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Offline caravan3921

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Barrett-Jackson auto auction question
« on: October 23, 2020, 12:31:31 PM »
Does anyone in Pinto community know what the mint Pinto hatchbacks typically go for at Barrette-Jackson auctions? For the sold cars, it states you have to register to view price. Why are sold prices guarded secrets? For example, I saw a gorgeous '74 Ford Pinto Hatchback, 24,000 miles, one owner, Grabber Blue in color. It sold at the Scottsdale 2019 auction. It would be interesting to know what its sold price was. Anybody know anything?
(On a side note, we're now settled in AZ and our ''78 blue baby is running great. Had to put a bit of extra steering fluid in her a couple days ago. It's so nice to finally see an AZ license plate on her.)

Offline Wittsend

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Re: Barrett-Jackson auto auction question
« Reply #1 on: October 24, 2020, 11:30:31 AM »
Can't answer that but it is odd that the auction is broadcasted, the price public at that time, but you have to register to see the price later. They likely want you registered as that become a multi-pointed advantage to them.

Offline caravan3921

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Re: Barrett-Jackson auto auction question
« Reply #2 on: October 28, 2020, 08:07:27 AM »
Found a 2007 article on the internet, and a '76 all stock and original with 7,000 miles sold for $12,650, plus auction fees. The article stated that this was one of the most talked about cars of the entire auction weekend.

Offline Wittsend

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Re: Barrett-Jackson auto auction question
« Reply #3 on: October 28, 2020, 12:50:44 PM »
Wow, that was 13 years ago.  Unfortunately for those of us in California any car 1976 (like the Pinto mentioned) and newer has to be bi-annually smog checked. So for us the desired cars are 1975 and older.  And our smog check requires a visual inspection for ALL smog equipment aspects (many parts likely no longer available) not just does the car sniff out clean enough.

Frankly I'm not getting the price older cars sell for regardless of condition. $200 parts cars are now $2,000-$4,000. A decent car that was previously $4,000 now sells for $10,000-$14,000. I'm not getting that there is such a demand so it baffles me. Maybe sellers who believe there is ONE GUY who just HAS TO HAVE the car and will sit and wait for him at a highly inflated price. I know when you are the seller this all seems good but the next time you go to buy..., not so much.

Offline dga57

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Re: Barrett-Jackson auto auction question
« Reply #4 on: October 29, 2020, 04:42:13 PM »
Transactions like the one you describe at Barrett-Jackson are, unfortunately, part of the problem.  People watch those auctions on television and start to believe their cars are worth the same amount of money.  That is almost never the case.  The cars sold through Barrett-Jackson, and featured on their television auctions, are the absolute cream of the crop; true museum quality cars.  They are essentially perfect, ridiculously low mileage, and meticulously documented; something 99.9% of us can't claim, but it doesn't stop the armchair observer from dreaming his "project car" is in the same category.


Dwayne :)
Pinto Car Club of America - Serving the Ford Pinto enthusiast since 1999.

Offline Wittsend

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Re: Barrett-Jackson auto auction question
« Reply #5 on: November 05, 2020, 11:15:26 AM »
Recently we had a poster ask about car values. It was a tough call to even guess because the gulf between what is being asked and what a (typical) buyer is willing to pay seems quite large. I am utterly amazed at the local Craigslist cars that seemingly are there for YEARS. In those cases the seller seems to prefer a yard ornament with significant patina rather than actually selling the vehicle for any more that an extremely inflated price.

If my years shopping at Pick Your Part have any relevance I've seen some these overpriced cars that stay on CL for years show up in the yard where I know they didn't get more that $175 for it. Sad all the way around.  The guy never got his money, the car got scrapped and the only good that came is a few people got parts.

Offline mikerich1972

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Re: Barrett-Jackson auto auction question
« Reply #6 on: December 19, 2020, 06:25:34 PM »
Yeah, I was at BJ in 2019 and watched the  Pinto sell. It sold for $16,500.


I checked the car prior to the sale...under the hood was not all stock, the pedals looked to have a bit more wear than 24K, and the paint was not original. Other than that, it seemed to be a solid car.


