PINTO CAR CLUB of AMERICA
Welcome to FordPinto.com, The home of the PCCA => General Help- Ask the Experts... => Topic started by: Glitch666 on November 03, 2011, 04:01:29 PM
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Okay so I got my 76 sedan home. The whole way over the pass thought the engine made a pretty load tapping noise. it sounds like its coming from the front of the head. It does not do it when its idling, it only does it under load. the head was redone at Yakima grind before the car war parked for 3 years. Anybody with expertise on this would be helpful.
EDIT!
Made a video, sorry its quiet but towords the end you will hear it pretty good if you turn it up.
http://youtu.be/_buiWHsccPE
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I think you are getting spark knock. Try a fill up using premium fuel and drive the pass again.
If the noise goes away, that is what it is. Then you can focus on how to fix that or run premium.
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Sorry for bringing back my old thread but this issue is driving me nuts. Like I said before the head has less than 500 miles on it after being rebuilt but the car did sit for 3 years after the tranny went out. Im sure its not spark knock, and the timing is dead on. I did notice that if I retard the timing by turning the dizzy towords the radiator it gets better but doesnt go away. I took the valve cover off and inspected everything and its all new with no visible play or wear. Oil does squirt everywhere when turned over =]. New plugs and wires also where installed. I was told that it could be that the head just needs to be broken in, or one of the lifters is gunked up from sitting and to run seafoam through it or a quart of atf mixed with my oil. Anybody that is willing to help would be awesome.
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Did you try a fill-up of premium gas as a test? It's just a test. Your tank should be under a 1/4 to do this test.
If the knocking is eliminated or decreases substantially then it is probably not a mechanical issue.
If the premium gas fixes the knocking, here are some things to look at.
* Your EGR valve may not be working or vacuum lines are not plumbed properly.
* Try a cooler engine thermostat. 180-F degree in place of the 192-195 stock.
* Remove the hot air hose from the air cleaner and see if that helps.
* Enrichen main jet
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Premium gas didnt change it all, has a full tank of premium. Egr valve is removed and the hole is blocked. Hot air hose isnt connected. Thermostat shouldnt do it because it does it at all temps. I was thinking, could the duraspark module or dizzy cause this if there bad?
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Hey Glitch666:
What weight oil are you using and which brand is it?
Thanks,
77pintocw
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Here are some more troubleshootin g ideas that is easy to try:
Lubricate the distributor centrifugal advance by...
Remove the distributor cap & rotor. Remove the felt in the distributor shaft.
Add two drops of oil. Install the felt back in place and add two drops of oil to the felt.
Try a test drive with the vacuum lines removed from the distributor and plugged.
What was the result? If no noise we could have narrowed down the problem. Keeping the vacuum lines off is not a solution.
See if it is running lean. You could tie the choke half closed and go for a short drive to see the result.
The thermostat is about the engine temperature, not the outside temperature.
You may want to install a temperature gauge on your engine. It could be running on the hot side. This can promote spark knocking.
It's good insurance too to keep track of your engine.
Can you get any mechanical rattling when revving the motor in place?
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does it feel like it has proper power or does it feel slugish? im thinking cam timing may be off...
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My friend had a Chevy big block and it had a similar noise. turned out to be a broken valve spring. It wasn't a major break but would tick. good luck. :(
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My friend had a Chevy big block and it had a similar noise. turned out to be a broken valve spring. It wasn't a major break but would tick. good luck. :(
Yeah definitely not a broken valve spring I have visually inspected it with the cover off and everything is brand new.
Here are some more trouble shootin g ideas that is easy to try:
Lubricate the distributor centrifugal advance by...
Remove the distributor cap & rotor. Remove the felt in the distributor shaft.
Add two drops of oil. Install the felt back in place and add two drops of oil to the felt.
Try a test drive with the vacuum lines removed from the distributor and plugged.
What was the result? If no noise we could have narrowed down the problem. Keeping the vacuum lines off is not a solution.
See if it is running lean. You could tie the choke half closed and go for a short drive to see the result.
The thermostat is about the engine temperature, not the outside temperature.
You may want to install a temperature gauge on your engine. It could be running on the hot side. This can promote spark knocking.
It's good insurance too to keep track of your engine.
Can you get any mechanical rattling when revving the motor in place?
