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Author Topic: Taking the turbo plunge!  (Read 64035 times)

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Offline Wittsend

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #30 on: February 09, 2015, 09:56:45 PM »
The Mustang SVOs only had one scoop. On top of that, is was position on the hood such that above 50-60mph it would start pulling hot air out of the engine bay and through the intercooler..a nd the red-hot turbo parts are right below that. At least that's what the legend states.

Yea, one of these days I should use the Man-O-Meter test http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/u-tube-manometer-d_611.html to see "which way the wind blows." Hey, I've got a Indoor/outdoor thermometer sitting on my desk so I can check efficiency too. If nothing else I can claim the scoop is a vent for when I'm parked at idling.

Offline dianne

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #31 on: February 10, 2015, 07:47:04 AM »
Yea, one of these days I should use the Man-O-Meter test http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/u-tube-manometer-d_611.html to see "which way the wind blows." Hey, I've got a Indoor/outdoor thermometer sitting on my desk so I can check efficiency too. If nothing else I can claim the scoop is a vent for when I'm parked at idling.

I'm just at my wittsend right now ahahahaha

I've wanted to say that for awhile!
Vehicles:

- 1972 Plymouth Duster (To be a Pro Street)
- 1973 Ford Pinto wagon (registered ride 195)
- 1976 Mustang II mini-stock
- 1978 Mustang King Cobra II
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- 1986 Chevy K5 Blazer
- 1997 Suzuki Marauder

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Offline 76hotrodpinto

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #32 on: February 10, 2015, 10:12:40 AM »
I was very wary to click on anything labelled "manometer". I had been under the impression it was just a ruler! Ahem...
1976 half hatch 2.3 turbo w/t5.

Offline Wittsend

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #33 on: February 10, 2015, 11:58:02 AM »
Well, I sure don't want to give people the wrong impression, so here is a manometer (see first image). Basically it is a clear, U-shaped tube that is partially filled with water (often colored to see better). One end of the tube is run in the air stream (see second image - BTW, that is NOT me). As the air pressure increases it forces the water to rise in the tube. Typically there is some form of marking to denote the amount the water rises.  I also have seen the reverse where a vacuum is applied. Google images shows the manometer often being used to tune multi carburetor engines on motorcycles.

Offline Rebolting73

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #34 on: February 10, 2015, 10:30:17 PM »
When you hook up the manometer, make sure to also tape a bunch of yarn to the hood to look extra scientific.  Your scoop does have some wedge to it...if it has enough..maybe it qualifies as an actual NACA Duct?  Those Turbocoupe hoods had all that official looking plastic ducting hooked to them that made it seem like either engineering or marketing really thought they would be useful.  I like the way it looks, subtle yet dangerous.

Offline 76hotrodpinto

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #35 on: February 11, 2015, 10:53:01 PM »
I mangled up an injector today. Darn it all! I guess I'll just have some better ones now. So in the world of injectors for the tc setup, what are my best performing options?
1976 half hatch 2.3 turbo w/t5.

Offline 65ShelbyClone

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #36 on: February 12, 2015, 06:10:03 PM »
For a stock setup, stock or stock equivalent. Green-top injectors were stock for '83-85 engines, are low impedance, and flow 30lb/hr. '85.5-89 got "brown-top" injectors that flow 35lb/hr and are also low impedance.
'72 Runabout - 2.3T, T5, MegaSquirt-II, 8", 5-lugs, big brakes.
'68 Mustang - Built roller 302, Toploader, 9", etc.

Offline 76hotrodpinto

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #37 on: February 12, 2015, 10:04:35 PM »
I have the brown top ones on it. Should I get a new set, or just replace the broken one?
1976 half hatch 2.3 turbo w/t5.

Offline 65ShelbyClone

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #38 on: February 14, 2015, 11:24:26 AM »
Which part of the injector broke? The plastic cap on the spray end can be replaced if the pintle isn't damaged.

One problem with 2.3T injectors that is getting more common as they age is that the plastic starts to split on the feed side. The 2.3T performance crowd, being famous as cheapskates, will sometimes use them if they aren't leaking or too badly cracked, but I think $200 is money better spent  on new injectors than rebuilding a burned-down car.

I have several spares and, curiously, the early '85 parts aren't cracking, but the later ones are (which I think may be aftermarket).