Email me if you want a couple pics of it prior to the sale.
1976 Pinto Wagon 2.3L
1972 Harley Davidson FLH 1200
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Offline Henrius

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Re: Barrett-Jackson auto auction question
« Reply #7 on: December 22, 2020, 08:49:18 PM »
Unfortunately for those of us in California any car 1976 (like the Pinto mentioned) and newer has to be bi-annually smog checked. So for us the desired cars are 1975 and older.  And our smog check requires a visual inspection for ALL smog equipment aspects (many parts likely no longer available) not just does the car sniff out clean enough.

Frankly I'm not getting the price older cars sell for regardless of condition. $200 parts cars are now $2,000-$4,000. A decent car that was previously $4,000 now sells for $10,000-$14,000. I'm not getting that there is such a demand so it baffles me. Maybe sellers who believe there is ONE GUY who just HAS TO HAVE the car and will sit and wait for him at a highly inflated price. I know when you are the seller this all seems good but the next time you go to buy..., not so much.
[/quote]

Thanks for giving us normal people yet another reason not ponder moving to Commiefornia.

The increase in old car prices is no mystery. 30 billion $ of new currency is being injected into the economy every week. The first thing that is inflated is asset prices- stocks, real estate, gold, and of course old car prices. It has got to happen macro economically. You ain't seen nothing yet- just wait until 2021 for inflation to hit consumer goods.

On a positive note, your old cars will be a good inflation hedge.
1973 Pinto Runabout with upgraded 2.0 liter & 4 speed, and factory sunroof. My first car, now restored, and better than it was when it rolled off the assembly line!

Offline mikerich1972

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Re: Barrett-Jackson auto auction question
« Reply #8 on: December 23, 2020, 10:49:13 PM »
I have 3 from the early 70's here.. and they all run like new. :)

1976 Pinto Wagon 2.3L
1972 Harley Davidson FLH 1200
1972 Pontiac Firebird 350/350
2003 Dodge Durango

Offline Henrius

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Re: Barrett-Jackson auto auction question
« Reply #9 on: December 24, 2020, 08:22:28 AM »

Frankly I'm not getting the price older cars sell for regardless of condition. $200 parts cars are now $2,000-$4,000. A decent car that was previously $4,000 now sells for $10,000-$14,000. I'm not getting that there is such a demand so it baffles me. Maybe sellers who believe there is ONE GUY who just HAS TO HAVE the car and will sit and wait for him at a highly inflated price. I know when you are the seller this all seems good but the next time you go to buy..., not so much.

Do many really sell for asking price, though? Or even close to it?

I did a used Pinto search and came up with a few from AutoTrader and Hemmings. The asking prices were from $4000 for a real beater to $14,000. But the cars stay up for sale forever.

There was an outfit called Pinto Barn in Southern California that restored old Pintos to sell. Their final Facebook post before closing was bitter. They spent a good deal of time and money restoring these cars they loved, and complained that nobody wanted to pay more than $3000 for them.

BarnFinds says NADA values a perfect 1972 Wagon at $15,000. But try to get that. It is a thin market out there for collectable Pintos.
1973 Pinto Runabout with upgraded 2.0 liter & 4 speed, and factory sunroof. My first car, now restored, and better than it was when it rolled off the assembly line!

Offline HOSS429

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Re: Barrett-Jackson auto auction question
« Reply #10 on: December 24, 2020, 02:16:05 PM »
 i got rid of my pinto for a few months earlier this and the fellow i sold it to thought he could quickly triple his money  .. he wanted 3 grand for it but got no takers .. i got it back for less than i sold it to him after he broke the rear end .. its` still a 1 thousand car all day long .. 

Offline Henrius

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Re: Barrett-Jackson auto auction question
« Reply #11 on: December 24, 2020, 03:44:13 PM »
i got rid of my pinto for a few months earlier this and the fellow i sold it to thought he could quickly triple his money  .. he wanted 3 grand for it but got no takers .. i got it back for less than i sold it to him after he broke the rear end .. its` still a 1 thousand car all day long .. 

