Hey all
I luckily so stumbled upon a yellow 72 pinto runabout about 2 hours away from me here in Canada. I wasn't able to talk to the owner but his coworker gave me his number. This car has NO RUST that I CAN SEE, the interior is mint with only minor tears. and apparently it is a CALIFORNIA CAR! the body is nice and straight and no rust that I could see! underneath looked beautiful as well. Now my questions! the coworker of the owner of this car told me he wants about 2500-3000 dollars canadian for it which I think is an insane deal although I will try to talk him down. The car drives and also has AIR CONDITIONING! so I will probably be driving it back
Now my questions, before I call the guy tonight I want to know if a 72 will be able to get a V8 in it without hassle as I know that V8 swaps are easier in 74 and up but I have seen many V8 71's so I am asuming it can be done. As said before the engine will probably either be a 302 or 351 with a C4. Where do you guys suiggest I go about finding these parts (specifically the 351 and C4 AND IS THERE ANY OTHER TRANNIES THAT WOULD BE A BETTER BET that would fit AS EASY AS A C4?) I also need to get a nice ford 9 inch for the rear end.
My main concern is will the V8 fit?
Here is the VIN number..
Maybe one of you guys could help me decode to let me know if indeed it is really is a california car.
the number is ?2RIIX2I4952?
(those question marks are because it looks like the front and back number have been scraped off but maybe I am just paranoid but the first number that i believe was scraped looks to be a 3 or a 9) I also do not know if those are I's or 1's but I would think they are I's.
Anyways any help as soon as possible would be greatly appreciated! I also saw two mustang II's on my trip that I may be able to use for parts!
Thanks guys!
Andrew
Thank you Pintony!
I actually just found out the VIN myself but I appreciate the help.
As for looking for a pinto with a V8 in it, I would rather have the fun putting it in myself because I want to get the experience and I am a gearhead. This will be my first project with my father's help (he's a veryyy experienced mechanic) and I would enjoy putting in a V8 myself rather than getting one already in.
But in regards to pre 74 pintos what makes the V8 swap so difficult in these cars? can it not be done? I have seen so many pintos especially 71's with V8's but I can't seem to understand what makes it so hard? is it header clearance? or what? I am probably going to fab up my own exhaust anyhow so can anyone explain what makes a pre 74 so hard for the swap?
Thanks!
I have seen people install "sub frame connectors". Would these be a good idea to put in to add some stability to the car?
What about AOD tranny's, are these harder to fit than C4's? and are the C4's that fit the swap only ones out of MII cobras or just regular MII's?
I have been looking at 71 pinto racers stuff and he seemed to have a smooth swap on his car. Although he doesn't mention much about cutting fenders or anything to fit headers although I know he did a minor mod to the firewall to fit the tranny. Are those special headers he used still available?
Thanks!
The 71 V8 swap can be done, but as Pintony said, not as easily as the 74 up cars. I modified the firewall to get the engine back 2" so it would fit and used a short water pump. The headers are made by hooker, I got mine on e-bay but they are rare. Summit still sells them but they are $450.00. I did not have to cut my inner fenders however some of the headers are made to go out of the side instead of under the car like mine and require that they be cut out. I'm not sure what type Summit sells. I made everything to put the V8 in my car, the MII mounts are hard to find and pricey. Personaly I like the mounts in my car, it frees up all the room back in the engine bay, the starter can be removed and the headers can be taken out without a problem. The AOD is a big trans and won't fit without a lot of firewall mods. Stick with the C4 or have more fun and go with a T5 like I did! As far as ride and handling, My car has a stock '89 5.0 HO and it rides and drives and idles nice and smooth. It will not however out handle a 4cyl. I'm very pleased with the V8, the 4cyl I had was too wild for the street, the V8 made the car a driver again with gobs of horsepower. I can cruise and put-put around in 4th and 5th gear, the cam was so wild in the 4cyl that I was always putting it in neutral or downshifting. I plan to put subframe connectors on in the near future, any V8 Pinto needs them. So to answer your question, yes, you can put a V8 in the early Pinto with great success, it is just easier to do in the 74 &up.
Thank you veryyy veryyy much 71pintoracer!
Your thread on your build has been very inspirational to me as I know I can this swap with some time and effort and ahem...money! haha
The T5 tranny, how is that workin for ya?
And please tell me really how bad is the handling on a V8 pinto? For me this car would be for going straight and not weaving traffic. For reference I drive a Ford F550 flatbed every day and 95 ford escort or 91 Sierra.
