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Offline r4pinto

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cold start issues
« on: November 08, 2016, 07:58:59 AM »
Hey guys, got an issue

1980 Ford Pinto 2.3. Carb & engine from 1977 Pinto. Things were fine before, pump twice & fire up. Now I pump twice & she just cranks & cranks & cranks. I pump 2-3 times more & she will eventually start. Noticed it doesn't step up to a higher idle first thing either.

Once up to temp it fires right up & runs perfect.

I dropped the engine in from the 77 after cleaning & painting it & using the same carb that was from the 77.

The electric choke isn't hooked up but is there. Connection is for the 77 Pinto versus 80 wiring & need to swap choke coils.

Any suggestions as to what to adjust on the car?
Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

Offline 74 PintoWagon

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Re: cold start issues
« Reply #1 on: November 08, 2016, 08:32:13 AM »
First thing to do is to make sure everything moves freely, any grime will cause it to stick and not perform right, I'd hook up the electric myself.
Art
65 Falcon 2DR 200 IL6 with C4.

Offline r4pinto

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Re: cold start issues
« Reply #2 on: November 08, 2016, 08:34:58 AM »
Yeah I plan to hook up the electric but a little baffled as to what has happened to cause it to suddenly not fast idle and have issues starting after sitting. Yesterday got to the car after work and it took a bit to start. And it was about 60 so the choke may or may not have been utilized. Heck I dunno. I know fuel injection lol. I'd love to find me a throttle body injection unit that would work on it but aftermarket units are as much as I paid for the car itself if I can even find one.


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Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

Offline 74 PintoWagon

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Re: cold start issues
« Reply #3 on: November 08, 2016, 11:05:43 AM »
Sounds to me it's just sticking, it can happen suddenly.
Art
65 Falcon 2DR 200 IL6 with C4.

Offline r4pinto

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Re: cold start issues
« Reply #4 on: November 08, 2016, 11:25:11 AM »
Sounds to me it's just sticking, it can happen suddenly.
I'll try to lube it up and see what happens. Hopefully that's all she needs to work right. Major pain to start the car when cold currently.


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Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

Offline 74 PintoWagon

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Re: cold start issues
« Reply #5 on: November 09, 2016, 08:52:10 AM »
I'll try to lube it up and see what happens. Hopefully that's all she needs to work right. Major pain to start the car when cold currently.


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A little lube can do wonders for it, I've gotten carbs for next to nothing because they couldn't get the choke to work because of crud, clean it up and give a little WD and works like new..
Art
65 Falcon 2DR 200 IL6 with C4.

Offline r4pinto

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Re: cold start issues
« Reply #6 on: November 09, 2016, 08:54:11 AM »
It may very well be a lube issue. It started hard this morning but after starting it idled up after a moment. Then after warming up I revved to drop the idle down. So I'm sure it's functioning right, just sticking. Annoying it takes so much to start when cold though


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Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

Offline 74 PintoWagon

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Re: cold start issues
« Reply #7 on: November 09, 2016, 08:58:49 AM »
Yeah, cold sucks alright,lol, might spray it with Brake Kleen  to clean it up then lube it up.
Art
65 Falcon 2DR 200 IL6 with C4.

Offline r4pinto

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Re: cold start issues
« Reply #8 on: November 09, 2016, 09:00:20 AM »
Well I gotta buy some brake cleaner for the rear brake rebuild anyway so I will have it. Brand new shoes and wheel cylinders. Also turning the drums of able.


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Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

Offline 74 PintoWagon

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Re: cold start issues
« Reply #9 on: November 09, 2016, 09:08:21 AM »
Good deal.. 8) 8)
Art
65 Falcon 2DR 200 IL6 with C4.

Offline r4pinto

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Re: cold start issues
« Reply #10 on: November 09, 2016, 09:10:04 AM »
I tell ya what though. The car is 36 years old and doesn't start as well, and brakes not as good as the 4 wheel disc brakes on the Impala but I really enjoy driving this car more.


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Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

Offline 74 PintoWagon

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Re: cold start issues
« Reply #11 on: November 09, 2016, 09:18:30 AM »
I can relate to that, we've rented a few cars for short trips because it was cheaper in the long run than using my truck, and every time after about a 100miles the wife commented how our 40yr old truck was more comfortable than the new stuff.
Art
65 Falcon 2DR 200 IL6 with C4.

Offline r4pinto

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Re: cold start issues
« Reply #12 on: November 09, 2016, 09:31:09 AM »
Oh the car is far from comfortable compared to the Impala. Louder, bouncier, not as well optioned, seats not as nice. But I still enjoy driving it


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Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

Offline 74 PintoWagon

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Re: cold start issues
« Reply #13 on: November 10, 2016, 06:40:36 AM »
That's what it's all about..
Art
65 Falcon 2DR 200 IL6 with C4.

Offline Reeves1

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Re: cold start issues
« Reply #14 on: November 10, 2016, 07:34:22 AM »
Just an FYI.....as I live where it gets cold.

I changed all engines (years ago) to full synthetic oil(s).

