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Author Topic: 5spd. & T-5 Install/Swap Information  (Read 20235 times)

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Offline 77turbopinto

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5spd. & T-5 Install/Swap Information
« on: February 27, 2006, 11:32:28 AM »
General info:

There have been many posts related to installing a 5spd in a Pinto. I am posting general information on this topic in hope to have people understand that just because you install an O/D gear (5th) does not mean you will be able to use it.

There are at least three reasons someone would want to do this swap: Better Mileage, Better Performance, A More Durable Tranny.

I have done two 5spd. swaps, but both of them wereT-5s into 2.3T EFI cars. This is not to say that it can’t be done with a stock ‘Pinto’ engines, or other 5spds, but MANY factors need to be addressed that I will discus.


Bill
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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #1 on: February 27, 2006, 02:18:29 PM »
The Tranny mount uses the same mount only the hole needs to be elongated about 3/4" ( forward)to accept the Trans rubber biscuit stud to bolt to the mounting bracket.
Brad F
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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #2 on: April 06, 2006, 12:32:12 PM »
I got the t-5 in last night.

TP72, I did something like that, but I used the T/C mount and slotted the holes on the top of the mount as well as the bracket. I also cut the exhaust hanger bracket to mount below the 'mount'.

I still need to wire the plug, and make a filler for the rear of the shifter hole. I found that if you turn the stock shifter boot 90*, the boot mount bolts will clear the tranny. To be able to use the stock boot after I modified the t/c shifter. At the bottom of the knob threads, the shaft gets bigger, so I used the grinder to remove that larger area below the threads and above the elbows. This will let the boot go down far enough to use, and look good. I nee to find my t/c knob as the into one will not fit on the t/c shifter.

The t-5 shifter was about 1" forward in the stock hole, but to make room for it to come through, I needed to cut the hole a little farther forward than that.

The pinto a/t speedo cable will fit into the t-5, but you need to use the t/5 gear. Also, a C4 or T-5 yoke will work, they seem to be the same.

I found it helpful to install the (d9) bell, then bolt the tranny to it.

Not much room in there, I never want to even try a c6.

Bill
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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #3 on: April 06, 2006, 02:15:32 PM »
FYI, I saw in one of my Mustang magazines that someone is making a adjustable shifter now.  I forget the brand, but this design allows you to compensate for the 1" difference.  It looked pretty trick.  I will dig thru my pile of magazines and see if I can find it.  I was thinking of looking into it anyway as my 73 has a t5 in it and I tend to have to lean forward to shift into 1st, 3rd, and 5th.  It is slightly uncomfortable for me where it is now. 
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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #4 on: April 08, 2006, 08:24:21 AM »
I installed the new carpet last night, I hate aftermarket ones with no pre-cut holes. I got it in ok, and was able to use a stock pinto shifter boot (I made a filler for the rear of the shifter hole). The interior is now all black and almost done. I still need to work on a few more details.

The 2.79's are still in the rear, and just by moving the car in the garage I can tell I need to swap them soon.

I have the underdash a/c-heater box from an a/c car to give me room for the turbo. The a/c controls are in the console, and the a/c console is 2" closer to the shifter than the non-a/c one. With the t-5 shifter further forward, I modified a non-a/c console to mount the a/c-heater controls. I could have just put them up in the center of the dash, but without the a/c, I like the extra vents.

Bill



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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2006, 08:56:53 PM »
Took the car out today, what a blast. Still need to change the rear gears, the 2.79's will not do. The good news is that in theory my top speed before the rev. limiter hits is about 200MPH!

Bill
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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #6 on: April 12, 2006, 11:00:40 AM »
I have done the swap in my 80 wagon,It's almost a bolt in.On mine we used an svo trans.this uses the rear pull cable so you have to cut a notch in the crossmember and weld a piece of tubing cut in half lenghwise forming a channell for the cable to run through.this is the most diffucult part and it's simple.the next thing you need is the trans mount for the mustang,mines 86.This will bolt to the pinto crossmember its a perfect fit allmost as if it was planned.next you need the front yoke from the mustang and if your lucky a drive line from a 78 LTD with the auto,another perfect fit.plug in your speedo,wire in your backup light and thats about it your shiftin 5. as for the shifter it pops up through toe hole a little forward but you dont have to cut it,allthough the front 2 bolts on the shifter are fun. Hope this helps.Doc
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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #7 on: July 11, 2006, 07:53:50 AM »
So reading this I should be able to bolt a Pinto 4 speed bellhousing from a 2.3 to a T5 and everything else hooks up just like normal then?  I just scored the 2.3 turbo T5 for my EFI conversion and I am getting the new clutch setup this week to bolt it all together.

Jake
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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #8 on: July 11, 2006, 11:06:59 AM »
My 79 Pinto had a D9 bell in it, as did an old Pinto Mini-Stocker I was given. I have seen posts that Pintos NEVER had the D9 bells from the factory, so I don't know what to tell you. I can say that the D9 bell fits the t-5, and it bolts from outside the bell.  If you have the bellcrank style bell it will work if you notch out a section of the crossmember.