 
'72 Runabout - 2.3T, T5, MegaSquirt-II, 8", 5-lugs, big brakes.
'68 Mustang - Built roller 302, Toploader, 9", etc.

Offline 76hotrodpinto

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #39 on: February 14, 2015, 11:37:23 AM »
I dropped the whole assembly, and bent the whole injector, maybe two of them. I'm looking at some ebay deals on another set. If I were to look beyond factory parts, what are some quality brands of aftermarket injectors?
1976 half hatch 2.3 turbo w/t5.

Offline 65ShelbyClone

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #40 on: February 14, 2015, 11:51:14 AM »
There are a lot of brands out there that are suitable and most of them just rebrand injectors from a smaller pool of manufacturers. GP Sorensen is a stock aftermarket supplier (I have some I pulled from a Merkur), Siemens, Bosch(OE), Hitachi(OE), Accel, Venom, etc. Even KEihin and Mikuni make injectors these days, but I don't think any of them are compatible with EV1 applications. That's the stock 2.3T injector series: EV1. EV3 injectors will drop in place, but have a skinny plastic body. EV6 is like EV3, but with an EV6/USCAR connector than can often be used with plug adapters. EV12 and EV14 are more common on much newer cars and are totally different.

Avoid no-name and/or unmarked Chinese bootlegs like the plague. If they ship from anywhere in China or are suspiciously cheap for new parts, avoid them.
'72 Runabout - 2.3T, T5, MegaSquirt-II, 8", 5-lugs, big brakes.
'68 Mustang - Built roller 302, Toploader, 9", etc.

Offline 76hotrodpinto

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #41 on: February 14, 2015, 12:41:58 PM »
I'm loving all this new stuff to learn! I find some similarities to running blowers, which I'm pretty good at setting up right. The fuel injection adds a layer I've never dealt with. Playing a whole new game of psi.
1976 half hatch 2.3 turbo w/t5.

Offline 65ShelbyClone

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #42 on: February 14, 2015, 08:04:24 PM »
I have also heard that high impedance injectors will work with a 2.3T computer, but no one bills it as a sure thing. As long as they stay open when the ECU starts limiting current during the injection pulse, they will hypothetically work.

Conversely, using low-impedance injectors with an ECU designed to run highs is bad news. It's a lot like running an old-style ignition coil without a ballast resistor.
'72 Runabout - 2.3T, T5, MegaSquirt-II, 8", 5-lugs, big brakes.
'68 Mustang - Built roller 302, Toploader, 9", etc.

Offline 76hotrodpinto

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #43 on: February 16, 2015, 02:04:00 AM »
I think I may have a cracked head! The one on the engine. I'm sending it in to get checked this week. It was running great, but I can't put it back on with any doubts. So much for the smooth sailing part.
1976 half hatch 2.3 turbo w/t5.

Offline Wittsend

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #44 on: February 16, 2015, 12:25:44 PM »
  It would be a surprise if you DIDN'T have a cracked (turbo) head.  Mine goes right through the valve seat. If it is leaking coolant, yea something needs to be done. Otherwise what I've read most people just run them. I'm still running mine.
  You might want to go over to NATO, The Ranger Station etc. and see what they have to say.  From my perspective the supply of Turbo Coupes are drying up.  I've seen one in the past two years and I make monthly trips to two self serve yards.  So, I'd like to know what head alternatives are going to become necessary in the future.

Offline dianne

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #45 on: February 16, 2015, 03:09:56 PM »
  It would be a surprise if you DIDN'T have a cracked (turbo) head.  Mine goes right through the valve seat. If it is leaking coolant, yea something needs to be done. Otherwise what I've read most people just run them. I'm still running mine.
  You might want to go over to NATO, The Ranger Station etc. and see what they have to say.  From my perspective the supply of Turbo Coupes are drying up.  I've seen one in the past two years and I make monthly trips to two self serve yards.  So, I'd like to know what head alternatives are going to become necessary in the future.

Wouldn't the EFI work?
Vehicles:

- 1972 Plymouth Duster (To be a Pro Street)
- 1973 Ford Pinto wagon (registered ride 195)
- 1976 Mustang II mini-stock
- 1978 Mustang King Cobra II
- 1979 Ford Pinto Runabout
- 1986 Chevy K5 Blazer
- 1997 Suzuki Marauder

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Offline Wittsend

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #46 on: February 16, 2015, 05:44:42 PM »
My understanding if that the exhaust valve and maybe the seat are designed to handle the turbo heat over a N/A head. Also, the combustion chamber is larger to handle the boost. Others may know the situation better than I.

