Author Topic: 1977 Pinto- project in the works (Read 28936 times)

r4pinto · « **on:** April 07, 2008, 07:54:57 PM »

Those of you that were at Carlisle 2006 know of my Pinto, and saw her there. You also know how she died on the way home 130 miles outside Columbus, Ohio. Well, I sorta left her for dead in the driveway from October 2006 until late 2007. I decided to go to Carlisle this year, so I started to do some serious work to the car.

I was planning on changing the transmission that was slipping on the way to Carlisle 2006, when I noticed the car ws running very flat. I pulled the valve cover to find a badly worn camshaft.

It seemed the further I got into the job the more I found wrong. Original hoses from 1977, bad gaskets, leaking front seals, you name it I had to replace it.

While I had the top end apart I went ahead and painted every part, and carefully put it all back together. It got a rebuilt distributor, all new gaskets, roller cam & lifters, new timing belt, exhaust manifold,and new valve cover. New muffler is coming soon.

That was late December, early January, and I then left the car sit until it was warm enough to work on. The car wsa outside and I couldn't work on the car in the freezing cold.

Today I went ahead and drained the oil, added clean oil, new filter and a bottle of engine flush, when I hears what sounded like knocking when cranking. I am currently going to pull the oil pan to check out the noise. Can't tell too much since the car has no exhaust & I can't hear it. Originally I was going to pull the oil pan to clean out the oil pan after I flushed the engine to get the coolant out of the engine oil after I pulled the head.

That leads me to now. The car is sitting in the driveway with the battery disconnected, with no oil. I also went ahead and did some minor body work to the badly rusted passenger door to get the car looking better. I am going to have to replace the door, but until then I'm just doing some patchwork to it.

I plan on posting some pictures of the car as she sits now, waiting for me to do more work. The Interior is partially apart so I can repaint the dash, and reinstall the steering wheel I have for the car. When it comes down to it I am getting the car ready for Carlisle, and do whatever it takes to get there safely.

Cookieboystoys · « **Reply #1 on:** April 07, 2008, 08:01:25 PM »

Go! Matt Go! Good Luck! and may it all go easy on ya

r4pinto · « **Reply #2 on:** April 07, 2008, 08:20:53 PM »

Thanks. I just hope I don't have to replace the rod & main bearings. If I do I'll not be a happy camper.

crazyhorse · « **Reply #3 on:** April 07, 2008, 08:57:14 PM »

This is an auto, right?
Check your flexplate, when they start to give up they sound JUST like a rod going. What happens is, they crack around the mounting flange, then wrinkle. The wrinkles start hitting the block shortly thereafter. Trust me, my Lil' Horse is sitting in the driveway for just that problem, for the second time.

r4pinto · « **Reply #4 on:** April 07, 2008, 09:24:27 PM »

Awesome tip man!!!! +1 for you.

Seriously though, I'll give that a check. What's the best way to check the flexplate with the transmission still in the car?

r4pinto · « **Reply #5 on:** April 07, 2008, 09:25:13 PM »

I should have stated, that yes it is an auto. C3 to be exact.

77turbopinto · « **Reply #6 on:** April 07, 2008, 09:26:51 PM »

Quote from: r4pinto on April 07, 2008, 09:24:27 PM

Awesome tip man!!!! +1 for you.

Seriously though, I'll give that a check. What's the best way to check the flexplate with the transmission still in the car?

Pull the starter.

Bill

crazyhorse · « **Reply #7 on:** April 07, 2008, 09:43:59 PM »

I shoulda added that you need to pull the starter & peer inside with a flashlight. You can reach the crank with a ratchet & turn the motor while looking.

r4pinto · « **Reply #8 on:** April 07, 2008, 10:15:46 PM »

Gotcha. I'll check that out tomorrow when I have the starter out to drop the oil pan to clean it out.

crazyhorse · « **Reply #9 on:** April 07, 2008, 10:19:27 PM »

Then your life just got easier. with the oilpan off you can see nealy a third of the flexplate easily.

