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Offline ToniJ1960

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need help advice changing starter 78 2.3
« on: December 24, 2014, 01:15:54 PM »
 Have a 78 wagon with 2.3 starter after all these years decided it doesnt want to start my car anymore. Corvette head gasket let go, no car for christmas :(

 Ok I have to try to change the starter myself old woman under the car.

 I was toild you can loosen one motor mount to raise the motor to get the starter in or out.

 Some say they lower the rack. Mines power steering.

 Do you or dont you have to disconnect the input shaft  from the column?

 Do or dont have to disconnect steel lines?

 I know I saw soneone take the tie rod end out of the spindle and it looked easy enough to do, I dont think he even took the wheels off.

 One complication, if the steering shaft has to be disconnected, my steering wheel doesnt lock. Is there a way  to immobilize it?

Offline pinto_one

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Re: need help advice changing starter 78 2.3
« Reply #1 on: December 24, 2014, 03:37:36 PM »
Yes that is a job if you do not have the tools to do it, first you have to make sure the starter is bad for sure , do not want to replace anything that is good , only the bad stuff,  you said it does not want to start , does the engine turn over when try too? does it click our buzz when you do , if it does the buzz thing the battery is just about dead, if it clicks try removing the wire that goes to the starter from the solenoid , touch that end to the battery side of the solenoid , not the battery post , if engine turns over it is the solenoid , replace that, if it does not its the starter  :o, for it to be easy to change it you have to have at least a foot off the ground , and blocked up for safety , you have two large bolts that face the front , remove them if you can, they are tight, after just pull the rack forward enough to drop the left side down enough to see the starter well, remove the bracket that holds the wire to the engine ,(11/16 socket ) and last the three bolts that hold the starter on, ( also 11/16 ) remove starter with the wire still attached , remove wire and install on new starter , reinstall in reverse order I gave you , good luck, option #2 only if it has a stick, push car to start it, drive to shop and let them do it , option #3 only if you live near 50 miles of pass Christian Mississippi , call me I would put it on for you , got one I would give you , good luck and merry X-mas, later Blaine
76 Pinto sedan V6 , 79 pinto cruiser wagon V6 soon to be diesel or 4.0

Offline dick1172762

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Re: need help advice changing starter 78 2.3
« Reply #2 on: December 24, 2014, 05:17:47 PM »
I've never had a starter in any of my 16 Pintos go bad so I'll ask this question. Can the starter be removed upward if you take the exhaust manifold off first. Sounds easyer if your in the boomdocks or in a mud field, etc, etc. Tell me before I need to know.
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Offline ToniJ1960

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Re: need help advice changing starter 78 2.3
« Reply #3 on: December 24, 2014, 05:19:50 PM »
 Thank you so I dont need to take the tie rod ends out of the spindles disconnect the power steering lines or the steering shaft good.

 With that offer I might push start it and drive it to Mississippi lol I was in Natchez a few years ago long drive from St Louis but the people were so nice and the country was beautiful. Just dont ask for a map or directions at the gas stations they dont know the word map. Maybe I should have said el mapo.

 And yes the starter is done for just whines my friend listened to it and said its clutch over run? I got it to start one time drove it it died, was cold, and didnt start again. Pushed it home tried to start it whines. Tried again whines. Tried again it started. Flywheel wasnt turned, and three or four times in a row I wouldnt expect to stop on the same place every time.

 I was thinking its not loud enough to be contacting the flywheel, mechanic I had listen says the same thing.

 He wants $75 to put one in, just spent over 300 on my other car to find out its got a blown head gasket so moneys tight now. I better learn to do some things.

Offline ToniJ1960

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Re: need help advice changing starter 78 2.3
« Reply #4 on: December 24, 2014, 05:27:16 PM »
I've never had a starter in any of my 16 Pintos go bad so I'll ask this question. Can the starter be removed upward if you take the exhaust manifold off first. Sounds easyer if your in the boomdocks or in a mud field, etc, etc. Tell me before I need to know.

 That might depend on if you have exhaust bolts that have been in there for thirty years.

Offline dick1172762

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Re: need help advice changing starter 78 2.3
« Reply #5 on: December 24, 2014, 09:48:10 PM »
That might depend on if you have exhaust bolts that have been in there for thirty years.
  Might be worth a try Tonij
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Offline pinto_one

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Re: need help advice changing starter 78 2.3
« Reply #6 on: December 25, 2014, 07:18:00 PM »
Wow , too bad your so far away , but 75 bucks is not to bad , but cheeper than changing head gaskets , and could be worse trying to remove the nuts on the manifold (may snap a stud off) , real rusty after thirty years and the U bolt the holds the exhaust pipe to a bracket that bolts to the engine , is hell some times, changed out a few when I worked for a ford dealer back then, and a few on mine, so that was one for the tricks to quickly remove and replace the starter , even works on power steering also , good luck , if you want to take a wack at it let us know , we can give you a list of tools and the size of the to do the job , have a merry xmas , later , Blaine
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Offline ToniJ1960

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Re: need help advice changing starter 78 2.3
« Reply #7 on: December 29, 2014, 09:56:01 PM »
 Ok despite the freezing cold I am reafy to give this a try tomorrow.