Offline dianne

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #47 on: February 16, 2015, 07:00:54 PM »
My understanding if that the exhaust valve and maybe the seat are designed to handle the turbo heat over a N/A head. Also, the combustion chamber is larger to handle the boost. Others may know the situation better than I.

Oh, I thought they were the same. Maybe they can be built to handle it? Just a thought :)
Vehicles:

- 1972 Plymouth Duster (To be a Pro Street)
- 1973 Ford Pinto wagon (registered ride 195)
- 1976 Mustang II mini-stock
- 1978 Mustang King Cobra II
- 1979 Ford Pinto Runabout
- 1986 Chevy K5 Blazer
- 1997 Suzuki Marauder

FORD: Federal Ownership Respectfully Denied

Offline 65ShelbyClone

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #48 on: February 16, 2015, 10:50:51 PM »
Turbo heads have the same large chamber as the oval-port "pinto" 2.3 heads. Turbo heads got super alloy exhaust valves that are quite durable in this application, although one-piece stainless is generally a suitable replacement.  Inconel would be better IMO. The seats are cut into the head and are induction hardened like any other '80s-vintage production iron head. If you catch the cracks before they hit water, installing new seats typically stops things from getting worse.

Using a non-turbo head on a turbo engine will raise the compression from 8.0:1 to about 8.5:1 and make the engine more octane sensitive. Turbo 2.3s came with both larger chambers and dished pistons.
'72 Runabout - 2.3T, T5, MegaSquirt-II, 8", 5-lugs, big brakes.
'68 Mustang - Built roller 302, Toploader, 9", etc.

Offline dianne

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #49 on: February 17, 2015, 06:25:22 AM »
Turbo heads have the same large chamber as the oval-port "pinto" 2.3 heads. Turbo heads got super alloy exhaust valves that are quite durable in this application, although one-piece stainless is generally a suitable replacement.  Inconel would be better IMO. The seats are cut into the head and are induction hardened like any other '80s-vintage production iron head. If you catch the cracks before they hit water, installing new seats typically stops things from getting worse.

Using a non-turbo head on a turbo engine will raise the compression from 8.0:1 to about 8.5:1 and make the engine more octane sensitive. Turbo 2.3s came with both larger chambers and dished pistons.

What about the 2.3 EFI engines that came with the Fox bodies.
Vehicles:

- 1972 Plymouth Duster (To be a Pro Street)
- 1973 Ford Pinto wagon (registered ride 195)
- 1976 Mustang II mini-stock
- 1978 Mustang King Cobra II
- 1979 Ford Pinto Runabout
- 1986 Chevy K5 Blazer
- 1997 Suzuki Marauder

FORD: Federal Ownership Respectfully Denied

Offline 76hotrodpinto

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #50 on: February 17, 2015, 09:54:32 AM »
Is esslinger the only company casting fresh heads?
1976 half hatch 2.3 turbo w/t5.

Offline dennisofaz

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #51 on: February 17, 2015, 11:24:57 AM »
Hi Dianne,


If you want to go with a turbo you will need Forged pistons, not stock 2.3liter N/A pistons.  You can use the forged pistons with out a turbo for now, and add the turbo later.


Dennis

Offline 65ShelbyClone

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #52 on: February 17, 2015, 07:44:31 PM »
What about the 2.3 EFI engines that came with the Fox bodies.

They tend to break ring lands when turbocharged. The parts will hold ~200hp, but the slightest knock is likely to break a piston.

Factory turbo pistons by TRW have been obsolete for a long time too.  :(
'72 Runabout - 2.3T, T5, MegaSquirt-II, 8", 5-lugs, big brakes.
'68 Mustang - Built roller 302, Toploader, 9", etc.

Offline dianne

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #53 on: February 17, 2015, 08:05:53 PM »
They tend to break ring lands when turbocharged. The parts will hold ~200hp, but the slightest knock is likely to break a piston.