Also back to temp, Its not just when I drive it. I could freshly start it no matter what temp the engine is and it will tap when you increase the throttle although it sounds a hell of alto worse when I'm driving it.
Hey Glitch666:
What weight oil are you using and which brand is it?
Thanks,
77pinto cw
I think I have 10-40 Pennzoil in it right now, gonna do an oil change soon and try some seafoam.
does it feel like it has proper power or does it feel sluggish? I'm thinking cam timing may be off...
Actually it runs really well and gets up and halls butt, its actually pretty surprising. Ive checked the timing and its dead on.
Oh also what pintos came with a holly 6500? This one has it and just tested the idle mixture screw and with it turned in all the way it wont die like it should. Ive never seen it before as everyone ive worked on had a 5200. Im gonna have to trouble shoot this thing to death. I am suspecting the carb now though.
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My bet would be a sticky/bad hydraulic lifter. I had three of them a year and a half after the motor rebuild on my 78's 2.3L motor. I use Castrol Synthetic (high mileage) GTX 10w30 in the winter and 10w40 in the summer, and notice less ticking than when using regular dino oil. My 2.3L still ticks, but only when cold and after warming up it goes away until I let the car get cold and start it again.
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" Its not just when I drive it. I could freshly start it no matter what temp the engine is and it will tap when you increase the throttle although it sounds a hell of alto worse when I'm driving it. "
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With that statement it seems we can assume a mechanical issue. Since you can hear it when you are not driving, go purchase an automotive stethoscope. They are very low cost. You can use that to find the location and narrow down your search.
Yep, an oil change never hurts. I would use a Motorcraft oil filter.
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what about pulling ignition wires and see if noise goes away or alot less, maybe a piston pin noise?
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That's what I was about to suggest. Possibly a bad wrist pin? Has the motor ever been apart?
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what about pulling ignition wires and see if noise goes away or alot less, maybe a piston pin noise?
Or a cracked skirt.
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One more...
You can use a 3 foot piece of heater hose to listen to the motor.
Hold one end to your ear and feed the other end around the motor. Works amazingly well.
Be careful to keep your hands away from the belts and pulleys!
Also remember that the valve train turns at half the crankshaft speed.
So listening to the frequency of the noise helps you understand if it's in the head or block.
While your listening, sometimes the insides of old catalytic converters come loose and rattle around when the throttle is changed.
Good luck, we hope you find it.
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what about pulling ignition wires and see if noise goes away or alto less, maybe a piston pin noise?
I have done that but it doesn't go away, just runs crappy Lil.
That's what I was about to suggest. Possibly a bad wrist pin? Has the motor ever been apart?
The motor has been rebuilt before sitting for 3 years, wouldn't a wrist pin sound like more of a clunk noise? Ive used a piece of wood to listen and its definitely in the head in the front to the left.
Anyway I'm gonna make a video and post it on youtube so you guys can hear what I'm hearing.
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Perhaps a bad valve guide.
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These guys have given you very good ideas, one I have left clean engine up do oil change 4 quarts you norm then 1 quart of Marvel Mystery oil very high detergent may loosen lifters and valves a cheap fix. I have used this oil on aircraft engines with much success with the twin engines. Fred :)
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These guys have given you very good ideas, one I have left clean engine up do oil change 4 quarts you norm then 1 quart of Marvel Mystery oil very high detergent may loosen lifters and valves a cheap fix. I have used this oil on aircraft engines with much success with the twin engines. Fred :)
Actually I was think of doing that after my father blurted out that marvel is a miracle cure for cars! Lol, im gonna do a little work and post back tomorrow. thank you so much guys!
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This just came to mind....And the gaskets are cheap.....Mayb e you have an exhaust leak at the manifold to the head, or even the coupling where the down pipe meets the manifold??
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This just came to mind....And the gaskets are cheap.....Mayb e you have an exhaust leak at the manifold to the head, or even the coupling where the down pipe meets the manifold??
Thats deffinitly possible will check that when i get paid, Ill grab a new gasket and change out the old one. anybody wanna check out my vid in the first post ;D
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I think your dad's right try the mystrey oil and see what happens.
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i have the same sounding noise, first check oil pressure, but i found mine isnt coming from the head, my sound sounds the same and its my thrust bearing is shot on the crank, check your crank end play
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Sounds like an exhaust leak to me. If you have an inspection mirror take a look at the bottom side of the exhaust manifold.