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Offline ToniJ1960

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valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« on: January 06, 2015, 04:52:25 PM »
 We used a fel pro vs50126c calve cover gasket. did not hammer down the bolt hole from underneath and used no rtv on the gasket either side.

 Its leaking in front at the corner,running like a tiny stream and smoking real bad. A few drops on the ground. It might be dripping from around the arch in front but mostly it looks like its at the corner in front where it turns to go up.

 Should I get a rubber one? Take it back off and use rt on the surface of the valve cover? I dont suppose its avoidable to remove it again?

 Somewhere I read to use a ball pean hammer on the bolt holes from underneath to remove v around the bolt holes.

Offline pintoguy76

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #1 on: January 07, 2015, 08:16:44 AM »
I glue em down with black silicon sealer. Just dont tighten them down too much. They dont need to be real tight...even hand tight will squeeze the gasket out and break it and cause it to leak.
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Offline ToniJ1960

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #2 on: January 07, 2015, 11:28:31 AM »
 use the sealer only one one side of the gasket?

Offline pintoguy76

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #3 on: January 07, 2015, 01:56:24 PM »
no i use it on both sides.
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Offline ToniJ1960

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #4 on: January 07, 2015, 07:01:36 PM »
 real thin layer?

Offline pintoguy76

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #5 on: January 07, 2015, 08:20:02 PM »
Not overly thin, but not super thick either. Id say put maybe a 1/4 inch bead on there and smear it out flat with your finger....
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Offline ToniJ1960

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #6 on: January 07, 2015, 11:18:47 PM »
 Should I put it on the vc first and let it set up then do the head side?

Offline pintoguy76

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #7 on: January 08, 2015, 11:30:05 AM »
Yes thats what I do. I put it on the VC, then smear it out, then put on the gasket and align the bolt holes. Let it set up a while then put the sealer on the gasket and then put it on the head. I let it set up a bit then before i tighten down the screws.... just as a precaution so that the sealer is less likely to squeeze out when tightening the bolts.
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Offline fastfred

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #8 on: January 10, 2015, 11:51:15 AM »
I had the very same issue just over week ago.  The brand new cork gasket split at the front corner when tightening down causing a bad leak that ran down the engine causing a lot of smoke when hot!   Tried some gasket compound but it didn't work.

I went to Advance Autos and bought a blue colored rubber gasket, twice the price but no more leaks.  I mentioned to the staff at the store the issue.  They said the cork gaskets have issues.

Get the rubber one, twice the price but much better.  They also have 8 metal inserts where the bolts go through.

Fred

Offline ToniJ1960

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #9 on: January 10, 2015, 05:09:54 PM »
 And you dont use rtv with the rubber one?

Offline dick1172762

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #10 on: January 11, 2015, 09:04:13 AM »
RTV or anything else is not only not needed, it will defeat the good points of the BLUE RUBBER gasket. Which are: can't over tighten the bolts, can be used over and over, will not leak, last one you will have to buy, etc-etc-etc. Leave the cork to the fisher men. On a car its junk.
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Offline pinto_one

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #11 on: January 12, 2015, 11:23:36 AM »
Yep I know the old cork gaskets are becoming a thing of the past but are still out there, most people do not know that these gaskets may have been sitting on the shelf for years in some warehouse , they dry out and crack very easy , for some cars that is all that is left around to use is old stock, no more being made , like the feeling trying to put on new (dried up ) valve cover gaskets on a Studebaker , yep they shrink , and they break when you try to pull them over the lips, one old trick was to soak them in hot water , 50/50 chance it might work, the 2.3 is not so bad, but the old German 2.0 with that puzzle end corner would give you fits some times, and still leak , still remember trying to use that new dried gasket , yep it broke,  :o
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Offline 76hotrodpinto

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #12 on: January 12, 2015, 01:35:27 PM »
I had the very same issue just over week ago.  The brand new cork gasket split at the front corner when tightening down causing a bad leak that ran down the engine causing a lot of smoke when hot!   Tried some gasket compound but it didn't work.

I went to Advance Autos and bought a blue colored rubber gasket, twice the price but no more leaks.  I mentioned to the staff at the store the issue.  They said the cork gaskets have issues.

Get the rubber one, twice the price but much better.  They also have a metal 8 metal inserts where the bolts go through.


Got a part number that?
Fred
1976 half hatch 2.3 turbo w/t5.