Factory turbo pistons by TRW have been obsolete for a long time too.  :(

Oh :(
Vehicles:

- 1972 Plymouth Duster (To be a Pro Street)
- 1973 Ford Pinto wagon (registered ride 195)
- 1976 Mustang II mini-stock
- 1978 Mustang King Cobra II
- 1979 Ford Pinto Runabout
- 1986 Chevy K5 Blazer
- 1997 Suzuki Marauder

FORD: Federal Ownership Respectfully Denied

Offline dianne

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #54 on: February 17, 2015, 08:07:01 PM »
Hi Dianne,

If you want to go with a turbo you will need Forged pistons, not stock 2.3liter N/A pistons.  You can use the forged pistons with out a turbo for now, and add the turbo later.

Dennis

I'm keeping it non-turbo. More of a driver and fun car and show car :) The Maverick will be the muscle car :D
Vehicles:

- 1972 Plymouth Duster (To be a Pro Street)
- 1973 Ford Pinto wagon (registered ride 195)
- 1976 Mustang II mini-stock
- 1978 Mustang King Cobra II
- 1979 Ford Pinto Runabout
- 1986 Chevy K5 Blazer
- 1997 Suzuki Marauder

FORD: Federal Ownership Respectfully Denied

Offline 76hotrodpinto

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #55 on: February 21, 2015, 12:39:33 PM »
Well that ones is cracked, not where I thought, but cracked. Not unusable though. I acquired 2 others to have checked, so I'll pick the best of the 3 and rebuild it. Puts me a little behind schedule, but what's new.

 Made a 2 1/2" stainless down pipe, and shaping a panel to replace battery tray area, to give turbo room. Going to have to pull that damned heater box... again! I'm thinking I might run a bead on all the seems I can reach while the motor is out. But that means racking it up, so I don't know, feeling kind of lazy about that.
1976 half hatch 2.3 turbo w/t5.

Offline dianne

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #56 on: February 21, 2015, 03:11:16 PM »
Well that ones is cracked, not where I thought, but cracked. Not unusable though. I acquired 2 others to have checked, so I'll pick the best of the 3 and rebuild it. Puts me a little behind schedule, but what's new.

 Made a 2 1/2" stainless down pipe, and shaping a panel to replace battery tray area, to give turbo room. Going to have to pull that damned heater box... again! I'm thinking I might run a bead on all the seems I can reach while the motor is out. But that means racking it up, so I don't know, feeling kind of lazy about that.

You found the turbo heads? Very cool! Now you have spares also!!!
Vehicles:

- 1972 Plymouth Duster (To be a Pro Street)
- 1973 Ford Pinto wagon (registered ride 195)
- 1976 Mustang II mini-stock
- 1978 Mustang King Cobra II
- 1979 Ford Pinto Runabout
- 1986 Chevy K5 Blazer
- 1997 Suzuki Marauder

FORD: Federal Ownership Respectfully Denied

Offline 76hotrodpinto

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #57 on: February 23, 2015, 09:50:03 AM »
You found the turbo heads? Very cool! Now you have spares also!!!

Craigslist is good to me. I have been finding more turbo motors and parts, than non-turbo. I came across a guy who was into racing turbo coupes, and now he's done. Got another rebuilt motor, a pile-o-parts and a whole 86 tc. Some svo stuff in the pile too. All for $1300. Should be enough crap to get going!
1976 half hatch 2.3 turbo w/t5.

Offline dianne

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #58 on: February 23, 2015, 10:15:27 AM »
Craigslist is good to me. I have been finding more turbo motors and parts, than non-turbo. I came across a guy who was into racing turbo coupes, and now he's done. Got another rebuilt motor, a pile-o-parts and a whole 86 tc. Some svo stuff in the pile too. All for $1300. Should be enough crap to get going!

That's awersome, I found my 2.3 EFI and transmission for only $300 and probably didn't even need a rebuild...

Not finding any roller Pintos or Fox bodies :(
Vehicles:

- 1972 Plymouth Duster (To be a Pro Street)
- 1973 Ford Pinto wagon (registered ride 195)
- 1976 Mustang II mini-stock
- 1978 Mustang King Cobra II
- 1979 Ford Pinto Runabout
- 1986 Chevy K5 Blazer
- 1997 Suzuki Marauder

FORD: Federal Ownership Respectfully Denied

Offline pinto_one

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Re: Taking the turbo plunge!
« Reply #59 on: February 23, 2015, 11:48:12 AM »
your getting there, I sent you a PM on the steps to install the engine and trans, you will be so happy when it is done , later Blaine :o
76 Pinto sedan V6 , 79 pinto cruiser wagon V6 soon to be diesel or 4.0