, I have to turn the choke housing pretty far counter clockwise and it doesn't seem to open fully when the car gets warm.
I have more questions if you guys aren't tired of me yet.
How much resistance should the fast idle cam be putting against the choke? I can move it easily with my finger, but the choke seems to not have enough oomph to kick it to high idle unless I really crank it over.
At what temperature should the choke be fully closing? On a warmish 60ยบ F day, It probably doesn't need to close completly, right?