Offline fastfred

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #13 on: January 12, 2015, 02:36:04 PM »
Part number on Advance Autos is    VS 500-43 R-1.

No gasket compound needed as previously posted by dick1172762 is correct.

If you register with Adv. Autos you get regular 20% off from emails from them.

Cheers...Fred

Offline Pinturbo75

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #14 on: January 12, 2015, 05:12:06 PM »
ive found the blue rubber gaskets to be garbage.... got 3 hangin on the wall right now....anyone want them???? they squeeze out of the valve cover... and the metal sleeves in them mutilate the aluminum covers.... you want a great gasket????
get one from a ranger pickup truck.... 97 and up... theyre black with a metal core.. reusable over and over..... and they don't leak....they run about 50 bucks at ford.... but almost free at the junkyard....
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Offline dick1172762

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #15 on: January 12, 2015, 05:16:55 PM »
FEL PRO VS50043R-1 is the #  $15 on e-bay
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Offline 76hotrodpinto

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #16 on: January 13, 2015, 09:28:47 PM »
ive found the blue rubber gaskets to be garbage.... got 3 hangin on the wall right now....anyone want them???? they squeeze out of the valve cover... and the metal sleeves in them mutilate the aluminum covers.... you want a great gasket????
get one from a ranger pickup truck.... 97 and up... theyre black with a metal core.. reusable over and over..... and they don't leak....they run about 50 bucks at ford.... but almost free at the junkyard....


That sounds like the way to go. So it's a factory only part?
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Offline ToniJ1960

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #17 on: January 15, 2015, 05:00:06 PM »
 So many different opinions.
 Cork oh its the best all I ever use.No they dont work dontbelong on a car.
 Get the blue rubber one they work great. No they dont work dont get them.

 Cork is best for stamped metal covers, rubber for cast covers.


 Use cork and rtv or the right stuff or hi tack  on one side  to stick it to the vc. Use rtv on both sides. Dont use rtv.

 I think since Im going to do it myself and not pay someone to do it wrong again, Im going with cork and rtv on one side. Make sure the vc is flat take out the dimples if needed. Let the rtv partially set, hope it will be just slighly pliable to take any gaps at the corners out when I reinstall it and dont overtightn it.

 Anyone know if o reilly will rent a torque wrench from their rent tools?

 If this doesnt work ill try another approach. Im going to look it all over carefully how the vc sits on the head where the bolts are, watch carefully for any sign of the cork trying to crack any places etc.


 Maybe tomorrow the smoke is almost as bad as before the new gasket even went on.


 Will update.

 Anyone with bolt head sizes for the vc is the tightening sequence crucial etc.



Offline Reeves1

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #18 on: January 15, 2015, 06:04:54 PM »
Never seen any TQ used on pan or valve covers.
Just snug them up to 2+ lbs. by hand/feel.

You can find specs on line, listing anywhere from 25 INCH lbs to 2 lbs - 10 lbs.

Offline fastfred

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #19 on: January 15, 2015, 06:18:50 PM »
As a general rule a very max. of 12 foot lbs for a 6mm bolt which is only just smaller in diameter than a 1/4 inch.  Try 8-10 foot lbs. If the gasket seems to be spreading then back off a bit as this will create leaks.

 However, take a good look at the blue rubber gasket. It has a couple of grooves that it has to align with those on the valve cover itself on the roof part of the cover. ie behind where the cam sprocket is.

It worked well for me.

Fred

Offline ToniJ1960

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #20 on: January 16, 2015, 01:57:32 AM »
 Will do if the cork doesnt give good results when I try it. The guy I had do it didnt check the cover for dimpled holes or anything just threw it on and left. Well he ran th engine but not long enough to get it hot (live and learn). I plant to be super observant and give my instincts a shot.

Offline dick1172762

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #21 on: January 16, 2015, 11:22:32 AM »
What don't you understand when we tell you that the cork gaskets are JUNK and should never be used? No one has posted on here telling you to use the cork gaskets. We try to help you and you still want to use the cork gaskets. I'm not trying to bad mouth you, just trying to help.
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Offline ToniJ1960

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #22 on: January 16, 2015, 02:45:18 PM »
 I know I know, I really do appreciate everyone helping. I laughed at the fisher person part too. But I have a coupon anyway for o reilly I dont think ill spend much this time doing it myself, and I know in the back of my mind it may have to be redone.

 So many people say so many different things even someone here said the blue rubber ones are junk.