Also is your car tubbed at all? I was planning on hopefully fitting a 10-12 inch tire but I wonder if it would require backhalving or would the frame of the car allow a wide enough tub?
Thanks for your help guys, please keep the responses coming!
Unfortunatley this guy's house is busy when I call so no direct quotes yet...I am gonna try to talk him to 1500-2000 if I can by pretty much cutting up the car and telling him how crappy he is! (its gonna be hard) but I hope he ain't a Pinto guy otherwise I am screwed if I do that! ;D
Glad the thread helped! Do you mind if I ask why you want to use the early body for your swap? I have to admit if I were looking for a car I would go for a 74 up, and not a driver. I would pick up a decent body and go from there. I like the early cars small bumpers though, I would swap them. Other than that they look the same on the outside. What I'm saying is if I were going to pay two grand for a nice stock driver I probably wouln't drop a V8 in it and backhalf and tub it. I would pick up a body and go that route.
The T5 is working great, I love grabbin' the gears! The only thing I had to do was move the clutch cable to the outer side of the steering shaft for clearance, it was too close to the header. I made a simple bracket to move the mounting at the bellhousing over about one inch. (Forgot to post that on my thread) Also had to shorten the driveshaft.
My car is not tubbed or backhalved and at this point I don't intend to do either. 8" tires are about all you can get under the fenders. I have 10" M&H racemasters (13" dia.) that I use for racing and even with custom backspacing they stick out past the fenders.
There is no frame on the back of the car so it can be tubbed very easily, however it is a must to weld in some sort of frame work to help stiffen the chassis when the wheel tubs are removed.
As far as handling, you are adding a few hundred (?) pounds to a nose heavy car. A lowered 4 cyl car with wide sticky tires handles good. The same car with a V8-not as good. If you want a road racer you probably don't want a V8. As far as normal driving, I don't see a bit of problem. I don't know who Pintony rode with but my car drives and handles fine, and I don't have a bit of problem as far as a "heavy feel" in the steering. Yes, it is different than the 4cyl, but by no means "unrefined" or a pain to drive. If that is going to be a big concern then use the 74 up car and you can have power steering. I don't see a need for it at all in my car.
I have owned, driven and raced Pintos since they first came out in 1971. At one time I owned 15. I'm now down to 4. This is my second V8 car and I have to say I am very very pleased with the way it turned out, and in no way sorry I did it. ;D
So tubbing the car would require me to weld frame supports? would that not be considered backhalving?
And if I tub it without backhalving whats the biggest tire I can tuck under there?
Oh and BTW guys this thing already has a 8.8 rear end with 4:10 gears and posi, and a whole bunch of other stuff I won't mention yet, which is why I want this car... ;D
oh ya...all for 2 grand or maybe less :o
would the 8.8 rear handle the power of the 302?
Thanks guys!
:wow: ??? OK I'm confused. Somehow i thought this was a stock '72 we were talking about. if it has a 8.8 it has some major mods already. 8.8 is a coil spring rear.
sorry man, but I never found out till after I posted that.
This car has some serious stuff done to it already!
c4 tranny
8.8 rear out of a 88 mustang i think with posi and 4:10 gears
He has a fully rebuilt 302 he may be selling me as well.
No rips in the interior
This was truly a gem I found!
SO my questions...
will the 8.8 handle a 302, yes according to the previous post it will!
Will the C4 that he has in the car bolted up to the 2.0L bolt up to a 302? or will I have to get another C4 or mod it for some fittage?
And tubs! That is what I am worried about, I want to fit at least a 10-12 inch wide and 27-29 inch high tire without having to backhalve the car ( so just cutting the wells so that they are flush with the frame rail and tubbing them)
Sorry guys that I have misinformed you, I just didn't want someone else to find the car and go for it before I did as my brother did that on his mopar forum and some dude pulled that stunt on a potential 67 cuda he was going to get.
But yes this car is pretty much sold on me! I am going to go look at it with my pops and hopefully from there I am gonna drop the cash.
