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Offline Pintocrazed

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OVERDRIVE TRANS
« on: April 09, 2015, 01:17:43 PM »
ANYBODY EVER PUT A AUTOMATIC OVERDRIVE TRANS BEHIND A 2.0?

Offline Wittsend

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Re: OVERDRIVE TRANS
« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2015, 02:06:35 PM »
Do you live and drive on level ground with a prevailing tailwind that changes with the direction you are traveling? I'm being a bit provoking here in a playful way. For a time I had 225-60-16" tires on my 2.0/C-4 Pinto.  I just ran the numbers through a calculator and here are the results based on a 3.40 rear I had installed at the time at 65 MPH:

175-70-13" (relative stock Pinto tires)  3,300 RPM at 65 MPH 4 speed or automatic with a 1 to 1 final drive

225-60-16" (that I used with 1:1 C-4) 2,800 RPM at 65 MPH  The calculator equated this to a .85 overdrive.

15-70-13" (relative stock Pinto tires)   2,200 RPM at 65 MPH This is the AOD overdrive with a .67 4th gear (overdrive) ratio.

So, if the 2.0 is seriously bogged with my 2,800 RPM, .85 equivalent ratio imaging the bog at 2,200 RPM with the .67 ratio.  You would have to run 4.56 gears to get 3,000 RPM at 66 MPH. Your only dropping 300 RPM and getting close to the "boggy" 2,800 RPM from my experience. And all this is with "stock-ish" 175-70-13" tires. Go to a larger tire and it only gets worse.  So, no, I have never run the overdrive, but the numbers just don't come up favorably.  Lastly, my 2.3 Turbo was running a T-5 with 3.00 rear and about 2,200 RPM at 65 MPH. At 195 HP the car still did not like those ratios and going to 3.40 has been far more favorable (2,600 RPM at 65 MPH).



Offline Pintocrazed

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Re: OVERDRIVE TRANS
« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2015, 02:38:57 PM »
I ENJOY THE PICKING.FIGURE D ID ASK THE PROS WHO KNOW

Offline pinto_one

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Re: OVERDRIVE TRANS
« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2015, 08:15:31 PM »
Well since your getting those 4.11s From me it just might work great, plus the aod has a higher stall speed converter so it would give a good launch from the start, the A4LD has a .75 od , when you come and pick up the gears I will let you drive my 76 that has the A4LD in it, it has a 3 . 1 rear but the V-6 covers it nicely , you can do the math on rpm though the overdrive and use one of those on line tire size conversion sites to the tire you want to use and find out if the 2.0 can pull the mph with the 4.11s,  later Blaine😺
76 Pinto sedan V6 , 79 pinto cruiser wagon V6 soon to be diesel or 4.0

Offline Wittsend

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Re: OVERDRIVE TRANS
« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2015, 09:14:37 PM »
4.11's with with .75 overdrive and 175-70-13" tires will get you 2,975 RPM at 65 MPH
                                                       205-60-15" tires will give you 2725 RPM at 65 MPH

 Still, not sure how the 2.0 will like that (205-60-15").  Best to see what others say as I'm just crunching numbers. Torque makes all the difference. I  ran the 700R4 (.70 overdrive) 3.07 gears with 225-60-16" tires on my Studebaker Daytona in the calculator. 1765 RPM at 65 MPH! Even with 3.54 gears I'd just barely be over 2000 RPM (2040).  Of course a 350 Chevy provides the needed torque for that. I've only been throwing the freeway speed RPM's out there. Sometimes the problem goes the other way. The 700R4 has a 3.06 first gear and 3.07 rear gears I have are just fine with that. Going to 3.54's might make first an ultra granny gear.

  Everything is a trade off. So plug your numbers in and check all aspects. This is the tire size calculator I was using http://tire-size-conversion.com/tire-size-calculator/  and this is the ratio calculator I was using  http://spicerparts.com/calculators/transmission-ratio-rpm-calculator  (but there are hundreds of others out there).

Don't know why I like doing this. I didn't care much for math in school.  Oh, wait, math with a PURPOSE, that makes sense. Otherwise math problems were like reading books with a jumble of letters to me.