 I worked in consumer electronic servicing for so long, and studied some electronic engineering in college and out, my brain is weird

 One thing works great for one person not another. The other thing the same. I have a feeling theres more involved.

 My brain wont quit wondering why that gasket didnt seal. Im going to do it myself this time get a good look at everything.

 Clean everything well, bring the valve cover inside where it will be warmer, check it to be sure its flat and the bolt holes arent dimpled.

 Now with it being a little warmer inside the cork may not be so likely to crack or split when I put it on the vc. I think just a little permatex at both sides of where it bends to go up around the cam, 1/4 on each side of the bend, both sides of the front of the gasket. Then set it on tighten the blots gradually.

 Worst case ill be able to say no more cork and get the rubber one. Not likely going to get a $50 one now. Time I have money not so much have too many other places it needs to go right now.

 Just looking at this as experience. Please dont take it the wrong way.

Offline ToniJ1960

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #23 on: January 17, 2015, 04:53:49 PM »
 Well its fixed :) cork gasket no sealer anywhere and not a drop now.

 I got the cover off turned it over the gasket looked super. I looked the bottom of the cover over  and saw a little dip in one side of the flat part. The holes dimpled big time, but the front left corner or the one that foes on the pass side, the corner was tipped up.  Ilooked it over and thought about it. The corner was tipped up but at the edge the rail was lower.

 I think someone tried to take out the dimples before and bent that corner up then tried to fix it and got the edge of the rail on  the outside bent down. I used the edge of a finished 1x2 across the length of it working slow tapping lightly/ I got it real falt got the dimples out, you could see them from 3 feet away.

 Not seeping a bit. I ran it and checked with paper towels all around.

Offline Reeves1

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #24 on: January 17, 2015, 08:05:24 PM »
Good for you !

Offline ToniJ1960

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #25 on: January 17, 2015, 08:34:08 PM »
 thanks Reeves feels good to have y Pinto happy again and people not laughing at it because it looked like it was a bbq.

Offline ToniJ1960

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #26 on: January 17, 2015, 08:35:15 PM »
As a general rule a very max. of 12 foot lbs for a 6mm bolt which is only just smaller in diameter than a 1/4 inch.  Try 8-10 foot lbs. If the gasket seems to be spreading then back off a bit as this will create leaks.

 However, take a good look at the blue rubber gasket. It has a couple of grooves that it has to align with those on the valve cover itself on the roof part of the cover. ie behind where the cam sprocket is.

It worked well for me.

Fred

 They are 10mm on mine

Offline 76hotrodpinto

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #27 on: January 17, 2015, 09:01:14 PM »
He meant the shaft size of the bolt. I think. 10 mil bolt head and 6 mil shaft.
1976 half hatch 2.3 turbo w/t5.

Offline ToniJ1960

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #28 on: January 17, 2015, 09:37:48 PM »
 Thanks :) anyway I just snugged them so they wont come loose and its fine so far

Offline amc49

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Re: valve cover gasket replaced and leaking
« Reply #29 on: January 22, 2015, 07:10:25 PM »
Cork won't last as long as the blue rubber one, the cork content (part is rubber too) cooks to crumble with emission engine heat. Why the blue gasket was made, it's silicone just like the RTV and takes much higher temperatures before failing. The covers have no way of knowing what the gaskets are made of. You only have to pay attention to whether or not spacers are used and if so then you only torque down lightly to a solid hit and stop, any torque past that actually deforms the gasket and damages cover. It absolutely will not improve sealing either, generally making it worse.

FYI most 6 mm. bolts will pull threads at like 10 ft.lbs. if you are in aluminum. The valve covers will seal fine at 6 if they are flat and no dimples.

I ran into many cork gaskets when at the parts store that were old enough to crack when they were flexed, they flat will sell them as perfectly good to you in a second.

I had an AMC six cylinder once that I could get cork gasket (only one available back then) on correctly and no leak at all but the under cover temps were so high the gasket cooked to hard as rock in maybe 10 months to a year. I had to change them every time I turned around and not a cheap one either. That was when I turned my back on cork if at all possible. Trick with silicone rubber is you MUST guarantee bone dry both surfaces at install time, if the slightest oil film remains even after wiping flats down the leak has an established leak path and begins to leak pretty quick. Oil slithers under rubber easy as spit.

OEM does not use cork at all anymore, it is considered too low a quality and does not last. Pretty much some sort of silicone rubber in every gasket out there now. The engines run too hot for cork, normal temps now are around 220 degrees rather than the old school 180.