Doesn't really make sense, does it? I had to spend $4000 on an old Corolla for my daughter's first car. Nothing special- it had 100,000 miles on it.  But they won't pay near that for a Pinto. I guess they know old 4-bangers are less reliable than Jap compacts, and getting it serviced would be difficult these days. A/C is now a must, and few Pintos ever had A/C. If they did, it sucked power and did not work for long.

It is also a big step back for many people to go back to a carbaurated car. I will admit, fuel injection makes a world of improvement in daily driving.

Bottom line is people want classic cars that have snob appeal, like Chevelles and Chargers and Mustangs. Pintos never had street cred, and sure don't have it now.

I probably spent $20,000 in restoration and engine hop-up and don't have any illusions about ever being able to get the invested money out. Who cares, it is like reliving my youth in college driving the original car.
1973 Pinto Runabout with upgraded 2.0 liter & 4 speed, and factory sunroof. My first car, now restored, and better than it was when it rolled off the assembly line!

Offline Wittsend

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Re: Barrett-Jackson auto auction question
« Reply #12 on: December 24, 2020, 03:55:14 PM »
It is a very rare thing for me to not get an item below asking price. Bargaining is part of the "hobby" for me. BUT..., if an item has a reasonable price of $50 (I'm taking used, Swapmeet/Craigslist car part here) I'll offer $40, not $10. Then depending on the condition or need adjust accordingly. But if that same item has an asking price of $100 I will just walk past and not even offer. Far too many people are hoping for that one na´ve or stupid person to pay far too much. And in most cases they will WAIT..., and Wait..., and wait and they will never sell the item, thus they become the na´ve or stupid one.


 If someone has a reasonable price, I'll make a reasonable offer. More often than not, I the buyer and the other party, the seller, feel we are operating in a reasonable realm of reality and work out something agreeable. Otherwise, I won't even bother to make an offer when the initial price is ridiculous. I don't like dealing with absurdity.


Example, I go to a bi-annual Mopar car show every year. I was looking for an Edelbrock intake. I have seen asking prices everywhere between $125 and $50 (very few). $75 being a fair average. One day this kid had one. It had been painted Mopar blue and probably to him a detriment over the performance look of raw aluminum. I asked how much and he said, "$30." I broke the sound barrier getting my wallet out. OK, I get it that was a great deal. And I only cared about the performance of the manifold, not the color. As it was I saw the paint as "stealthy" (as in "just let them THINK this engine is stock"). But with the bottom of the market being  $30, a average good deal being $50 and typical reasonable price being $75 what do people think they are going to accomplish by asking $125???


Since there are no four door Pinto's I'll use the Falcon/Maverick as an example (here in referred to as F/M). It use to be a not too far thrashed two door F/M could be had for say, $2,000. A very decent one was $4,000 and a really nice one was $6,000. Today, somehow people thing a four door F/M with no title, broken glass, severe rust, a frozen drivetrain (or altogether missing) is worth $6,000. I mean no one is going to invest BIG in restoring a four door car. So, in essence it is the few body parts (often rusted) that provide any value but it sure isn't $6,000 worth.


So, I think the guy who wants a reasonable F/M will pass on the four door, especially at the asking price, and just concede he is priced out of the market. Now it might be he would be content with the four door at $1,000-$2,000 but that ain't happening. So, the sellers car just sits and rusts because he has a distorted idea of value and the buyer doesn't even get to "sort of" have the grandpa version of his desired car. Bummer all the way around.

Offline dga57

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Re: Barrett-Jackson auto auction question
« Reply #13 on: December 24, 2020, 04:07:30 PM »
.

I probably spent $20,000 in restoration and engine hop-up and don't have any illusions about ever being able to get the invested money out. Who cares, it is like reliving my youth in college driving the original car.