Just for S&G with CLEAN hands grab the rods & see if there's any play. Just to rule out the worst case.

r4pinto · « **Reply #10 on:** April 07, 2008, 10:30:25 PM »

Gotcha. Thanks for the tips. Do the rods need to be on any certain stroke, and how much play is acceptable?

r4pinto · « **Reply #11 on:** April 07, 2008, 11:35:56 PM »

I looked at my post & it didn't make much sense to me. What I meant was do the rods need to be at the bottom or top of the crank journals?

crazyhorse · « **Reply #12 on:** April 08, 2008, 12:36:57 PM »

If there's any play in the rods, it'll be apparent at any part of the stroke. Grab 'em & give a firm shake.

r4pinto · « **Reply #13 on:** April 08, 2008, 02:01:41 PM »

DAMMIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THAT"S WHAT I WAS AFRAID OF!!!

OK, 'nuff yelling. I pulled the pan, lots of sludge on the bottom from the engine flush, no big deal. What is though is the fact that the rods do have play down there, not much but enough to concern me.

BTW, I didn't notice anything out of the ordinary with the flexplate aside from some ground teeth. When The tranny gets pulled I'll be replacing the flexplate. I just have a bad feeling about it.

As for the rest of the car, the floor is beyond trashed so it's gonna need major floor repair. Gotta figure out how to get a donor pan for it since it's pretty bad. The actual body of the car is is pretty good shape for a 30 year old car. The passenger front fender was replaced cuz it had a dent in it & I had a spare. Both front doors were rotted at the corner. As for the back half of the car, it's suprizingly good. It's got a few places that'll need patched, but overall they are in great shape. Wish I coulda gotten the patch panel for the quarter panel that was on ebay. It went for cheap on there but I had ZERO cash then.

r4pinto · « **Reply #14 on:** April 08, 2008, 02:16:57 PM »

The picture gets grimmer.... I just pulled a main bearing cap since I already knew I was gonna have to drop the crank, and I saw the main bearings are shot. Worn down to the bronze, or brass or whatever it is, I don't care right now.... At the moment I've found I gotta get new rod & main bearings, and am deciding whether or not to pull the head & rering it while the crank is out. s for the flexplate, now I don't know if I will replace it or not. We'll see.

crazyhorse · « **Reply #15 on:** April 08, 2008, 02:21:58 PM »

DANG Matt, that sux. Sounds like a rebuild is in order. I wish I were closer, I'd gladly lend a hand with it.

77turbopinto · « **Reply #16 on:** April 08, 2008, 02:52:58 PM »

Sorry to hear that Matt. If we were closer I would bring over one of my spare running engines and help you put it in.

Bill

r4pinto · « **Reply #17 on:** April 08, 2008, 03:38:13 PM »

Thanks for your support guys. Fortunately I got the crankshaft from the engine I was rebuilding and it's in great shape. It came out of an engine with only 80k miles so I'll use that one & get some bearings for it. It'll be a pain to do in the car but better to do it now than end up dead on the side of the road.

crazyhorse · « **Reply #18 on:** April 08, 2008, 03:59:04 PM »

Ok, NOW I'm intrigued!

How ya gonna get the crank out with the engine in the car?

No, wait, better yet, beg, borrow or steal a camera, & post a how-to!

Teach me young one.

77turbopinto · « **Reply #19 on:** April 08, 2008, 04:11:38 PM »

Quote from: crazyhorse on April 08, 2008, 03:59:04 PM

Ok, NOW I'm intrigued!

How ya gonna get the crank out with the engine in the car?

No, wait, better yet, beg, borrow or steal a camera, & post a how-to!

Teach me young one.

I did that job on my Rabbit GTI racecar, no big deal. I did not have an engine hoist at the time.