Bill
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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #9 on: July 11, 2006, 11:11:29 AM »
I have the cable pull style bell.  I was to understand this is the way my 74 would have came if it was a factory manual.  Its an automatic right now although all that is coming out for the SVO-T5 swap.

Jake
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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #10 on: July 12, 2006, 11:42:45 AM »
That D9 bell (1979) is most likely a part that was made for the then new 1979 fox body mustang.  May have been changed for clearance in the mustang and ford went with the new casting since it was cheaper than running another casting for a car they knew they were gonna phase out the next year.

I have also heard some of the earlier bells will fit a t5 if you have the center hole (for throwout bearing shaft) machined a little larger to fit the t5.  Theres a webpage for a fellow who I beleive is running a spitfire with a swapped in ford 2.8 v6.  Says he got a 4 spd mustang II bellhousing and machined the center hole a little larger and it was a perfect fit on the t5.

-Harry

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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #11 on: July 12, 2006, 11:54:30 AM »
Harry,

  Thanks for the heads up.  I should be getting into this over the weekend and then I will find out.

Jake
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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #12 on: July 15, 2006, 12:16:18 PM »
...I have also heard some of the earlier bells will fit a t5 if you have the center hole (for throwout bearing shaft) machined a little larger to fit the t5.  Theres a webpage for a fellow who I beleive is running a spitfire with a swapped in ford 2.8 v6.  Says he got a 4 spd mustang II bellhousing and machined the center hole a little larger and it was a perfect fit on the t5.

-Harry

The bell bolts from the other side and from looking at both, the bolt pattern is different. This would require moving the holes and having to put them in almost PERFECT alignment. Much easier to notch the crossmember and use a very easy to find "bellcrank" bell.

Bill
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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #13 on: July 15, 2006, 12:34:45 PM »
Well I can say as of right now since I just put the two together to verify it that a early 2.3 bell will not work with the T5.  The bell to transmission pattern is completely different as well as the bolt pattern for the early 2.3 bell to 2.3 turbo motor.  So forget the 4 speed 2.3 bell for that conversion.  I ended up just putting the bell crank bell on it.

Jake
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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #14 on: July 15, 2006, 12:44:58 PM »

...The bell to transmission pattern is completely different as well as the bolt pattern for the early 2.3 bell to 2.3 turbo motor... 


?

Bill
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My new answering machine message:   
"I am not available right now, but thank you for caring enough to call.
I am making some changes in my life.  Please leave a message after the beep.
If I do not return your call, you are one of the changes."

Offline Gaslight

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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #16 on: July 15, 2006, 01:10:48 PM »
Does this help?

Jake
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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #17 on: July 15, 2006, 05:15:39 PM »
I give 1-UP for the bell-house photo.

Offline 77turbopinto

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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #18 on: July 15, 2006, 10:46:06 PM »
Jake: My "?" was about the bell to engine bolt pattern part; I thought you were impling that it would not fit the 2.3T, not just pointing out the use of 2 different holes on the 2.3 block.

Good photo.

One side note on using the D9 bell; The upper right side tranny to engine bolt will not go in unless it is cut or you dent the firewall.

Bill
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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #19 on: July 15, 2006, 11:25:49 PM »
Jake: My "?" was about the bell to engine bolt pattern part; I thought you were impling that it would not fit the 2.3T, not just pointing out the use of 2 different holes on the 2.3 block.

Good photo.

[font=Verdana]One side note on using the D9 bell; The upper right side tranny to engine bolt will not go in unless it is cut or you dent the firewall.[/font]

Bill
Hey Bill,
 The T9 transmission works GREAT on the early Pinto. ;D
 It may be weak but it is the easy street to a 5th gear.
 The T9 and the Hummer is the same transmission case with a 5 gear pod added to the rear of the case.
From Pintony

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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #20 on: July 16, 2006, 08:06:32 AM »
Well now I get your "?" reply.  The only thing I meant to say that the early bell would not bolt up to was the 5 speed trans not the engine.

Jake
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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #21 on: July 16, 2006, 10:31:09 AM »
Tony: That bolt would not go in on my car until I shortened it, even flexing the engine down, and I dropped my engine down a bit when I installed it. It is all in there now, but if I need to remove it, I will pull the tranny off the bell first.

A side note to the side note: I think that would be an issue with any bell using the upper holes.

Bill
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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #22 on: July 29, 2006, 07:56:54 AM »
  I am in the middle of the 2.3 turbo 5 speed swap.  Thought I would share a few small details that I could not locate anywhere.  The flywheel to crank bolts are still available through Ford parts but not the clutch cover (pressure plate) to flywheel.  I am using a flywheel that came from an 88 turbo T-bird and I have been told they should be SAE but a few but this one is metric.  The 6 bolts needed are M8 X 1.25 X 16 mm long.  ARP shows not listing for this application but on Monday i will have a number from ARP that will allow this exact bolt to be ordered normal.  Hope this helps anyone else.

Jake
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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #24 on: March 01, 2007, 09:04:33 AM »
More bell details.