So 71PintoRacer if you could please answer my tub question I would greatlyyy appreciate since you know what your talking about when it comes to racing pintos.
once again thanks to all for your help!!! :afro:
OK! Now we're back on track! ;D The 8.8 is a very good rear and will stand up to a pretty nasty 302. I think that there has to be some major frame work going on already to swap in a coil spring rear. Back halving a car to me means cutting out the entire rear section of a vehicle and installing a race prepped rear frame. I am interested to see what is there now. The rear wheel tubs are an important part of the rear structure of these cars, if you remove them you need to brace the car somehow. On my dirt track cars I made a framework from 2X2 square tubing. (Poor mans backhalving? I dunno). I don't blame you for keeping the car a secret, when you get it lets see whats what and go from there.
The 8.8 rear can be easily modded to use with leaf springs. All that has to be done is to cut the coil mounts off and weld on some leaf spring perches at the proper location, depending on the car. It is starting to become more common in the vintage Mustang community to do this. Especially when you have one that already has disk brakes on it. It isn't exactly a bolt in, but if the person can weld it isn't difficult.
Just wanting to clear up any confusion. :lol:
Russ
Thanks so much guys!
So leafs are better than coils for drag racing?
Well I am going to call the guy again tonight and get some more info on it and report back to you guys!
Thanks for all the help so far guys I greatly appreciate it! It's great to find some people who actually like these cars! thank god for the internet ;D
Ok well I got some more info but my main concern is TUBBING right now as everything else looks good!
The car only has some little rust under one of the top hatches, otherwise none. He has stock pinto discs up front which I can't seem to find specs for size or bolt pattern on, and the stock drums from the 88 mustang in the rear he got them out of and I also cannot find the bolt pattern of these.
The 302 he took out of a 87 mercury cougar and was initially fuel injected. Ford rebuilt it, he then bought it off them for 200 bucks (he worked for ford) and sent out the heads to get machined and cleaned up and it is also bored 20 over. He is also wiling to sell me a edelbrock high rise intake and a holley 850 cfm carb. What I wan't to know is if this fuel injected engine will bolt up to a carbeurated top end (will the bolt pattern match up?)
He also said he will throw in free brand new mustang II mounts for the swap that he got from ford racing but I think I have heard you guys saying that those won't actually fit the swap. He also said he will throw in the headers from the cougar and said that the hard curve on them may actually be able to fit the pinto (but I doubt it).
As for tubbing. I want to know HOW WIDE OF A TIRE I CAN FIT UNDERNEATH THIS THING WITH JUST TUBBING! I AM NOT TALKING TREADWIDTH I AM TALKING SECTION WIDTH THE WIDEST PART OF THE TIRE!
As far as backhalving, my father said he won't help me do that so I really wanna know what meat I can stuff under this thing just by tubbing it!
For a rad I think I am gonna look for a datsun 280 one like I saw in one thread.
If I want this thing to have a nice low stance what springs should I be looking for front and for rear?
And last but not least, are these V8 swap headers still being made by anyone at all? because I really don't want to do the flipped mustang II shorty trick
Any help would be appreciated guys as I can always count on you all!
Quote from: pintobassdude on July 30, 2008, 05:13:14 AM
Thanks so much guys!
So leafs are better than coils for drag racing?
I didn't say that. All I was saying was that just because it has an 8.8 rear doesn't mean the car was converted to coil suspension.
If drag racing is your main concern, there are other suspension options that are better than either leaf or coil.
As far as tubbing is concerned, if all you do is cut off the stock wheel wells and install tubs, all you are doing is probably giving yourself some room for taller tires, not necessarily wider. Odds are you will need to do some major work on the rear "frame" to get anything really wide. Part of the problem is where the leaf springs are. Adding tubs won't do anything to move the springs, and you will likely hit the springs before the wheel wells.
Note that all of this is based on general experience, and not Pinto specific, but some stuff to think about.
Russ
Right you are Russ, and the 8.8 is a popular rear and most likely that is what was done. (converted to leaf springs) All this talk about backhalving got me ahead of myself!! :lost:
To answer your other questions, the carb'ed intake will bolt up, that is what is in my car, my engine came from an '89 mustang. I think the 850 is too much for the engine you are getting. I used a 600.
The MII mounts are what you need for the swap but I think you need two left side mounts?? Or maybe move the left frame mount?? Not sure on that, you can search the archives.
As far as tubbing, Russ is correct on that as well. As I said before, my 10' slicks stick out past the fenders and I had the backspacing set up to get as close to the leaf springs as possible.
I made lowering blocks for the rear and cut the coils to get the stance I wanted.
As I said before, Summit sells the swap headers but they are expensive. I have seen them on e-bay a few times, mine were new and I got them for $160.00.