Bill

pintosopher · « **Reply #20 on:** April 08, 2008, 04:44:23 PM »

77 Turbo Pinto.
I too would like to know just how this is possible in the Pinto without lifting the engine. There's that dang cross member right in the way! BTW, I have a 1984 Rabbit GTI and it is possible in that and many other Front wheel drive cars. Apples & Oranges

Pintosopher

77turbopinto · « **Reply #21 on:** April 08, 2008, 05:31:32 PM »

I have replaced the rear main seal on more than one Pinto engine with the engine still in the car. If that can be done I can't see why you could not change out the crankshaft. It would not be the best way, or easy, but I am sure it could be done.

BTW: I never said that the engine did not have to be lifted.

Depending on how the crank looked I would just slide in the bearings.

Bill

r4pinto · « **Reply #22 on:** April 08, 2008, 07:00:40 PM »

It looks to be easy enough, and difficult at the same time. I'm going to pull the transmission anyways, so changing the crank won't be too hard.

r4pinto · « **Reply #23 on:** April 08, 2008, 09:11:15 PM »

I probably shoulda mentioned I'm swapping out the crank since there is some noticeable wear from what I could see on the main cap I took off. I wish I had a micrometer so I could check the journals to make sure they are within specs. Might just go & get one.

r4pinto · « **Reply #24 on:** April 09, 2008, 07:57:22 PM »

Update.....

Today I took out the radiator, removed the timing belt, and the rear timing cover. I am going to wait until after I have the transmission pulled to remove the front seal holder. As long as it doesn't rain I'll be able to get the transmission out of the car.

Aside teardown of the front of the engine I also got some minor body work done to the fender and a couple rust spots on the door. Two spots down, about 20 to go. This is just temporary until I can afford to get a replacement door, and that'll be after Carlisle.

Pics to come soon.

r4pinto · « **Reply #25 on:** April 09, 2008, 11:50:06 PM »

Well, at about 9 pm I was bored so I took the 1977 cars Motor repair book to the garage and checked the specs for the oil pump. It shocked me to see it's in specs by about .003". With that in mind I have the oil pump soaking in cleaner overnight- parts soaking out of the housing that is- so tomorrow I can reassemble the pump and get it all lubed up and ready to reinstall in the engine. Figured while I had it apart to clean the crud out of it after flushing the engine I might as well be safe & check the clearances. The pickup tube will get cleaned out then bolted back on the pump. I tell ya, this car will probably run almost as good as it did when new.

While I've got the cooling system drained I'm gonna remove the valve cover and make sure there's nothing wrong under there. If I have any bad lifters I have some known good lifters ready to be installed.

More to come later.

r4pinto · « **Reply #26 on:** April 10, 2008, 08:16:40 PM »

Ground down quite a bit of the rust on the passender side door, and also finished filling and sanding the RF fender. I just have to do some finish work to the fender so I can get it primed and painted to match the other fender. On the A pillars there is a bulge on the top of each and I'm working to get that fixed. To be honest I can't believe how much I've gotten done on the body. The door may be temporarily fixed since it's rusted through but atleast it'll look better for Carlisle.

Tomorrow if all goes according to plan I'm going to remove the cam from the head so I can clean it up really good to make sure there's no metal shavings.

r4pinto · « **Reply #27 on:** April 12, 2008, 02:32:00 PM »

It just keeps getting worse... As I originally planned I couldn't get the cam pulled form the head yesturday since it rained onn & off all day. I did do a good soaking of the oil pump so I could inspect it better.

Today I finished cleaning the pump and saw more rotten news. While the pumps clearances are within specs there are some grooves worn in the side of the pump housing. At this point I now have to find a pump as I don't want to chance losing the engine over a $20 oil pump. I don't really have the money for a replacement pump but if I put the oil pump back in the engine it will fail with the way my luck has been going.

I took some pictures of the car as she sits and will get them posted soon.

77turbopinto · « **Reply #28 on:** April 12, 2008, 02:36:08 PM »

I just pulled apart a 2.3 for the pan and pick-up. It was a running engine with good oil pressure. PM me your address and I will send you the pump for free (I will pay shipping too).

Bill

r4pinto · « **Reply #29 on:** April 12, 2008, 02:44:49 PM »

PM sent.

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Author Topic: 1977 Pinto- project in the works (Read 28936 times)