From what I have found, all fox body stangs 83ish and later, and earlier T/C's use a 'bell crank' style arrangement on the fork. This can work for a Pinto with notching the crossmember. The early foxes (79-82ish) had a strait pull like the Mustang II with the B/W trannies. The 87/88 T/C's have a hyd. clutch and the bell and actuators will not work without MAJOR modifications to the car and parts.

Mustang II's used the B/W 4spd trannys, so a "D4" and "D5" bell are out there and will work on a T-5.

Also, the D9 bell that was in my donor car had a 'D5' arm installed. Yes, it will "work" but it is not correct (I will be swapping it out soon).

The D9 fork will not work with a stock Pinto cable without minor modifications because the "ball" at the tranny side of the Pinto cable is too small. The Pinto cable will fit the bell-crank style with no problems (I know this because I cut up a bell-crank one to modify my 'D9').


Bill
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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #25 on: March 10, 2007, 09:48:58 PM »
Hey Bill,
 The T9 transmission works GREAT on the early Pinto. ;D
 It may be weak but it is the easy street to a 5th gear.
 The T9 and the Hummer is the same transmission case with a 5 gear pod added to the rear of the case.
From Pintony

Whats a Hummer??  Is a T-9 what was used in the later '80's 2.3 Mustangs?
Also, I found a 1986 Turbo Coupe 5 speed that I am considering buying; What kind of trans and clutch setup would that car have?
mike

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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #26 on: March 10, 2007, 10:36:09 PM »
The Hummer is the name (maybe not by Ford) of the 4spd that was used by Ford in all the Pintos that had a M/T.

Like Tony said, the T-9 is basicly Hummer 4spd with an overdrive added to it, kind of like the B/W 4spds used in the Musang II's having the O/D added and it became the T-5.

The 86 T/C M/T cars came with the T-5, bell crank style bell, and a larger diameter clutch than a Pinto.

The T-5 is FAR better than a T-9, but if you don't (or the last owners) slam it around, the T-9 should be fine.

Use the clutch and flywheel for the bell and fork that you use. If you don't, you might need to work on the pivit for the fork.

Bill
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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #27 on: March 23, 2007, 07:48:31 AM »
As I mentioned in a TurboFord thread, I had used a D5 fork in a D9 bell. I have swapped it out and it operates much better.

Due to my use of the stock Pinto shifter boot, I needed to remove the carpet to pull the shifter off when I dropped the tranny. While I had it out, I made a modification to the shifter handle. Now, it is in a better location and will not put the stress on the Pinto boot. I will get a photo of it fully installed.

Sorry for the bad photo.

Please note the section that was removed from the handle is between the stock and modified parts, and that the collar below the threaded area has been re-worked too, to let the boot slide further down. I did not cut the threaded area, so I have a small section of fuel hose to take up the short space between the knob and boot.
 
Bill
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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #28 on: August 02, 2007, 07:56:28 PM »
The bell bolts from the other side and from looking at both, the bolt pattern is different. This would require moving the holes and having to put them in almost PERFECT alignment. Much easier to notch the crossmember and use a very easy to find "bellcrank" bell.

Bill

I just finished my T5 swap into a 74 runabout. I used the bellcrank style bellhousing, shortened the driveshaft by 1-3/8". There is no need to cut a notch in the crossmember. I simply made a new bracket above the existing cable hole in the bellhousing, bent it at a slight angle so the cable lines up to the attachment point on the bellcrank. Works just fine, no binding. I used a clutch from a 92 Mustang and drilled new holes in the crossmember for the 92 Mustang tranny mount.
You can see pics at www.musicbythe bay.com/pinto

Joe (Pangra74)
1974 Orange Runabout
1974 soon to be Cruisin' Wagon

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Re: T-5 5spd. Install/Swap Information.
« Reply #29 on: August 02, 2007, 08:01:46 PM »
I have done the swap in my 80 wagon,It's almost a bolt in.On mine we used an svo trans.this uses the rear pull cable so you have to cut a notch in the crossmember and weld a piece of tubing cut in half lenghwise forming a channell for the cable to run through.this is the most diffucult part and it's simple.the next thing you need is the trans mount for the mustang,mines 86.This will bolt to the pinto crossmember its a perfect fit allmost as if it was planned.next you need the front yoke from the mustang and if your lucky a drive line from a 78 LTD with the auto,another perfect fit.plug in your speedo,wire in your backup light and thats about it your shiftin 5. as for the shifter it pops up through toe hole a little forward but you dont have to cut it,allthough the front 2 bolts on the shifter are fun. Hope this helps.Doc



I just finished my T5 swap into a 74 runabout. I used the bellcrank style bellhousing, shortened the driveshaft by 1-3/8". There is no need to cut a notch in the crossmember. I simply made a new bracket above the existing cable hole in the bellhousing, bent it at a slight angle so the cable lines up to the attachment point on the bellcrank. Works just fine, no binding. I used a clutch from a 92 Mustang and drilled new holes in the crossmember for the 92 Mustang tranny mount.
You can see pics at www.musicbythe bay.com/pinto

Joe (Pangra74)
1974 Orange Runabout
1974 soon to be Cruisin' Wagon


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