A gas engines now with Quaker State 10w-30. All start much easier when the temps drop.

All engines that go into storage for the winter get the oil changed first (regardless of how much used). Do not want acids causing damage to bearings over the winter.

Not that the above means much to you, as it is a choke issue.

Offline 65ShelbyClone

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Re: cold start issues
« Reply #15 on: November 12, 2016, 10:38:16 AM »
It's probably not necessary to change the oil before winterizing unless it has a lot of use on it. Low temps are going to retard chemical reactions and the oil has acid neutralizers in it anyway. I'll make a concession for rare/valuable engines like your Boss 302 though.

Yesterday got to the car after work and it took a bit to start. And it was about 60 so the choke may or may not have been utilized.

Isn't the choke disconnected?

The '77 carb I have has a choke mechanism with a cam that cracks the throttle slightly when cold, which makes it idle up. If the choke isn't working, then that isn't working. My carb also has an electric dashpot to raise the idle, but I think it was strictly for the A/C.

I know fuel injection lol. I'd love to find me a throttle body injection unit that would work on it but aftermarket units are as much as I paid for the car itself if I can even find one.

If you want OEM parts and running behavior, then retrofitting an EEC-IV system would be one option. There are also inexpensive aftermarket ECUs like MegaSquirt. MS installs tend to be a bit of a project though. MegaSquirt ECUs are not ruggedized like OEM systems, so keep that in mind if you absolutely need to rely on the car.

https://www.diyautotune.com/support/tech/install/chevrolet-gm/carb-to-efi/part1/

'72 Runabout - 2.3T, T5, MegaSquirt-II, 8", 5-lugs, big brakes.
'68 Mustang - Built roller 302, Toploader, 9", etc.

Offline r4pinto

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Re: cold start issues
« Reply #16 on: November 12, 2016, 10:56:30 AM »
Nope the choke is not disconnected. The choke cool is not plugged in but that's all. I would love to install any type of fuel injection but it's all down to cost. Costs too much to do. If I could find an oem style throttle body that would fit and utilize the original or close to original design air cleaner I would do it but problem is cost and configuration. I haven't done a lot  of research to see what I can find    and don't want it to be something where the car is out of commission for an extended period of time. Need to be able to drive the car if something happens to my daily driver which has happened more often than not.


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Matt Manter
1977 Pinto sedan- Named Harold II after the first Pinto(Harold) owned by my mom. R.I.P mom- 1980 parts provider & money machine for anything that won't fit the 80
1980 Pinto Runabout- work in progress

Offline sedandelivery

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Re: cold start issues
« Reply #17 on: November 12, 2016, 05:30:08 PM »
My 1980 Bobcat, cold, pump the pedal once to set the choke, and turn the engine over and after a few cranks it starts. Starting it any other way the car will give lots of problems.

Offline C. M. Wolf

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Re: cold start issues
« Reply #18 on: January 01, 2017, 11:15:50 AM »
Hey guys, got an issue

1980 Ford Pinto 2.3. Carb & engine from 1977 Pinto. Things were fine before, pump twice & fire up. Now I pump twice & she just cranks & cranks & cranks. I pump 2-3 times more & she will eventually start. Noticed it doesn't step up to a higher idle first thing either.

Once up to temp it fires right up & runs perfect.

I dropped the engine in from the 77 after cleaning & painting it & using the same carb that was from the 77.

The electric choke isn't hooked up but is there. Connection is for the 77 Pinto versus 80 wiring & need to swap choke coils.

Any suggestions as to what to adjust on the car?

Ok, I poured over my 77/2.3(way back when) for near 2 months trying to solve some minor issues, including the one you have/had. This is a Colonge, German engine & it tends to be very picky.
The vacuum sys has to be near perfect, the timing is only a point or so forgiving(running slightly advanced is better), when the owner's manual talks about oil viscities per temps they need to be taken seriously. I couldn't tell if the fuel pump was only weak or the lines run w/ too much resistance(I installed an Electric Fuel Pump back by the tank eventually & plated off the manual fuel pump port in the block). Vapor-lock seemed to be a problem prior to the Electric Fuel Pump. Also, the vacuum advance can be lightened some so the vac-pressures don't have to be as high, if you're running the std/manual distributor.
Cold starts just seem to be a bit of an issue on the lil'Ford 4 cyl engines(like the carb drains back to level after it sits for awhile, another thing installing an electric fuel pump solved- turning it on manually(wired w/a switch) allowed fuel pressures to build up a bit before actually cranking the engine over.

Cold starts can always be a bit of an issue if you live in an area where it snows/freezes, something a block-heater will always help, along w/ lower degree'ed coolant-temp regulator being a good idea. Turn off the interior heater/fan when you park as that can act as a 'second radiator' for the cooling sys & take longer to warm the engine on start-ups. Another thing that helps once you get the engine to start, run for 1 min & shut it off let it set for 2 mins- allowing the engine temp to spread into the cooling passages more evenly warming the whole engine faster.

IHTH

Michael