My sentiments exactly!  I've never considered any of the Pintos I've owned to be an investment; they're an indulgence.  I will say however, as much as people don't really want to buy them, they do attract attention.  I've owned BMWs, Jaguars, and a slew of Cadillacs and Lincolns over the years and the ONLY car that has ever rivaled my Pintos for attention anywhere I go is my Rolls-Royce.  It's a different type of attention though.  With the Rolls, it's questions about an unfamiliar vehicle that most have never aspired to own and admiration for their expert craftsmanship.  With the Pintos, everybody has a Pinto memory and a story!

Dwayne :)
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Offline Henrius

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Re: Barrett-Jackson auto auction question
« Reply #14 on: December 24, 2020, 09:08:10 PM »

My sentiments exactly!  I've never considered any of the Pintos I've owned to be an investment; they're an indulgence.  I will say however, as much as people don't really want to buy them, they do attract attention.  I've owned BMWs, Jaguars, and a slew of Cadillacs and Lincolns over the years and the ONLY car that has ever rivaled my Pintos for attention anywhere I go is my Rolls-Royce.  It's a different type of attention though.  With the Rolls, it's questions about an unfamiliar vehicle that most have never aspired to own and admiration for their expert craftsmanship.  With the Pintos, everybody has a Pinto memory and a story!

Dwayne :)

You are right about that. I could write a book out of all the Pinto stories people have related at car meets.

Pintos are a novelty, although most people would not want to buy one. It would bring them no prestige, unlike your Rolls Royce. But it allows people to recall their past- usually their youth. I kissed a girl for the first time in my Pinto. (In the front seat!)

What a surprise you say Falcons and Mavericks are in demand. You told me something I did not know- two-doors are much more collectable than four.

Saw a 4-door 1970 Dodge Dart in mint condition not too long back. No A/C. With the slant six that is about as reliable, practical,  and economical as you can go for a vintage daily driver. Might have bought it, but they wanted $14,000. Anything that gets into the hands of those antique car resellers is overpriced.

Really, 1960s cars interest me more than 1970s cars. American build quality took a nose dive in the 1970s. I can't get over how many manufacturing mistakes I found in my 1973 Runabout. However, one thing 1970s cars have going for them is safety. Those low back seats and no shoulder harnesses in the 1960s put people in jeopardy in collisions.

For these reasons and many more, I am not optimistic about Pintos ever being collectors' items that demand high prices, no matter how rare they eventually get.
1973 Pinto Runabout with upgraded 2.0 liter & 4 speed, and factory sunroof. My first car, now restored, and better than it was when it rolled off the assembly line!

Offline mikerich1972

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Re: Barrett-Jackson auto auction question
« Reply #15 on: December 27, 2020, 02:54:28 PM »
We have a 1972 Firebird in pristine original condition that we show locally. In 2018, the radiator decided to give me fits, and needed to be replaced, so I cruised the Pinto in the Friday evening cruise. What a HUGE reaction we got from the old Pinto running around with the "big bucks boys"!! Nothing makes me smile more than cruising or parking next to a six-figure car.


We heard a LOT of comments about the good old days, growing up poor in a Pinto, etc.... Well, I drive this car daily and basically cruised it because I had paid an entry fee and wasn't about to completely forfeit the bucks. Needless to say, the car was a total hit with most people, although I sure didn't enter it into the show the next day (It's not up to show quality at all, this is a daily driver!!).


Just a couple days ago, we came out of a store to find a guy looking it over pretty thoroughly, he asked is it was okay that he took pictures to send to his son... ;D . What could I say? It was already done anyway, but this proves that most people remember the "little car that could", in spite of Nader's efforts. Even though most remember it from the "exploding gas tank" episodes although that was overblown and wrong, in the case of the wagons.


And yes, I do tell everyone that asks about the car that it's got almost 377,000 ORIGINAL miles, and still runs well! Japan's best can, in my opinion, take a flying leap back to Tokyo's shores. Of course, I built a spare 2.3L in 2003 while I could still get parts (a decent head!), then my wife quickly adds that I'm the only mechanic allowed to touch it. (TRUE!!! ::) [size=78%]) [/size]
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1976 Pinto Wagon 2.3L
1972 Harley Davidson FLH 1200
1972 Pontiac Firebird 350/350
2003 Dodge Durango