OK Cool guys,
So if I move in my leaf springs I should be able to fit in a bit of a fatter tire? My brother who just tubbed his car also has to move the springs in as well to accomodate his new tire size.
So if I move the springs in hopefully I will have some room to play with.
Yesterday at a show I was talking to two guys who told me they know a guy with a pinto that runs 8's and he has full tub and has huge tires but he didn't do a backhalf. I find it hard to believe though since these guys don't really seem to know anything about their cars at all.
But anyways I hopefully want to go up and look at this thing soon
Thanks guys
Hey there pintobassdude!
That guy who owns that 72 pinto is my grandpa! I live in the same town and everything!
What are the chances of that!!!
My grandpa mentioned to me that somebody had called about the Pinto. And that happened to be you! That's cool!
Nice meeting you! :coolrasta:
HAHA!
hey man
Ya he told me his grandson is bored of Pinto's lol
Nice to meet you too!
Anyone able to help me with the tubbing info? I want to do a mini tub (no backhalfing, just spring relocation and tubbing to the existing frame.
If anyone has a stock 72 pinto and you got some free time on your hands maybe you could go outside and measure from the inner lip of your rear wheel well all the way to the frame and give me an idea of what tire I could fit under there with a tub job!
I also got some questions about the stock C4 tranny. What torque converter does it come with? and will this tranny bolt up to the 5.0L? What about torque converter swaps, I was thinking about putting in a 3500 stall converter but I don't know if it will fit...
Thanks all! :tgif:
A nice size like a 295 60R15
lowest would be a 275 though. I will probably have to tub for that though. Although 71Pintoracer said it is easy to tub these cars
Quote from: 71pintoracer on July 29, 2008, 09:23:12 PM
OK! Now we're back on track! ;D The 8.8 is a very good rear and will stand up to a pretty nasty 302. I think that there has to be some major frame work going on already to swap in a coil spring rear. Back halving a car to me means cutting out the entire rear section of a vehicle and installing a race prepped rear frame. I am interested to see what is there now. The rear wheel tubs are an important part of the rear structure of these cars, if you remove them you need to brace the car somehow. On my dirt track cars I made a framework from 2X2 square tubing. (Poor mans backhalving? I dunno). I don't blame you for keeping the car a secret, when you get it lets see whats what and go from there.
Quote from: 71pintoracer on July 28, 2008, 08:51:34 PM
My car is not tubbed or backhalved and at this point I don't intend to do either. 8" tires are about all you can get under the fenders. I have 10" M&H racemasters (13" dia.) that I use for racing and even with custom backspacing they stick out past the fenders.
There is no frame on the back of the car so it can be tubbed very easily, however it is a must to weld in some sort of frame work to help stiffen the chassis when the wheel tubs are removed.
So I dunno if he means backhalving or tubbing :embarrassed:
Quote from: bigbellybob on August 01, 2008, 02:16:40 PM
my dad runs a 275 60 r15 under the rear of his 71 with no body mods
Does he have room to go wider?
Quote from: pintobassdude on August 01, 2008, 02:41:39 PM
Does he have room to go wider?
i don't think so. he runs slicks at the track. the slicks are definitely the biggest ones that will fit. almost touch inside and out side. i will get the size tonight and post back
Do they tuck under the fenders? or do they stick out like that rat rod look?
Ask him if he backhalved as well or if he just tubbed it!
Thanks man!
Quote from: pintobassdude on August 01, 2008, 10:23:46 AM
Anyone able to help me with the tubbing info? I want to do a mini tub (no backhalfing, just spring relocation and tubbing to the existing frame.
If anyone has a stock 72 pinto and you got some free time on your hands maybe you could go outside and measure from the inner lip of your rear wheel well all the way to the frame and give me an idea of what tire I could fit under there with a tub job!
I also got some questions about the stock C4 tranny. What torque converter does it come with? and will this tranny bolt up to the 5.0L? What about torque converter swaps, I was thinking about putting in a 3500 stall converter but I don't know if it will fit...
Thanks all! :tgif:
Anyone? and for the tubbing I am going for the tucked tire look
Bigbellybob!
Thank you so much for those pictures man! I really appreciate it!
Now one more question.. did he tub the car? did he tub it and move the springs in? or is that the stock wheel wells?
Thanks bro I REALLY APPRECIATE IT!!! :-*(haha!)
stock wheel wells
Thank you bigbe
Anyone else if you guys could answer my previous C4 questions?
Thanks!