Offline pinto_one

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Re: OVERDRIVE TRANS
« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2015, 10:08:55 PM »
Yep , did not like math ether, I do also run the numbers to see how things may fit, but if I already have the stuff lying around and do not have cut up anything to try it it's a go, I can always put it back the way it was, or the numbers were so close I had to try it to find out,  and had my hands in Studebakers also, way ahead of its time, and back then I could not find any R-2 pistons for my hawk, wound up using some 2.0 Pistons from a few dead pinto engines I had lying around , lucky the block was thick enough and just had to machine the rod ends a few thousands and grind slots in the pin for the pinch bolts, yep it worked,  and was not a 289 any more 👹
76 Pinto sedan V6 , 79 pinto cruiser wagon V6 soon to be diesel or 4.0

Offline Pintocrazed

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Re: OVERDRIVE TRANS
« Reply #6 on: April 10, 2015, 06:40:53 AM »
I GOTTA DECIDE IF THIS IS WHAT IM GONNA DO.AND WHAT VEHICLE TO GET THE TRANS FROM

Offline dick1172762

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Re: OVERDRIVE TRANS
« Reply #7 on: April 10, 2015, 08:42:25 AM »
Has to be earlier than a 1994 or you will have to deal with the computer. 94 up is a better tranie but lots more work.
Its better to be a has-been, than a never was.

Offline Pintocrazed

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Re: OVERDRIVE TRANS
« Reply #8 on: April 10, 2015, 09:41:02 AM »
like 93 back?such as a foxbody?

Offline dick1172762

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Re: OVERDRIVE TRANS
« Reply #9 on: April 10, 2015, 10:29:13 AM »
YES
Its better to be a has-been, than a never was.

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Re: OVERDRIVE TRANS
« Reply #10 on: April 10, 2015, 10:58:42 AM »
I WOULDA FIGURED THEY WERE COMPUTER CONTROLLED.SO I DONT NEED TO WIRE THE TRANSMISSION?

Offline dick1172762

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Re: OVERDRIVE TRANS
« Reply #11 on: April 10, 2015, 12:30:54 PM »
Not the 93 and older. All they have is a tv cable and Lowcar has kits to install the tv cable with any kind of intake/carb set up.
Its better to be a has-been, than a never was.

Offline Wittsend

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Re: OVERDRIVE TRANS
« Reply #12 on: April 10, 2015, 12:43:23 PM »
I can't account for the Ford transmissions in specific, but typically in the 80's thru the early 90's there was an electrical hook-up for for the lock up convertors on overdrive transmissions.  This usually involved the convertor locking up with 4th gear engagement. If you want to exaggerate the word "computer" your right foot and a vacuum switch was typically used to disengage the lock up in situations such as high speed passing.

Later, (and similar years like Dick stated for Ford) transmissions were computer controlled. That is an electronic as opposed to an electrical system. In some cases the engine ECU was used and in others a separate computer was used depending on the manufacture.  So, yes it is important from an economic side to be using the applicable transmission.

IF..., the Ford transmissions works similar to some of the non-computer GM's you can use a 555 chip to build a delay device ($10-ish) so the 4th gear engagement and the convertor lock up don't occur immediately at the same time.  While not a real extra gear ratio delaying the lock up 5-10 seconds gives the "feel" of a 5th gear and a "real" effect of a 5th gear as the RPM's drop as the convertor locks up.  Note that some overdrive transmissions lock up in gears other than 4th. And in that case the delay probably wouldn't work as well.

Offline Pintocrazed

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Re: OVERDRIVE TRANS
« Reply #13 on: April 10, 2015, 12:53:46 PM »
HMM I'LL HAVE TO STUDY THIS AN TRY TO UNDERSTAND.YA'LL MAKE IT SOUND EASY BUT MY TECHNICAL KNOWLEDGE IS NOT THAT VAST

Offline pinto_one

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Re: OVERDRIVE TRANS
« Reply #14 on: April 10, 2015, 06:42:49 PM »
There is a non computer way out of this , when I first planed to put a over drive trans into my pinto I looked at the A4LD and the 700R4 , and I was going to use the org carb setup to make it simple , the 700R4 looked good to me because of the 3 to 1 first gear and towing a small 16 ft scamp camper I wanted something strong, so I made up a bel housing to mate the 700R4 to the 2.8, and found out later that the right side of the trans hit the floor pan and pushed out the headers , next was the A4LD , got one out of a 85 ford ranger 2.8, it is a two wire hook up, it goes from first all the way to over drive by it self , the two wire is only for converter lock up, and you can buy a pressure switch to do that, and it ties into the transmission gov test pickup, you can buy different switches for different lock up speeds from transmission center , in Srevport LA, later I decided to go with the TBI fuel injection and the now the computer runs the show on shifting , I think it's a good mod if you got the right rear gear and gets rid of the buzz on the hwy, and last , if you are planing on it you have better do it soon , those transmissions are drying up like the pinto , hard to find , later Blaine 
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Offline Rebolting73

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Re: OVERDRIVE TRANS
« Reply #15 on: April 11, 2015, 12:57:25 AM »
I run a stand alone A4LD in my 73 and am really happy it. Early 2 wire valve body, late model box with the pressure switch TC lockup mod.