 I ordered a starter drive that I hope is the right one. Will I need a vice to put the new drive into the starter?

 What size socket will I need for the steering rack bolts? Should I use a breaker bar or can I use a 1/2 ratchet? Can I do it with an open end wrench and a pipe even?

 If I have to move the steering rack a little will it be enough room to put new bushings in? I have some I bought before.

 I have a floor jack and two jackstands. Is it safe to put the front up o n jackstands and block the rear tires while Im under it trying to get this done?

 I can put some old rims under the rear somewhere maybe?


 Help me feel prepared :) thank you for whatever help you might offer advice suggestions etc.

Offline pinto_one

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Re: need help advice changing starter 78 2.3
« Reply #8 on: December 30, 2014, 01:04:29 PM »
Great you have the jack stands , better safe than (smashed ) sorry , use the breaker bar first to lossen the nuts , then the ratchet , then push the starter side bolt out , leave the drivers side where it is , use a pry bar (or the breaker bar to move the rack forward enough for that side to drop down , it install the drive clutch use remove the two bolts on the back of the starter , tap the nose of the starter and will come off easy, they will be a spring inside that fits between the nose and arm that pushes in the starter drive when you cranks the car, DO NOT PULL ON THE SHAFT, if you do and it come out you will have a fresh can of worms,    at the end of the shaft you will see a cupped washer , remove , next a C- Clip , remove with care , they are known to vanish if they pop off , next is remove the top cover , no need the remove the band on the back, (note if the starter is a new style it will have a rear screw ) you will see a pin on the arm that that sticks in the starter drive, remove , pull on the drive and not the shaft , should come off easy , install new drive , now put everything back where you found them, good luck , hope this helps
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Offline ToniJ1960

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Re: need help advice changing starter 78 2.3
« Reply #9 on: January 06, 2015, 04:46:50 PM »
 Ok I got some help and we got the starter in by removing a motor mount.

 It only had 2 bolts so where do I get these bolts from?
 

Offline pintoguy76

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Re: need help advice changing starter 78 2.3
« Reply #10 on: January 07, 2015, 08:19:19 AM »
Which bolts are you talking about? The motor mount bolts or the starter bolts?
1974 Ford Pinto Wagon with 1991 Mustang DIS EFI 2.3 and stock Pinto 4 Speed
 
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Offline ToniJ1960

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Re: need help advice changing starter 78 2.3
« Reply #11 on: January 07, 2015, 11:29:27 AM »
 the starter bolts one was missing right now it has only two in it

Offline pinto_one

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Re: need help advice changing starter 78 2.3
« Reply #12 on: January 07, 2015, 02:08:16 PM »
Glad you got the starter in safely and hope you did not get skinned up to much, as for bolts go to a pull it wrecking yard and take the bolts off a ford ranger with the 2.3 , they are the same or a ford explorer , also the same , they are metric , I think 10MM X 35MM long and use a lock washer, guess you could not take the two large bolts from the rack out, they are very tight some times ,
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Offline ToniJ1960

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Re: need help advice changing starter 78 2.3
« Reply #13 on: January 07, 2015, 07:00:42 PM »
 We didnt have a socket that big to take the racx bolts loose with. My friend says the starter bolts are 17 mm?

Offline pintoguy76

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Re: need help advice changing starter 78 2.3
« Reply #14 on: January 07, 2015, 08:23:06 PM »
I will see if i can find the exact thread size for you on that bolt.  If you dont live in a town with a hardware store I can pick one up for you and mail it to you...
1974 Ford Pinto Wagon with 1991 Mustang DIS EFI 2.3 and stock Pinto 4 Speed
 
1996 Chevy C2500 Suburban with 6.5L Turbo Diesel/4L80E 4x2

1980 Volvo 265 with 1997 S-10 4.3 and a modified 700R4

2010 GMC Sierra SLE 1500 4x2 5.3 6L80E

Offline ToniJ1960

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Re: need help advice changing starter 78 2.3
« Reply #15 on: January 07, 2015, 11:17:36 PM »
 thamnks :) we have lots of hardware places and car parts places in st louis if I can get the right specs for the bolt grade # and all that

Offline pintoguy76

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Re: need help advice changing starter 78 2.3
« Reply #16 on: January 08, 2015, 11:32:10 AM »
Ok when I get home I will pull a bolt from my car and go match it up at the hardware store and let you know what size to get. Its metric i'm sure, and likely grade 8.8 or possibly 10.8.
1974 Ford Pinto Wagon with 1991 Mustang DIS EFI 2.3 and stock Pinto 4 Speed
 
1996 Chevy C2500 Suburban with 6.5L Turbo Diesel/4L80E 4x2

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2010 GMC Sierra SLE 1500 4x2 5.3 6L80E